Console isnt out yet and we no nothing about the Nextbox or PS4 so it could dominate everything, dominate some genres or not dominate anythiat all.
BasilZero said:
If companies such as Squareenix, Namco, Atlus and Capcom made RPGs like they did in the 90s, than any system, even the Wii-U would have a strong RPG game base. |
what im trying to say is, any open world RPG will be serverly limmited on the wii-u yes it can be done and yes some of the RPGs from he 90s and stuff were awsome but when orcarina of time came out it showed the world how awsome an open world game can be, but since then nintendo hasnt done a game in the fashion to be supperior to any of TES or fallout series' recent games. nintendo has the IP for some awsome games, a game that was like skyrim but with pokemon, link, starfox maybe even mario would be amazing and capture the RPG audience. a pokemon RPG in full 3d like TES could easily be GOTY
| Roma said:
Maybe we are looking at it completely different but the way I see is that you have a map were you can easily select units or just a few by drawing a circle around the ones you want to move and just direct them or tell them to guard or whatever ability they have and can use. The only game I played MP in was RA2 but that was many years ago so things have most likely changed from then till now or maybe they haven’t I don’t know. That’s nothing that the screen can’t handle either for moving around or selecting troops and telling them what to do. I don’t see how things will take longer using touch instead of a mouse but then I haven’t played games both ways so I can’t say for sure. You might have played a game using touch developed in a wrong way or maybe you played it on a phone or something. Scrolling is no problem either. Just like you put your courser at the end of the PC screen to move around quickly it can be done on the screen as well. It might never be as perfect as PC gamers want it to be but it will be close. |
The problem is you are comparing it to a scenario where a person only uses the mouse and only uses one button on it. That person wouldn't be very competitive to begin with, and using the WiiU tablet would be even worse. Using a keyboard in conjunction with a mouse massively increases your productivity and combat effectiveness. Looking at StarCraft 2 again, things like stutter step, blink micro, forcefields, really any unit with an ability would be significantly worse if not impossible. I don't think you realize how much time you save when you just hit a hotkey to do something rather than going down to the menu, selecting it, then going back up to the game screen to execute that action. Especially when you do that multiple times in a short period such as using blink (stalker ability in starcraft 2).
Also, there are probably a lot more physical and technical limitations to a touchscreen. Do you think that the touchscreen would be able to recognize multiple actions within a second? If I select 10 barracks and want to build 20 marines, which will I be able to press faster the touchscreen 20 times or a key on my keyboard 20 times? Also the Wii U screen is pretty small and low resolution. How can a finger or stylus compare in speed or accuracy to a mouse? So your potential inputs are two shoulder buttons, a dpad. an analog stick, and a touchscreen. I guess left handed people would have four face buttons rather than a dpad. That really isn't much, almost everything would need to be done through the touchscreen. Which means that the touchscreen needs to display the same thing as the tv or else you would have to split your attention too much. So if you're spending all your time looking at the controller, and most of the inputs are through the touchscreen, how would it be any better than an Ipad?
I feel like I kind of rambled about a lot of different things there. The long and short of it is that the Wii U controller would only be close to an extreme novice using a keyboard and mouse to play an RTS.
Yakuzaice said:
The problem is you are comparing it to a scenario where a person only uses the mouse and only uses one button on it. That person wouldn't be very competitive to begin with, and using the WiiU tablet would be even worse. Using a keyboard in conjunction with a mouse massively increases your productivity and combat effectiveness. Looking at StarCraft 2 again, things like stutter step, blink micro, forcefields, really any unit with an ability would be significantly worse if not impossible. I don't think you realize how much time you save when you just hit a hotkey to do something rather than going down to the menu, selecting it, then going back up to the game screen to execute that action. Especially when you do that multiple times in a short period such as using blink (stalker ability in starcraft 2). Also, there are probably a lot more physical and technical limitations to a touchscreen. Do you think that the touchscreen would be able to recognize multiple actions within a second? If I select 10 barracks and want to build 20 marines, which will I be able to press faster the touchscreen 20 times or a key on my keyboard 20 times? Also the Wii U screen is pretty small and low resolution. How can a finger or stylus compare in speed or accuracy to a mouse? So your potential inputs are two shoulder buttons, a dpad. an analog stick, and a touchscreen. I guess left handed people would have four face buttons rather than a dpad. That really isn't much, almost everything would need to be done through the touchscreen. Which means that the touchscreen needs to display the same thing as the tv or else you would have to split your attention too much. So if you're spending all your time looking at the controller, and most of the inputs are through the touchscreen, how would it be any better than an Ipad? I feel like I kind of rambled about a lot of different things there. The long and short of it is that the Wii U controller would only be close to an extreme novice using a keyboard and mouse to play an RTS. |
Sure it might not compare to PC but then WiiU owners aren’t going to play RTS against PC players right? So that put people on an even plane in terms of how to use stuff. The same thing can be said about any other game that is better on PC and less good on consoles they are still not playing against each other in most cases that wouldn’t even be fair to people with regular controls. I didn’t think I’d have to mention that you can put buttons on the screen as that is pretty obvious to anyone.
The screen is very responsive as shown in the Zelda demo but you might not have seen that one but that doesn’t mean it does not exist to show what it can do in terms of responsiveness. They turned the lights on and off repeatedly as fast as you would press a keyboard button.
You don’t use the entire keyboard to do stuff in games on PC. The screen is 6.5 inch so there is a lot of room on it. So you can put lots of buttons on the screen that would replace the keyboarded ones.
Left handed people will have no problem just as it was no problem with DS. The buttons and D-pad are mapped parallel to each other so they would easily be able to switch between left and right if the developer allows that of course
If you can’t see the possibility of it working then that’s you but it doesn’t mean it can’t be done and done very well even but as I said before it wont be as good as PC but it will be very close.
| R.I.P Mr Iwata :'( | ||
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Mr Khan said:
3DS has: 1 friend code that applies across all games (e.g. what Wii should have been, given the Connect24 friend list) Notifications for when your friends log on (though not which friend. Just this blinking orange light on the hardware, but you can go to the Home menu from that point and take a look at your friends list) The ability to see what your friends are playing The ability to, with an online enabled game, jump straight into a friend's game The only thing that's missing as far as friend functionality goes is some sort of private messaging system (which, oddly, was present on Wii but is now absent). So as far as friend functionality, Nintendo is relatively close to par. Where improvement is needed is in the online shopping experience, as well as demos (though demos for 3DS retail games are forthcoming) They're still moving slowly, but the picture is at least optimistic on that front |
A msging app is coming when the update arrives at 8th December
| R.I.P Mr Iwata :'( | ||
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Mr Khan said:
3DS has: 1 friend code that applies across all games (e.g. what Wii should have been, given the Connect24 friend list) is that an actual code in as in a random selection of numbers or letters or will friends see me listed at "kitler53" Like they do on psn and xbl? in otherwords -- can i pick my online moniker? Notifications for when your friends log on (though not which friend. Just this blinking orange light on the hardware, but you can go to the Home menu from that point and take a look at your friends list) that would be totally lame for a home console but on a portable it kind of makes sense with the screen size being soo much smaller. imporant part is they can identify when a friend logs in so better notification ought to be easy for the wiiU. The ability to see what your friends are playing The ability to, with an online enabled game, jump straight into a friend's game The only thing that's missing as far as friend functionality goes is some sort of private messaging system (which, oddly, was present on Wii but is now absent). So as far as friend functionality, Nintendo is relatively close to par. Where improvement is needed is in the online shopping experience, as well as demos (though demos for 3DS retail games are forthcoming) being your right, messaging was on the wii, this seems really dumb. how do you ask a friend if they want to play something (especially if that game isn't already loaded up). sounds really limiting. i'm not sure if i view the wii as terribly far behind on shopping though. i mean i guess maybe it is but as far as i'm concerned all three could use a lot of improvement. apple is terrible at this too imo. it can't be that hard to come up with a good online shopping concept can it?? organize things by the game being sold, make it manditory to provide some pics and videos of what is being purchased with a proper product description, a place for users to both rate and review the product, demos directly nested in the game's page as appropriate, dlc directly nested in the game's page as appropriate, be able to detect what you've played and quickly inquire to which games have new content i may be interested in, and a sensible method for new content to be advertised by the publishers, an intelligent suggesting system based on what i already bought and what my friends are playing, a wishlist feature to mark content you may want to purchase but not at this time so i don't forget about it, and a gifting system. i haven't been on xbl in a long time but psn's relatively flat list of anything and everything is just terrible to navigate. if i didn't have vgchartz and other internet resources i'd never know what the hell to buy or not. They're still moving slowly, but the picture is at least optimistic on that front xD |
kitler53 said:
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My response in italics
Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.
| Roma said:
Sure it might not compare to PC but then WiiU owners aren’t going to play RTS against PC players right? So that put people on an even plane in terms of how to use stuff. The same thing can be said about any other game that is better on PC and less good on consoles they are still not playing against each other in most cases that wouldn’t even be fair to people with regular controls. I didn’t think I’d have to mention that you can put buttons on the screen as that is pretty obvious to anyone. The screen is very responsive as shown in the Zelda demo but you might not have seen that one but that doesn’t mean it does not exist to show what it can do in terms of responsiveness. They turned the lights on and off repeatedly as fast as you would press a keyboard button. You don’t use the entire keyboard to do stuff in games on PC. The screen is 6.5 inch so there is a lot of room on it. So you can put lots of buttons on the screen that would replace the keyboarded ones. Left handed people will have no problem just as it was no problem with DS. The buttons and D-pad are mapped parallel to each other so they would easily be able to switch between left and right if the developer allows that of course If you can’t see the possibility of it working then that’s you but it doesn’t mean it can’t be done and done very well even but as I said before it wont be as good as PC but it will be very close. |
This thread was about the Wii U dominate every genre and be able to have the "same precision controls as PC". That is why I am comparing it to the PC. You don't seem to understand that it isn't just about having those buttons, but having them available to you at the exact same time as the mouse controls. Putting them on the screen completely misses the point. Also like I said, the Wii U screen is small and low resolution. A decent amount of the screen will need to be dedicated to the game field. You can only put so many extra buttons on it before it becomes cluttered. Also it seems like nobody has answered whether the controller would be pure interface, or displaying the same thing as the television.
Wasn't the Zelda demo just three big menu buttons to change day/night, camera, and display? Do you have a link to that video of them very quickly toggling the lighting? I remember one time trying to morph banelings as quickly as possible I hit about 1200 apm, which in real world time would be about 1675 actions per minute or 28 per second. Now granted, nobody actually plays like that, but do you think the touchscreen could record that many inputs?
No, you don't usually use the entire keyboard, but you can easily end up using 30+. And you still don't understand it isn't just about having those buttons, but about being able to press them while you are doing something else with the mouse. That's not even getting into the mouse specific hotkeys. Shift + clicks to queue commands, ctrl or A + click to attack move, double click to select all of that unit type, left click to select or execute a command, right click to attack or cancel a command, etc etc.
Actually I think an RTS would work much better with multi-touch and no buttons. Still not as good as PC, but probably better than the Wii U. If it could somehow keep track of your fingers independently, you could do some very interesting micromanagement. Of course having both hands on the screen would make it pretty hard to see what's going on.
I'm not saying it wouldn't work at all. Of course you could design an RTS for it. I'm just saying it won't work for PC RTS games. It's kind of funny how it is the people who seem to have little to no experience with RTS games on the PC who are so adamant that it will work great. It won't be very close, unless your point of reference is using only a mouse to play RTS games. Because that is what using a touchpad would be, a slow, inaccurate one button mouse.
How different would this thread have been if the title had instead been "Is there any genre the WiiU cannot do well?"? The question about whether it can dominate some genre is completely irrelevant and just comes off as odd to me, for several reasons:
1) Dominating implies it's the best at some respective thing, but we have no idea what the competition is doing, so we cannot know if the WiiU is in fact the best.
2) K&M is arguably the superior control scheme for FPSs compared to classic console controllers (i.e. "dominating"), yet a series like Call of Duty is vastly more popular on the PS360 than it is on the PC. "Domination" in this regard then seems a bit pointless, when clearly it's not that essential.
3) You're assuming a Wiimote or Wiimote+ will be standard equipment for the WiiU, when in truth it's only an optional peripheral. How many developers will opt for utilizing it deeply in their games, when it's not standard equipment? It's hard to tell, and saying the WiiU will dominate something like FPSs because you can have both pointer controls and classic controls is a bit presumptuous to say the least.
Now, as for genres that aren't doable (or doable in good quality) on the WiiU, that's something else entirely, but I'm not going to try to come up with any genres for that right now. 
Raider84 said:
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At first I wanted to laugh, but then I do a very slow-motion triple facepalm. It was not enough.
@OP-Any console could dominate any genre, no matter the control, but developer's effort.
Proud to be the first cool Nintendo fan ever
Number ONE Zelda fan in the Universe
Prediction: No Zelda HD for Wii U, quietly moved to the succesor
Predictions for Nintendo NX and Mobile
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