i feel the same way, somehow they managed to make us pay for something (live) making us beleive that it was not available in any other console. In microsoft defense i would say that they were the first ones to offer this service in a very useful way, but the fact that they started rising prices was plain insulting.

I couldn't agree more, that was more of a middle finger to me more than anything. I started to slowly progress into PC/Wii gaming because of it when my gold eventually ran out.

first off, you are getting way too defensive, calm down. If I didn't own a PS3,and owned a 360 would these be any less of points? I think not.

Back to the subject....

Sony gives away free stuff as well that does not require PS+, and thats not including two MMOs(DCU, and Free Realms) and Home which is one huge minigame park.

Live gives lots of sales just like PS+ gives sales, but PS+ sales are more agressively priced and overall stuff is cheaper due to points discrepency. The Demo thing is definitely a problem on Sony's side of things. Enough to make me think Live was better? probably not but def a plus.

There is no denying that MS pioneered quite a few of the marketplace trends, but the problem still stands that PSN has mostly caught up and in many ways is passing them.

The main question from the OP still comes down to MS has lost/is losing many of the things that gave them advantage this gen  . with PS4 appearing to have fixed every issue from this gen as far as accessibility and standards go

-720 wont have a 360 like head start which means they won't have an install base who is already too comfortable to move to another platform.

-Won't have more exclusive games, with PS having the more acclaimed ones right off the bat.

-Won't have any features PS4 isn't doing, or can't do, and PS4 will most likely have stuff  impossible for 720 to pull off with Gakai etc

-and then of course the RROD looming over their heads, the fact many gamers think they abandoned hardcore, etc, etc.

Does one just ignore these shortcoming going into Next Gen? Or is everyone on a completely clean slate going in?

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The 360 was not great at all. The xbox1 was and showed a huge effort on MS part to enter the industry. The 360 lacked alot of games moving through the gen with tired halo releases and Forzas. I really hope now that with MS spending lots of money opening new first party studios they will now release more new original IP's and give Halo a long break. If they show 4 or 5 new IPs at launch that's arnt just shooters and show that they plan to release lots of interesting and new IPs through the gen il buy the next box on launch like I did 1 and 350! That's my hope anyway.

I can never understand people who think the 360 was a solid platform but that's because I'm not them and I have different tastes. This goes for you 2 op. what I wrote is my opinion on why I hated the Xbox this gen. But looking forward I'm sure MS will change things up. Also obviously LIVE has to be free also for me to buy. I'm not paying for something Sony does the same if not better now.

yeah cause getting hacked and being down for a month is the better way. not to mention inferior everything online. la time i checked there are many psn games that still dont have any voice chat even though they have online component. also some games like mortal kombat 2 dont allow you to have a private match with people on your friends list... random matchmaking only. this kind of stuff is rediculous for an xbox live user

i like the fact xbox live costs money. people are less likely to screw around' cheat, hack and team kill when they are paying money to have an account. also skill based matchmaking doesnt work if accounts are free...

look at me, im level gazillion in this fps game and i feel like killing some newbs for a day, ill just open a free account and demolish everyone i get paired up and then go to my regular account tommorow... no thanks

Too bad people still find ways to show it off. 

The same way we can trust Nintendo and Sony after everything they did wrong in the 7th gen.

Asking a question like that on this site is not worth even taking serious. This site is owned by sony. MS did a great job of backing up their system. However PS3 fans all came in and voted.

You didn't even own 360, get off it!!!

Agreed, MS has done much to shake my condifence in them. Even though I have owned a 360 since 2005, I was never really crazy about the hardware. To me, the 360 was more of a means to simply play the third party games I could not get on Nintendo platforms.

Some of you are high on your own fumes....

"Sony has stated time and again, that they never paid for outright exclusivity. Beleive it or not, some business deals can be made without the exchanging of funds to persuade opinion. Sony simply talked a better game. Whether they do now is another question, as MS's raising of this standard might have forced their hand. The fact they refused to do so was part of their downfall this gen, remember?"

Where in this statement did I say anything about it being ethically wrong or right for Sony? Thats right, I didn't. I don't agree with Timed Exclusivity, Full is better. And originally, almost everything was a FULL exclusive, and they became timed after MS gave the companies money for them.....jesus you guys are like a flock of seagulls chiming the same toon.