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Forums - Sony Discussion - How much money Sony really lost with the PS3

VGKing on 20 April 2013
Mr Puggsly said:
CGI-Quality said:
sidious164 said:

The ps3 was a failure. This is already known. Will probably sell more than the 360 which the sony fans claim is a victory, but they fail to realise that the ps3 cost sony billions and no profit, which makes it the ultimate failure.

Glass half empty perspective. On the other foot, to some, it must ache, just a tad, knowing that Sony's worst console will still outsell Microsoft's best.

Anyway, in regards to financials, no doubt the PS3 is a serious thorn in Sony's side. However, their current future looks far brighter than the pre-release days of the system, and with mistakes should come learning + improvment. So far, they're on the right track.

I don't think it aches nearly as much knowing Sony had to sacrifice billions of dollars just so it could out perform the 360. Sony essentially bought second place but won't taste it until next gen platforms are out. Now that is pitiful given the success of PS2.

If MS really cared for the 360 to stay ahead of PS3 they would have cut the price years ago.

Both Microsoft and Sony are focusing on making their consoles profitable in these late years. Sure, MS could have really undercut the PS3 if they wanted to, but but it doesn't make business sense. Sony actually increased the entry price of the PS3 from $249.99 to $269.99 with the Super Slim. So no, they didn't "buy second place". They just did everything in their power to make sure the platform they invested billions of dollars in has a healthy marketshare and 3rd party support. They succeeded. It was all smooth sailing for Sony after the PS3 Slim launch in 2009. If I understand correctly, that's when it started being profitable.



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Machiavellian on 20 April 2013
torok said:
CGI-Quality said:
Glass half empty perspective. On the other foot, to some, it must ache, just a tad, knowing that Sony's worst console will still outsell Microsoft's best.


Yes, that is even more interesting if we look at how bad they managed the PS3 launch and still came a year later. In the end, Sony's totally terrible management of the first 4 years of PS3 (price, launch date, PSN hack) will still beat the best effort MS ever made in consoles.

 

When you really look at it, its not that interesting.  Sony sold about 6 mill in Japan where MS does not have a  market.  That alone gives Sony a huge boost in global sells. Sony also sell in more markets then MS which is also a boost to their total global sells.  When the PS3 came out it always sold more than the 360 even with the higher price because of the PS brand.  The fact that Sony probably will take 2nd everybody pretty much stated that from the beginning.  The difference is that people stated it would be much sooner than 7 years.

If you look at it from MS perspective.  The first Xbox was a complete lost finiancially.  The 360 also started this way and also had its own troubles but MS was able to tripple the size of its install base.  Tripple the size of its online userbase.  Start to make a profit on each console and make quite a penny on it online services.  Take over 2 major markets from your competitior which is the US and UK.  Increase your market share in Europe and sell to other regions.  

So while the fanboys can thump their breast at getting 2nd place, as a product I am sure MS is very happy with what the 360 has done and it gives them a competitive chance to battle Sony PS brand without having to rush to market.

It seems people always takes this narrow view that who sales the most console is the winner but in reality, its a much longer war.  I am sure a company wants to continue to move forward than go one step forward then 2 steps behind only to have to play catch up again.



PlaystaionGamer on 20 April 2013
Mr Puggsly said:
PlaystaionGamer said:
sidious164 said:

The ps3 was a failure. This is already known. Will probably sell more than the 360 which the sony fans claim is a victory, but they fail to realise that the ps3 cost sony billions and no profit, which makes it the ultimate failure.


from a gamers perspective it wasnt. sony but out more and the best exclusives duruing this gen. 

Gamers perspectives don't pay the bills.

Also Sony didn't put out the best exclusives. Gears and Halo were published by MS.

ha cute.



DigitalDevilSummoner on 20 April 2013
DirtyP2002 said:

So the comeback of the PS3 never really happened.

Yeah, it never happened -past tense-, it is happening.

If the PS3 never made a comeback, it wouldn't be here.

rocky.jpg



VGKing on 20 April 2013
NobleTeam360 said:

Based on some people's definition of a comeback then I guess the Xbox had the biggest comeback ever. JK or am I?

The Xbox never had a comback. It was completely dominated by the PS2.

Mr Puggsly said:
trunks said:
Without the PS3, Sony wouldnt have won the High definition optical disc format war. Now they make money off every Blu-Ray disk sold thanks to PS3.

Did they anticipate Bluray would be as big as DVD? Because that isn't gonna happen. Physical movie sales have declined significantly since 2006.

They won a war much of market has moved away from. Hence, much of money went as well.

 

Blu-Ray is the standard and only HD movie format today and will be for many many more years. *Goes to research DVD and Blu-Ray sales*

From what I can find, Blu-Ray sales are increasing while DVD sales are declining. The last figure I found put Blu-Ray sales for 2011 at $2billion while DVD at $6billion and Digital Downloading is at about $1billion. As more people have HDTVs and as more people get Blu-Ray players into their homes(like the Xbox 720) Blu-Ray sales will eventually eclipse DVD to bcome the lead format. Of course, digital sales are also increasing and those will one day overtake Blu-Ray, but they will never replace it. Physical media is here to stay and it will for be for at least a few more decades.

 



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Max King of the Wild on 20 April 2013
Machiavellian said:
torok said:
CGI-Quality said:
Glass half empty perspective. On the other foot, to some, it must ache, just a tad, knowing that Sony's worst console will still outsell Microsoft's best.


Yes, that is even more interesting if we look at how bad they managed the PS3 launch and still came a year later. In the end, Sony's totally terrible management of the first 4 years of PS3 (price, launch date, PSN hack) will still beat the best effort MS ever made in consoles.

 

When you really look at it, its not that interesting.  Sony sold about 6 mill in Japan where MS does not have a  market.  That alone gives Sony a huge boost in global sells. Sony also sell in more markets then MS which is also a boost to their total global sells.  When the PS3 came out it always sold more than the 360 even with the higher price because of the PS brand.  The fact that Sony probably will take 2nd everybody pretty much stated that from the beginning.  The difference is that people stated it would be much sooner than 7 years.

If you look at it from MS perspective.  The first Xbox was a complete lost finiancially.  The 360 also started this way and also had its own troubles but MS was able to tripple the size of its install base.  Tripple the size of its online userbase.  Start to make a profit on each console and make quite a penny on it online services.  Take over 2 major markets from your competitior which is the US and UK.  Increase your market share in Europe and sell to other regions.  

So while the fanboys can thump their breast at getting 2nd place, as a product I am sure MS is very happy with what the 360 has done and it gives them a competitive chance to battle Sony PS brand without having to rush to market.

It seems people always takes this narrow view that who sales the most console is the winner but in reality, its a much longer war.  I am sure a company wants to continue to move forward than go one step forward then 2 steps behind only to have to play catch up again.

Yeah, lets take out Japan to favor MS. While we are at it lets take out US too because that favors MS... and hell... why not take out everything else because that favors one of the other too... That line of thinking is absolutely ridiculous. It isn't Sony's fault that MS can't gain traction in Japan. Just like its not MS' fault Sony didn't get as popular in the US.

Also, MS was out to take over the PS3. They even said thats what they were targeting at the begining of the gen. Sure 360 was a success and MS can be happy about it. However, they failed to obtain something they wanted. That has to be upsetting to some degree.



Viltsu300 on 20 April 2013
carlos710 said:
sidious164 said:

The ps3 was a failure. This is already known. Will probably sell more than the 360 which the sony fans claim is a victory, but they fail to realise that the ps3 cost sony billions and no profit, which makes it the ultimate failure.


PS3 has been close to destroy the whole PlayStation future.

Suuuuureeeee....



Viltsu300 on 20 April 2013
DigitalDevilSummoner said:
DirtyP2002 said:

So the comeback of the PS3 never really happened.

Yeah, it never happened -past tense-, it is happening.

If the PS3 never made a comeback, it wouldn't be here.

rocky.jpg


When PS3 did the comeback?



J_Allard on 20 April 2013
Max King of the Wild said:
Machiavellian said:
torok said:
CGI-Quality said:
Glass half empty perspective. On the other foot, to some, it must ache, just a tad, knowing that Sony's worst console will still outsell Microsoft's best.


Yes, that is even more interesting if we look at how bad they managed the PS3 launch and still came a year later. In the end, Sony's totally terrible management of the first 4 years of PS3 (price, launch date, PSN hack) will still beat the best effort MS ever made in consoles.

 

When you really look at it, its not that interesting.  Sony sold about 6 mill in Japan where MS does not have a  market.  That alone gives Sony a huge boost in global sells. Sony also sell in more markets then MS which is also a boost to their total global sells.  When the PS3 came out it always sold more than the 360 even with the higher price because of the PS brand.  The fact that Sony probably will take 2nd everybody pretty much stated that from the beginning.  The difference is that people stated it would be much sooner than 7 years.

If you look at it from MS perspective.  The first Xbox was a complete lost finiancially.  The 360 also started this way and also had its own troubles but MS was able to tripple the size of its install base.  Tripple the size of its online userbase.  Start to make a profit on each console and make quite a penny on it online services.  Take over 2 major markets from your competitior which is the US and UK.  Increase your market share in Europe and sell to other regions.  

So while the fanboys can thump their breast at getting 2nd place, as a product I am sure MS is very happy with what the 360 has done and it gives them a competitive chance to battle Sony PS brand without having to rush to market.

It seems people always takes this narrow view that who sales the most console is the winner but in reality, its a much longer war.  I am sure a company wants to continue to move forward than go one step forward then 2 steps behind only to have to play catch up again.

Yeah, lets take out Japan to favor MS. While we are at it lets take out US too because that favors MS... and hell... why not take out everything else because that favors one of the other too... That line of thinking is absolutely ridiculous. It isn't Sony's fault that MS can't gain traction in Japan. Just like its not MS' fault Sony didn't get as popular in the US.

Also, MS was out to take over the PS3. They even said thats what they were targeting at the begining of the gen. Sure 360 was a success and MS can be happy about it. However, they failed to obtain something they wanted. That has to be upsetting to some degree.

It's hilarious when people compare the advantage the 360 has in the US to the disadvantage the 360 has in Japan.

In Japan the 360 faces a huge cultural disadvantage right off the bat. In the US the 360 is not even the #1 console, a Japanese console is. Last gen the Xbox sold even less in Japan than the 360. Last gen you'd have to combine the GCN and Xbox US numbers together and then double them to reach what the PS2 did in the US. Yeah, they are entirely the same thing LOL.

Also, MS's goal was to stop Sony from taking over the living room with the Playstation. They have succeeded.



thismeintiel on 20 April 2013
Viltsu300 said:
DigitalDevilSummoner said:
DirtyP2002 said:

So the comeback of the PS3 never really happened.

Yeah, it never happened -past tense-, it is happening.

If the PS3 never made a comeback, it wouldn't be here.

rocky.jpg


When PS3 did the comeback?

It began in 2009 with the launch of the Slim, and is still happening today.  We'll have to wait til 2016-2017, when it stops selling, to judge the full scale of it.  My guess is that it's going to take an 8M deficit between it and the 360 and turn it into a 10M-20M advantage.