By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Nintendo - When will Nintendo wake up to the Wii U issues?

RolStoppable said:
Gamerace said:

The problem is you, and most everyone else, are comparing HD AAA games to AAA Wii games.   Wii games should be compared to PS2/GC/Xbox games because that is what the system is capable of.    Yes, there were a lot of crappy ports (Ghost Recon and HAWX spring to mind) even by those standards, but there were a lot of non-crappy ports which were as close as possible to their HD counterparts but still 'crappy' due to Wii's weak resources.  the Wii versions of Force Unleashed, Ghost Busters, Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands, OverLord, Lara Croft: Underworld, CoD:MW3 and many more would have been very well if not highly regarded in the sixth gen (heck CoD:MW3 Wii would have blown people's minds) but progressively as the seventh gen went on, could only been seen as 'weak' ports. 

Wii didn't get Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, Dragon's Age, Skyrim, Oblivion, Dead Space (a true Dead Space),  or some other 3rd party AAA games, but if it did, everyone would have called it a 'crappy' port no matter how much time, effort and money was put into it because it would never be, and could never be, as 'good' as the HD AAA versions.  Nor would they have had better success than CoD did.  In fact if CoD is the benchmark, it only sold 1m tops (excluding CoD3 launch title) and if Assassin's Creed sells half as well as CoD on HD consoles, a Wii version couldn't expect to exceed 500K.  Dead Space wouldn't be worth the effort at all.    The Wii version of a game could be better than 90% of PS2's games and still be a 'crappy' port.   By 2010 the HD consoles had set the bar so high that Wii couldn't possibly compete at what was now considered an AAA level.    Except for 'kiddie' Marios and Zeldas.

Your take on Prince of Persia validates this point.   It was a better game than the PS3/360 version.  THEY got the crappy port.  Yet Wii's version sold worst.

Most of the games you named here would have been laughed off as halfassed efforts in the sixth generation. The one game I played of those you mentioned is Tomb Raider: Underworld and if that is compared to the PS2 versions of Legend and Anniversary (which are 8/10 games), then it's still a bad game. Underworld on PS2/Wii is a 5/10 game at best, because it clearly fails to meet the standards of the previous two games. It's not the existence of Underworld on the HD consoles that makes the Wii's Underworld bad, the game is bad because it is bad.

But the original point was that third parties lost serious money on the Wii which cannot really be the case when the games we are talking about did cut corners, both in development and marketing costs. You try to pass off Modern Warfare 3 as a big effort when one month before the game's release Activision still hadn't even bothered to release screenshots. The reality is that MW3 on Wii was a budget game. Mid-range development costs for Wii standards with virtually zero money spent on marketing. 500k units is enough to pull in profits.

The real problem is that people, including you, too often pretend that the Wii got AAA games. AAA by definition means high end development costs for the platform in question, plus a good chunk of money spent on marketing (usually equal or greater than development costs). As soon as either one of these requirements is not met, it is not a AAA game. All of those Wii third party games you mentioned in your post are not AAA games and thus the level of sales needed to break even is way below the 1m mark. So when these games sold only around 500k or even only 250k (in case of ports from sixth gen games), they could still pull in profits.

Consider how many studios were closed due to failures in the seventh gen and how many of these closures happened due to Wii games. People are trying to tell you that publishers lost serious money on the Wii while the HD consoles were supposedly the sacred land for third parties, but it were 360/PS3 games that put the most developers out of business. So who or what are you going to believe? Those people or real events?

I have to admit the Wii version of Underworld was not great.  Anniversary was much better.

Wii did not get the same treatment as HD and I do contend that is because no matter how much effort was put into it, people would still call  a port of an HD game a 'poor' port.

Certainly, without question, Wii didn't get the sort of multi-million dollar game investments that the HD consoles did (which makes sense in a way because it doesn't cost that much to make a non-HD game).   And a lot of the marquee 3rd party games skipped Wii completely.

Regardless of whether you consider them AAA or not, there are absolutely clear cases of developers/publishers losing money on Wii games - and cases of those same publishers making a lot of money off Wii games. 

Absolutely, most of the blame for developers going under can be laid at the feet of HD development costs.  Lair, Haze, Darksiders II and others are notorious examples.  The closest example I can think of for Wii would be Blue Tongue's De Blob 2 but that was also on HD consoles.    Or DDI - who went broke making Ninjabread Man, Anabus II and other shovelware for Wii.  That's what Deduce must have been referring too!  Poor DDI.  DAMN Wii for causing you to go bankrupt.



 

Around the Network
Heavenly_King said:
think-man said:
Im beginning to think Nintendo's first partys are struggling with HD development.

Like most japanese developers this gen.   Why is hard for them to develop games in HD, I dunno.

Yeah...Now that you mention that it has been the case :/





Japanese Pop Culture Otaku

Didn't realise that DDI went bust, quite surprising tbh because those shovelware titles were seriously low budget efforts. Each would have made a profit after 100K sales, maybe even half that.



The Wii U got a new surge of games just this week

Lego City Undercover

Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate

Need for Speed - Most Wanted

Walking Dead - Survival Instinct

I think a few more perhaps worse than the new Walking Dead game as well.

Ignoring the "bad" offerings, there are 3 solid new games available on the system and some less demanding gamers might end up enjoyin the "bad" offerings as well.

That makes this article basically a month late... the issue existed as long as games weren't releasing but just like the other consoles got a hefty surge of quality titles in March, so too has the Wii U.

Nintendo also has the 3DS which has been solid for a while.



Around the Network
Conegamer said:
Whilst a price cut would boost sales, I don't think there's much they can do to speed up the development rates of the games which would produce a sub-par product.

They are doing stuff about it, as can be seen by the Nintendo Direct. But they need to do more. However, we likely won't see what until E3.

Presumably, the length of those development cycle is primarily due to the type of software they are trying to create, i.e. 3D Mario, Pikmin, Zelda, etc. In other words, Gamecube-esque games, but now in HD.

While I think one of the bigger mistakes Iwata made was in not reading the tea leaves and realizing that third-party support is simply not something he should have expected, let alone relied upon, the best time to fix that problem has passed. Since that's the case, in his shoes I would seriously consider either devoting fewer resources to these Gamecube-esque titles or going on an immediate hiring spree for new talent. I would direct the talent saved/acquired in this manner to try and focus on games that are both more mainstream and less resource-intensive. I'm thinking specifically of how hit titles like the language training games, Wii Fit, and especially Brain Age.

The Iwata Asks on Brain Age is especially relevant to this train of thought: he gave a small handful of developers extremely limited time and very few resources to come up with compelling software, and as a result they threw away most of their notions of what a videogame should be and instead focused on creating something that the public would demand, but which videogames had not yet catered to. The results speak for themselves. Admittedly I expect the bulk of these games to flop, or to be minor successes at best. But even one megahit would make the endeavor worthwhile, and in light of how gaming has largely retreated once more to its limited audience, I suspect such an approach would breed more than one success, and at a fraction of the time and cost, no less. Nintendo claims the Gamepad can lead to exciting new ways to play games: thsi would be a fantastic way to prove it.



snowdog said:
When will these journalists get half a clue..? The Wii U has had poor sales in January and February because it's had a software drought since Christmas.

We've got Monster Hunter, Need For Speed Most Wanted, Lego City Undercover, Pikmin 3, The Wonderful 101, Wii Fit, Game & Wario, Wind Waker HD, 3D Mario and Mario Kart 8 all arriving before Christmas and if Nintendo have any sense they'll cut the price by $50 in November to coincide with the launches of those last two titles.

The Wii U is going to have an installed userbase between 10m and 15m before the end of this year without a problem.

Indeed.

Also, don't forget about Dragon Quest 10, WiiU Party, Pokemon Rumble with NFC, plus multiplats like AC4, Rayman, RE Revelations, Watchogs, Disney Infinity, Skylanders, COD, Just Dance, and unannounced stuff, both 1st and 3rd party (Iwata confirmed they have unannounced WiiU games set to release this year). Oh, and wildcards like whatever Retro's working on.

It'll definitely be massive, while both Sony and MS's next systems will have a tiny library mostly consisting of unoptimized last-gen ports, games rushed to meet launch, and all the missing features, bugs and other troubles that come with a new system launch. And I suspect there'll be tons, because such things tend to increase as a system's complexity and features increase.

And all at a significantly higher price than WiiU. I think Nintendo won't need to cut its price, either. WiiU will be absolutely fine by year's end.



Nintendo Network ID: Cheebee   3DS Code: 2320 - 6113 - 9046

 

Do a PS3 Slim like redesign, drop the price to $199.99, release ONE SKU with Nintendoland and NSMB included. Instant success.



prayformojo said:
Do a PS3 Slim like redesign, drop the price to $199.99, release ONE SKU with Nintendoland and NSMB included. Instant success.

That would be suicidal, they'd be bleeding- no, GUSHING money at that price point.



Lets not forget that for the past couple of years the wii has lost it's shine. The wii started strong and was embraced by the masses, but eventually the fad wore off and the console was ultimately judged by gamers to be less than spectacular especially compared to its competitors.

The wii u launches and the mass market has already lost interest and the gamers, that never really embraced it, decided it just wasn't worth a purchase. I still think the wii u will do ok it just won't be what the wii was in terms of sales.