Rugger08 said: boilermaker11 said: It's not fanboy nonsense, it's the truth. Isn't the attach ratio for the Wii lower than the PS3? How many articles have been floating around the internet that basically say "The Wii sells a lot of hardware, but the people aren't playing the games"? If it had a "proven library" then it'd have an attach ratio closer to the 360. That is fact. Mario and Zelda =/= oustanding library The attach ratio doesn't matter to developers, only the total software sold. And Wii sells more software. Lets do a scenario: It is Christmas 08 and 50 million Wiis have been sold and only 20 million PS3s. A developer can expect attach ratio of 20% on PS3 and 10% on Wii, which console does the developer make the game for? 50 million * 10% = 5 million sold on Wii 20 million * 20% = 4 million sold on PS3 Point proven. And it doesn't even take into account it would cost half as much to make the game for the Wii rather than PS3.

Actually 3rd party developers tend to care about 3rd party sales, which is probably the only thing the Wii has been less than stellar at. 

Japan will guarantee Wii at LEAST a second. But we all know that Wii will outsell the PS3 and 360 at least in one other major region.

Well, the important thing is what is happening now, and now what is happening in the future. Now, the Wii is winning. Now, the Playstation 3 is losing.

Never-the-less, the Wii will win. I mean, it hasn't even had its first price-cut yet, and consoles are selling for higher prices on eBay, than the Xbox 360, and Playstation 3, more than a year after launch. What's going to happen once the wii reaches $99, like the Playstation 2 will, in due time? As much as I love the Xbox 360, and Playstation 3, I really think that the Wii will dominate the world. Why? Because Nintendo's back!

boilermaker11 said: mancandy said: steverhcp02 said: The thing i cant stand is that people just are so intolerant of opinions against teh wii here. Boilermaker an dmyself both acknowledge the tremendous success of the wii. But just because the type of software (wii sports, wii play, waggle)isnt for us doesnt make us fanboys or stupid. SMG, Metroid, Zelda 3 big boys, great games 3 different genres.....but theres not a lot of depth, i think thats the argument. But that said it clearly doesnt matter because for people who enjoy wii sports, raving rabids, wario etc. those 3 games plus the other minigame centric titles make it tremendous. You can have your opinion, but stop making stupid generalizations. There are more games on the Wii than just SMG, Metroid, and Zelda. Funny how you only mention first party games, like that's the only thing the Wii has. Third party support is better than ever. I've already played through, Call of Duty 3, Medal of Honor 2, RE4, Zack & Wiki, Tiger Woods 07, Madden 08, SSX Blur. So please don't tell me the Wii only has party games and lack depth, it's ridiculous. You repeatedly called me a fanboy, yet I openly acknowledge the success of the Wii. I think you're confused. Anyway, yeah, I mentioned mostly first party titles, but let's make a rundown of your 3rd party list. COD3 is on PS3/Xbox/360, MOH2 is on PSP, RE4 is on PS2, Tiger Woods is on everything, same with Madden 08. So when it comes to the 3rd party, what's the incentive to buy a Wii again? For Zack and Wiki? Didn't I acknowledge that game also? I think I was VERY specific when I posted. I basically said "Wii sales phenomally because it caters to a much wider audience, but the majority of its' games don't cater to myself, and many others" That's the gist of what I was trying to say. That's not fanboyism, that's preference. And the claim of "all the games flat out suck"....never said that. I said that most of the games are family oriented, yet I find games like MGS and Halo to be more in my taste. Once again, not fanboyism, but rather, preference. But if you REALLY want to take it that far: http://www.metacritic.com/games/wii/scores/ How many games got above an 80? Now cross out the ones that are multiplatform. That leaves 9 games, 3 of which are 3rd party (should you even consider MLB Power Pros?). So it really does look like the Nintendo family is what's carrying the system, when it comes to core gamers. Why can't I be critical of the Wii without being blasted? I've stated the obvious over and over. Casual market, not my taste in games, blah blah blah, yet I'm a fanboy? I say time and time again that it is and will be a successful console, but I'm not getting one, so I'm a fanboy? I'm starting to believe that around here, if you don't like the Wii you are considered a fanboy by default.

MLB power Pros is the best Baseball game released this generation or last. So i'd count it.

a.l.e.x59 said: Well, the important thing is what is happening now, and now what is happening in the future. Now, the Wii is winning. Now, the Playstation 3 is losing. Never-the-less, the Wii will win. I mean, it hasn't even had its first price-cut yet, and consoles are selling for higher prices on eBay, than the Xbox 360, and Playstation 3, more than a year after launch. What's going to happen once the wii reaches $99, like the Playstation 2 will, in due time? As much as I love the Xbox 360, and Playstation 3, I really think that the Wii will dominate the world. Why? Because Nintendo's back!

i agree with u. and all the guys/gals that hate the wii keep trying to degrade it andwant it to fail still. M$ fanboys are all over thinking the wii will lose for some reason cause of its library which has hte most versatility then the 360 has by a long shot. for a little experiment try this take all the 1 million sellers on each system but here is the trick. u get one game per genra then count the million selers and i can bet u that the wii will have more then the 360. now all u guys that classify COD3 is a different game then COD4, different then bioshock is from halo 3, RB6 different from (insert FPS here) is just dumb. a shooter is a shooter no matter how u look at it. besides u can play the majority of those games on pc and ill tell u right now the thewy sell as well as nothin. just cause there are FPS dime a dozens there. ok rant somewhat over. to me the wii has alot of different games types. think bout it they have dancing,singing, party, platformers, rpg's, FPS's, puzzels, action adventures, even musical games, and racing, snowboarding, football, basketball, baseball, soccer, pool. and many many more genra's coming soon. the 360's next big game is what? (ten bucks says its a FPS)

boilermaker11 said: mancandy said: steverhcp02 said: The thing i cant stand is that people just are so intolerant of opinions against teh wii here. Boilermaker an dmyself both acknowledge the tremendous success of the wii. But just because the type of software (wii sports, wii play, waggle)isnt for us doesnt make us fanboys or stupid. SMG, Metroid, Zelda 3 big boys, great games 3 different genres.....but theres not a lot of depth, i think thats the argument. But that said it clearly doesnt matter because for people who enjoy wii sports, raving rabids, wario etc. those 3 games plus the other minigame centric titles make it tremendous. You can have your opinion, but stop making stupid generalizations. There are more games on the Wii than just SMG, Metroid, and Zelda. Funny how you only mention first party games, like that's the only thing the Wii has. Third party support is better than ever. I've already played through, Call of Duty 3, Medal of Honor 2, RE4, Zack & Wiki, Tiger Woods 07, Madden 08, SSX Blur. So please don't tell me the Wii only has party games and lack depth, it's ridiculous.   You repeatedly called me a fanboy, yet I openly acknowledge the success of the Wii.  I think you're confused.

I think you're confused. Calling the Wii a scucess doesn't negate your fanboy nonsense.

 

boilermaker11 said: mancandy said: steverhcp02 said: The thing i cant stand is that people just are so intolerant of opinions against teh wii here. Boilermaker an dmyself both acknowledge the tremendous success of the wii. But just because the type of software (wii sports, wii play, waggle)isnt for us doesnt make us fanboys or stupid. SMG, Metroid, Zelda 3 big boys, great games 3 different genres.....but theres not a lot of depth, i think thats the argument. But that said it clearly doesnt matter because for people who enjoy wii sports, raving rabids, wario etc. those 3 games plus the other minigame centric titles make it tremendous. You can have your opinion, but stop making stupid generalizations. There are more games on the Wii than just SMG, Metroid, and Zelda. Funny how you only mention first party games, like that's the only thing the Wii has. Third party support is better than ever. I've already played through, Call of Duty 3, Medal of Honor 2, RE4, Zack & Wiki, Tiger Woods 07, Madden 08, SSX Blur. So please don't tell me the Wii only has party games and lack depth, it's ridiculous.   You repeatedly called me a fanboy, yet I openly acknowledge the success of the Wii.  I think you're confused. Anyway, yeah, I mentioned mostly first party titles, but let's make a rundown of your 3rd party list. COD3 is on PS3/Xbox/360, MOH2 is on PSP, RE4 is on PS2, Tiger Woods is on everything, same with Madden 08. So when it comes to the 3rd party, what's the incentive to buy a Wii again? For Zack and Wiki? Didn't I acknowledge that game also? I think I was VERY specific when I posted. I basically said "Wii sales phenomally because it caters to a much wider audience, but the majority of its' games don't cater to myself, and many others" That's the gist of what I was trying to say. That's not fanboyism, that's preference. And the claim of "all the games flat out suck"....never said that. I said that most of the games are family oriented, yet I find games like MGS and Halo to be more in my taste. Once again, not fanboyism, but rather, preference. But if you REALLY want to take it that far: http://www.metacritic.com/games/wii/scores/ How many games got above an 80? Now cross out the ones that are multiplatform. That leaves 9 games, 3 of which are 3rd party (should you even consider MLB Power Pros?). So it really does look like the Nintendo family is what's carrying the system, when it comes to core gamers. Why can't I be critical of the Wii without being blasted? I've stated the obvious over and over. Casual market, not my taste in games, blah blah blah, yet I'm a fanboy? I say time and time again that it is and will be a successful console, but I'm not getting one, so I'm a fanboy? I'm starting to believe that around here, if you don't like the Wii you are considered a fanboy by default.

 What utter nonsense you love to spew. Judging a games library while crossing off multiplatform titles is just dumb. Can I play Guitar Hero 3 on my Wii? Then it is part of the game library. Can I play RE4 on my Wii? Then it is part of the library. Those two are also special in that the games are different from the other versions out there. My guitar rumbles when I activate my star power and I freaking love it. I never hear missed notes because I muted the Wiimote speaker, and everyone thinks that is cool.

That said, it is the Nintendo family carrying the console for the most part. The catch there is Nintendo makes amazingly good games. Look at the list of the best games ever made and a ton of them have one thing in common and I will let you guess what that is. Their games aren't all holed up in one genre either, which is part of the appeal for many people. They don't just make awesome shooter games, or awesome party games. They have a decent range of games they can produce to sell a system well. A library of just Nintendo games can easily be considered a solid library given the games they can put out.

 The reason you keep getting called a fanboy is because you are trying to hide behind the flimsy shield of admitting it is a success and then attacking weak points that don't exist.  You blast the Wii for having a weak library, but are hesitant to offer any justifications at first, and offer flimsy ones when pressed for it. Your comments are not coming across as you saying you dislike the system either. They are coming across as insulting the system, which is very different. When you understand the difference between saying you don't like a game, and saying a game sucks this will make sense.

Several responses to different posts in this section:

1) From the available data we have -- Europe seems to buy more PS3 software, and we are missing some data from earlier in that region -- the Wii has a higher attach rate than the PS3 does. The one region we have very strong sales analysis in is Japan: in that region, the Wii has over a .6 higher attach rate than the PS3, and in raw figures has sold nearly 4x the amount of software as the PS3 has. There is no way to spin this.

2) The Wii has sold more software worldwide than either the 360 or PS3 for the last four weeks running (in the PS3's case, by a wide, undisputable margin).

3) The PS3 is selling enough software and harder to justify continued multiplatform efforts in conjunction with 360 releases

 

steverhcp02 said: The_vagabond7 said: Having a lot of games in a few genres equals depth? I'm sorry, but I simply have to disagree with your definition, and leave it at that. well, what should i do, go through and do gamerankings scores for the aforementione dgames? I dont think ALL of the games ive listed are ass.......theres more of a pool to choose form, like i said, in each of those genres (Metroid, Galaxy, Mario Kart, Brawl, Zelda) each ninty game is in spot 1, 2 or 3 imo across all systems.....but after that teh list is much smaller. Sure, Darkness, Ass Creed, Clancy arent spectacular games, but the point of depth is for a fan of each genre having more opportunities to play said genre....what is depth to you? Some hybrid score over # of games divided by apple pies? Keeping it simple, for fans of these genres there are more options to them and besides Lair, non of them are really horrendous to fans of the genres.

 I see what you're saying, and I guess it does make sense to somebody with a taste for a limited number of genres.

 I guess if we go by your definition of library depth, then I'm going for library breadth. I want as much variety as possible. Two decades of thumb-wrestling D-pads has made me a jaded gamer, and it takes more than a couple mechanics tweaks and some higher-resolution textures to make me excited about a game. Sure, I play shooters, but I'm the kind of guy who thinks that the gravity gun is the only thing that lifted Half-life 2 above a 7.0. I don't need a dozen different shooter experiences, I just need a couple of the best ones. Same goes for pretty much any other genre.

 The Wii's input system allows for gameplay experiences which aren't possible on other platforms. People like to say things like, "The Wii could never handle Killzone 2." Sure it could, it would just take a graphics hit. Fewer particles, slightly dumber bots, whatever, the core gameplay experience could be entirely recreated. The PS3 on the other hand, could never handle WarioWare. Not without gutting the core gameplay or adding non-standard hardware.

People who haven't been playing shooters since Wolfenstein or playing sports games since Tecmo Bowl might be looking for library depth. I get bored of chewing on yesterday's cud, I need some fresh food.

I have to start hoping that the PS3 overtakes the Xbox360 just so this guy can have it completely wrong.