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Forums - General Discussion - Shooting in Oregon mall!

Devil_Survivor on 13 December 2012
Max King of the Wild said:
Devil_Survivor said:
thismeintiel said:
Devil_Survivor said:
Here's what I say about this; countries with stricter gun laws have less gun deaths; so until the state and federal governments decide to stand up to the NRA and the gun lobby this will keep happening with a high frequency.

Care to explain Switzerland?


I would if you had explained what you mean extactly by saying just Switzerland. Do mean they have tough gun laws and still high gun crime?


No, virtually no gun laws with many people owning them and no gun violence. Also, there is a link earlier in threads that show UK gun violence increase as gun laws increase and gun violence decreasing as gun laws decrease. Also, Illinois is the last state to include conceal and carry law but Chicago is on the top of the list of gun violence

1.Maybe people in Switzerland arent as angry as people in U.S. and dont resort to guns to settle problems in their lives. I don't remember there being any mass shooting in Switzerland, so they dont need though laws and with the U.S. the opposite is true.

2.I'll look at study but, I already question the results of it because if add more guns to a sitution then logical the gun crime would go up not down.

3.Not sure how you think not having a conceal and care law would fix the problems in Chicago when its probably povety issue that causes all the crime there. 



 

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Devil_Survivor on 13 December 2012
killerzX said:
riderz13371 said:
"Want to drink a beer? ID Please."
"Want to purchase a gun? Will you be paying in cash?"

Amurica.


uh... thats not true. if an if a gun shop did that, they and you would be violating the law.

inorder to purchase a rifle, you havw to be 18. for a hand gun, you have to be 21.

oh yeah because gun show dealers never break the law right? Maybe we should look at underage people that got guns from gun shows like the Columbine shooters.



 

irstupid on 13 December 2012
weaveworld said:
Sad... just sad.

Second amendment kills people.


Most people killing other people with guns do not have a liscense for their gun.  

 

BTW when will this story move on to blame video games in some way?



irstupid on 13 December 2012
thismeintiel said:
I suppose none of the anti-gun people aren't going to explain why Vermont, a state with very lax guns laws, has one lowest number of gun homicides per capita in the US.


I also believe that Illionois with the strictest gun regulations has one of if not the highest gun related incidents/deaths/ect.

 

I'm not saying they coorlelate, cause obvioulsy if you have a lot of gun violence you will try to enforce stricter rules, and if you have no gun violence, you will not need to make them any tougher and could even lax them.

All this shows is that its not the rules that are the problem, its the people.  If Illinois and Vermont switched rules for a year, I bet the crime would stay the same.



Lafiel on 13 December 2012
irstupid said:
thismeintiel said:
I suppose none of the anti-gun people aren't going to explain why Vermont, a state with very lax guns laws, has one lowest number of gun homicides per capita in the US.


I also believe that Illionois with the strictest gun regulations has one of if not the highest gun related incidents/deaths/ect.

 

I'm not saying they coorlelate, cause obvioulsy if you have a lot of gun violence you will try to enforce stricter rules, and if you have no gun violence, you will not need to make them any tougher and could even lax them.

All this shows is that its not the rules that are the problem, its the people.  If Illinois and Vermont switched rules for a year, I bet the crime would stay the same.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state

maybe you should argue with facts and not with what you "believe"

the only stat in which Illinois is the highest is in "firearms, % of all murders" (~80%), which I interpret as that they'd better have less guns as guns play a role in almost every murder in Illinois



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Jumpin on 13 December 2012
Max King of the Wild said:
Jumpin said:
Gamegears said:
And yet wihout the Second Amendment.. Japan probably would have invaded us in WW2.. or Nazi's. because they were afraid of finding people carrying guns.. they did not even try it.. also without guns.. it would be almost impossible to protect yourself or your property in this day and age.. (Remember Criminals do not follow laws.. if they did.. they would not be criminals) And tests to make sure people are mentally able to carry guns won't work either.. remember even the most mentally competent person has their dark days.. and all it takes is one of those.. and you got another shooting..

Is THIS seriously what the American school system teaches you? Bwahahahahaha! =P

Just to educate you on the correct version of history: it was the US Navy + logistical reasons that prevented the US from being invaded. It's the same reason why the UK was not successfully invaded.

The UK was not successfully invaded because Hitler changed strageties and priorities after he was able to invade the UK for some reason

The "some reason" is better known as the English Channel. Combine that with the fact that Germany had too weak of an amphibious assault force despite having the superior air power.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Max King of the Wild on 13 December 2012
Devil_Survivor said:
ninetailschris said:
Max King of the Wild said:
Devil_Survivor said:
thismeintiel said:
 

 

 

 

 


How do you know he got it not legal?

http://www.daily-chronicle.com/2012/12/12/police-oregon-mall-shooter-used-stolen-rifle/ad65jqp/

Quick google search: oregon ma

Turns out he stole it.



Max King of the Wild on 13 December 2012
Lafiel said:
irstupid said:
thismeintiel said:
I suppose none of the anti-gun people aren't going to explain why Vermont, a state with very lax guns laws, has one lowest number of gun homicides per capita in the US.


I also believe that Illionois with the strictest gun regulations has one of if not the highest gun related incidents/deaths/ect.

 

I'm not saying they coorlelate, cause obvioulsy if you have a lot of gun violence you will try to enforce stricter rules, and if you have no gun violence, you will not need to make them any tougher and could even lax them.

All this shows is that its not the rules that are the problem, its the people.  If Illinois and Vermont switched rules for a year, I bet the crime would stay the same.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state

maybe you should argue with facts and not with what you "believe"

the only stat in which Illinois is the highest is in "firearms, % of all murders" (~80%), which I interpret as that they'd better have less guns as guns play a role in almost every murder in Illinois


Nice UK link... I love how the think Michigan looks. Anyway, do you know anything about Illinois? Like it's most of it's population is in the north-east? Chicago (Illinois) has taken the top spots in gang and gun violence in the recent years.

Anyway, that chart got their information from the FBI website, low and behold what do I find next to Illinois? " Limited supplemental homicide data were received." Which is the only state with that. So yes, compare full data to limited data. Good idea,

If I were to guess those Illinois numbers are for Chicago alone.

So what I found is the Chicago was number 2 in murder last year with New York taking the top spot. I know Chicago out paced it's last year totals so might end up number 1 if New York declines it's totals from what I read the trend in most US cities is a decline except in Chicago

Edit: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/02/chicago-murder-rate-surges-as-new-york-s-drops-to-record-low.html

Yup chicago is number 1 in murder this year. Beats new york which is 3 times chicagos size. Chicagos murder total passed last years in October.

 



Max King of the Wild on 13 December 2012

Earlier in this thread (or the other one) I commented there was a ridiculous amount of shootings over purto rican pride weekend in chicago. And I know there was but I think I used memorial day weekend numbers which were...

"More than 40 people were shot there on Memorial Day weekend alone, and 10 of them died"



the2real4mafol on 13 December 2012
killerzX said:
the2real4mafol said:
Max King of the Wild said:
the2real4mafol said:
Guns shouldn't be carried in public, they should be there for leisure only.

Even with conceal and carry permits there are still laws where guns are allowed. Any government buildings or schools.

Why would you carry a gun to school for?

unfortunately law abiding citizens cant, its against the law... but that didnt seem to stop the columbine shooter, virginia tech shooter, etc. but it did stop law abiding citizens from doing so.

the almost always a common theme among the mass shootings.... they all happen in "gun free" zones.

And you are saying it would be better if they had guns at the scene at that point? We are not perfect you know, as an innocent person is surely more likely to be killed if everyone carried a gun, everyone makes mistakes at times. Keeping guns away makes for a safer society



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