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Forums - Nintendo - Wii U specs are surprising, says Sonic developer, specifically the GPU and memory

lilbroex on 27 August 2012
Kynes said:
lilbroex said:
Kynes said:
lilbroex said:

The components that make up a gaming console are generally custom built with the first real exception to that being the XBox, then the 360 and PS3. They pretty much "are" desktops only with a different aesthetic design. Their chips were pretty much straight replica of existing chips.

Nintendo has always used completely custom built chips made specifically for there machines. This is no exception. People often talk of what the Wii U is based on internally giving references to things like the Power7 and 4850 but those are only bases.

The CPU and GPU in the Wii U are built to fit its specifications. Size is not a problem, nor is power.

That's not true, at all. X360 Xenon and Xenos aren't replicas of existing chips. Tell me the ATI equivalent to Xenos. Cell is as much custom as a chip can be. The only one that can be considered derived of a desktop chip is RSX, and even that chip has differences as an 128 GDDR3 bus instead of 256 bits in the desktop part, with half ROPs due to this half width memory controller, and an integrated XDR memory controller.


The Cell is a PowerPC derived chip that was primarily made by IBM. The Xenon was pretty much a copy and pasted X1800 with a few extra features.

Xenos (xenon is the proccesor) Is derived from the canceled R400. The X1800 has 16 pixel shaders and 8 vertex shaders. Xenos has 16x3 SIMD unified shaders. They can't be more different.


Reread my post. I knew you were going to go straight minute differences so I clarified it.



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Crono141 on 27 August 2012

I wonder if the 720 processor will be called Xenu?



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Kynes on 27 August 2012
Baron said:
Kynes said:
Take a look at the supposed size of the WiiU. You can't make a very powerful console with so low power requirement, I'm sure that Nintendo has done a good enough, very power optimized console (the EDRAM rumor hints to this) but it can't be several times more powerful than Xbox360 or PS3 with so tiny power profile.


We know nothing about the Wii U's power profile so I don't know why you bring that up? Size =/= power profile. Power profile is the total TDP of a console. Nintendo has always downsized their consoles along with a considerable step in power. Also, we've got 2 handhelds now that are easily capable of matching last gens hardware. The Vita is even almost as powerful as the 360 and PS3. The Wii U looks to offer a lot more room to hardware than the Vita.

As long as the casing offers sufficiënt cooling Nintendo can opt to put a GTX 680 and a i7 3960X in the Wii U. Off course that won't happen as it will make the console too expensive but size doesn't matter as much as you think

Size has everything to do with power profile and silence.



lilbroex on 27 August 2012
Crono141 said:
I wonder if the 720 processor will be called Xenu?


That is a question for a Microsoft thread in the microsoft sub forum.



FrancisNobleman on 27 August 2012

Graphically, the iPAd 3 already is in the same playground as the 360, although in a more humble form. And look at the size and power consumption of the thing.

You could fit an elephant inside the Wii U case.



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Kynes on 27 August 2012
lilbroex said:
Kynes said:
lilbroex said:
Kynes said:
lilbroex said:

The components that make up a gaming console are generally custom built with the first real exception to that being the XBox, then the 360 and PS3. They pretty much "are" desktops only with a different aesthetic design. Their chips were pretty much straight replica of existing chips.

Nintendo has always used completely custom built chips made specifically for there machines. This is no exception. People often talk of what the Wii U is based on internally giving references to things like the Power7 and 4850 but those are only bases.

The CPU and GPU in the Wii U are built to fit its specifications. Size is not a problem, nor is power.

That's not true, at all. X360 Xenon and Xenos aren't replicas of existing chips. Tell me the ATI equivalent to Xenos. Cell is as much custom as a chip can be. The only one that can be considered derived of a desktop chip is RSX, and even that chip has differences as an 128 GDDR3 bus instead of 256 bits in the desktop part, with half ROPs due to this half width memory controller, and an integrated XDR memory controller.


The Cell is a PowerPC derived chip that was primarily made by IBM. The Xenon was pretty much a copy and pasted X1800 with a few extra features.

Xenos (xenon is the proccesor) Is derived from the canceled R400. The X1800 has 16 pixel shaders and 8 vertex shaders. Xenos has 16x3 SIMD unified shaders. They can't be more different.


Reread my post. I knew you were going to go straight for nitpickings so I clarified it.


Unified shaders != pixel and vertex shaders. It's not nitpicking, is a huge difference.



HappySqurriel on 27 August 2012
lilbroex said:

The components that make up a gaming console are generally custom built with the first real exception to that being the XBox, then the 360 and PS3. They pretty much "are" desktops only with a different aesthetic design. Their chips were more or less straight replicas of existing chips.

Nintendo has always used completely custom built chips made specifically for their machines. This is no exception. People often talk of what the Wii U is based on internally giving references to things like the Power7 and 4850 but those are only bases.

The CPU and GPU in the Wii U are built to fit its specifications. Size is not a problem, nor is power.

To be entirely accurate, most consoles used very conventional technology that was obsolete based on PC standards ...

The Motorola 68000 (CPU) was introduced in 1979, was used by Apple in the early 1980s, Atari and Commodore used it in the mid 1980s for their PCs, and was the CPU of the Sega Genesis in 1989. At a time when people were spending $5,000 for an 'average' PC, Nintendo and Sega were producing $200 gaming systems because the technology was so outdated.

Before the PS2, XBox and Gamecube console manufacturers were mostly picking up components from gigantic tech companies after they were no longer useful to them. They scavenged the garbage heaps of these companies, repackaged and resold the components at a low cost and people were greatful because of how expensive new technology was at the time.

The vast majority of consoles were closer to the Wii's performance when released than the HD consoles (in relative terms).



Baron on 27 August 2012
Kynes said:
Baron said:
Kynes said:
Take a look at the supposed size of the WiiU. You can't make a very powerful console with so low power requirement, I'm sure that Nintendo has done a good enough, very power optimized console (the EDRAM rumor hints to this) but it can't be several times more powerful than Xbox360 or PS3 with so tiny power profile.


We know nothing about the Wii U's power profile so I don't know why you bring that up? Size =/= power profile. Power profile is the total TDP of a console. Nintendo has always downsized their consoles along with a considerable step in power. Also, we've got 2 handhelds now that are easily capable of matching last gens hardware. The Vita is even almost as powerful as the 360 and PS3. The Wii U looks to offer a lot more room to hardware than the Vita.

As long as the casing offers sufficiënt cooling Nintendo can opt to put a GTX 680 and a i7 3960X in the Wii U. Off course that won't happen as it will make the console too expensive but size doesn't matter as much as you think

Size has everything to do with power profile and silence.


Yes to silence, no to power profile. I've seen custom built PC's no bigger than a small stereo set with the fastest cpu and gpu and water cooling built in. Super fast, high power profile and trashing console performance with ease.



Kynes on 27 August 2012
Baron said:
Kynes said:
Baron said:
Kynes said:
Take a look at the supposed size of the WiiU. You can't make a very powerful console with so low power requirement, I'm sure that Nintendo has done a good enough, very power optimized console (the EDRAM rumor hints to this) but it can't be several times more powerful than Xbox360 or PS3 with so tiny power profile.


We know nothing about the Wii U's power profile so I don't know why you bring that up? Size =/= power profile. Power profile is the total TDP of a console. Nintendo has always downsized their consoles along with a considerable step in power. Also, we've got 2 handhelds now that are easily capable of matching last gens hardware. The Vita is even almost as powerful as the 360 and PS3. The Wii U looks to offer a lot more room to hardware than the Vita.

As long as the casing offers sufficiënt cooling Nintendo can opt to put a GTX 680 and a i7 3960X in the Wii U. Off course that won't happen as it will make the console too expensive but size doesn't matter as much as you think

Size has everything to do with power profile and silence.


Yes to silence, no to power profile. I've seen custom built PC's no bigger than a small stereo set with the fastest cpu and gpu and water cooling built in. Super fast, high power profile and trashing console performance with ease.



I'm sure that Nintendo won't use water cooling for the WiiU. Be reasonable, what type of power profile do you think WiiU has? I'm sure that it dissipates less than 100W, it's probable that it's nearer to 50W.

Baron on 27 August 2012
Kynes said:
Baron said:
Kynes said:
Baron said:
Kynes said:
Take a look at the supposed size of the WiiU. You can't make a very powerful console with so low power requirement, I'm sure that Nintendo has done a good enough, very power optimized console (the EDRAM rumor hints to this) but it can't be several times more powerful than Xbox360 or PS3 with so tiny power profile.


We know nothing about the Wii U's power profile so I don't know why you bring that up? Size =/= power profile. Power profile is the total TDP of a console. Nintendo has always downsized their consoles along with a considerable step in power. Also, we've got 2 handhelds now that are easily capable of matching last gens hardware. The Vita is even almost as powerful as the 360 and PS3. The Wii U looks to offer a lot more room to hardware than the Vita.

As long as the casing offers sufficiënt cooling Nintendo can opt to put a GTX 680 and a i7 3960X in the Wii U. Off course that won't happen as it will make the console too expensive but size doesn't matter as much as you think

Size has everything to do with power profile and silence.


Yes to silence, no to power profile. I've seen custom built PC's no bigger than a small stereo set with the fastest cpu and gpu and water cooling built in. Super fast, high power profile and trashing console performance with ease.


I'm sure that Nintendo won't use water cooling for the WiiU. Be reasonable, what type of power profile do you think WiiU has? I'm sure that it dissipates less than 100W, it's probable that it's nearer to 50W.


I know, I'm just giving an example to prove size doesn't matter. Price and Nintendo's goals do. But your TDP estimate is only an assumption really. It could be true but nothing has been said concerning it. We've only heard rumors. Still, with something like a 80 Watt TDP the Wii U could very well be multiple times more powerful than the 360 or PS3. The ATI Radeon HD 2600 XT delivers somewhat the same theoretical performance as the Xenos does. It had a TDP of 50 Watt. If you then take a look at a Radeon 4xxx card with the same TDP you get the 4650 which is already more than twice as powerful than a 2600 XT.

I therefor see no reason why the GPU in the Wii U couldn't be several times more powerful than the Xenos.