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Forums - Sales Discussion - EMEAA Up - 18 September 2010

Metallicube on 21 September 2010
SaviorX said:
Seece said:
SaviorX said:
Seece said:
psrock said:
Metallicube said:

PS3 has pretty much packed it in I think. The Move as I expected, had a very minimal impact on sales, and Sony has used up most of their cards. MS can milk the 360 a little longer, despite being a year older, with the new console model, Halo Reach, and Kinect. While I don't think Kinect will have a lasting impact either, it will provide a much bigger initial spike in hardware than Move.

Wii is entering the final weeks of its lull until starting to pick up for the holdiay season and the onslaught of Wii titles for Q4, with Kirby, Goldeneye, Wii Party, Just Dance 2, Epic Mickey, DKC, Carnival Games 2, NBA Jam, etc.  Wii has suffered this year having to rely almost entirely on the continued lift of NSMB, considering it basically had no hardware movers this year. While Wii will definitly have huge sales again this holiday, I think it is starting to age, and will be in pretty steady decline after the holiday. Though at the same time, I honestly don't see the HD consoles lasting too far beyond the typical 5-6 year cycle either, especially if Move and Kinect are flops like I expect.


You heard it here first folks, a $299 console with GT5 to arrive in November is dead, dead I tell you.

I've never read so much biased drivel in all my life, and that's saying something for this forum lol

You of all people should not be judging ANYONE for biased drivel Seece. It's a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

As for this issue, a $300 PS3 with GT5 is something I cannot really accurately predict.When it comes to the PS3, often times I find myself underestimating it. However, after GT5, what is there? Price drops? Even if GT5 sold 60% as fast as NSMB or MW2: 360 did, how much of an extended HW boost will it provide for the PS3?

People place way too much stock in GT5. Now granted, we cannot see how well Move will benefit the PS3 after only one measly week, so Metallicube did jump the gun, but I don't see it rejuvenating PS3 sales to astronomical levels and keeping it that way either.

I give all consoles a fair shot ta very much. I certainly don't spew rubbish like that on here ...

I am not going to argue with you, but I don't believe that for a second. It seems like you are using a cap pistol to shoot for one console and an army tank to give a "fair shot" to another. Either way, I haven't seen such fairness so you are gonna have to point it out to me. Where is it?

Now to get back on-topic, what did Metallicube say that I didn't touch on which was so offbase?

Ugh who knows man. I'm guessing maybe the "PS3 has packed it in" remark, which in retrospect was a little strong. But some Sony fans here get too sensitive. What I meant was more that its best days are behind it, which is a reasonable assumption. The Move, which Sony has seemingly poured much of its focus into, doesn't seem to be making an impact, and it doesn't have much software wise besides GT5. But to be fair, the other consoles are probably going to decline at around the same rate. It'll depend on the strength of the library from here on out as to how fast they decline.



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Seece on 21 September 2010
SaviorX said:
Seece said:
 

I give all consoles a fair shot ta very much. I certainly don't spew rubbish like that on here ...

I am not going to argue with you, but I don't believe that for a second. It seems like you are using a cap pistol to shoot for one console and an army tank to give a "fair shot" to another. Either way, I haven't seen such fairness so you are gonna have to point it out to me. Where is it?

Now to get back on-topic, what did Metallicube say that I didn't touch on which was so offbase?

Do you mean in this thread? or in my post history? Cos I aint dredging through 11k posts to apease you ...

I've given my reasons why I think the HD consoles will outlast Wii. I'm not the one stating a console is dead or gonna drop off the face of the earth, his reasoning is pretty bad to boot. (actually did he give any real reasoning, more so sounds like wishful thinking.)

Your reasons don't hold much weight either. Now, this gen has been nuts when it comes to consoles defying trends and history, but do you seriously think, the PS3 or 360 will outsell the Wii in any given years to come? When you say outlast, by how long? By how much? When the successors release, unless the Wii is totally obsolete, history will strike again and it will still sell despite a new console being out. There is nothing pointing to the Wii dropping off the face of the earth except your wishful thinking. Throughout those 11k posts I know there was a LOT of it.

And what if they do outsell the Wii in....2012 or 2013? You think Nintendo will wait until the 3DS has been out for 2 years before dropping a successor? Signs point to Ninty moving on in Japan at the end of 2011 or beginning of 2012 the latest. Getting the early jump on 3rd party support means everything to them right now. The console war is over; any sales after this point is just petty bragging rights, something gaming can use a lot less of.

You think Sony can weather a PS4 around that time (11/11 ; 3/12) after all this investment into Move?

Rubbish, I don't think Wii will drop off the face of the earth so stop putting words in my mouth, and I suggest you go find a few examples before accusing me of something you have wrong

My reasoning is right on pitch. It's irrefutable PS3 and 360 sales are fuled by gamers looking for a gaming console, Nitnendo's userbases for each console were consistantly dropping, and I doubt they've garnerd any new core gamers this gen judging by how the core games sell on the system.

Wii's price cut has already worn off, actually it wore off a while ago, whilst PS3's was seeing rises YOY up until the slims 1st anniversarys.

PS3 and 360 (only with Kinect) have effective price cuts to come, any price cut the Wii receives seems to diminish rather fast. If they do price cut this xmas, they really will have blown their load so to speak, because next xmas 360 and PS3 are going to be fighting their most brutal yet.

Your 2nd paragraph is just irrelevent, and shows you just have beef with me because I'm "attacking something Nintendo", when I'm not. I'm only talking about PS3 and 360 outlasting Wii, so quite what a wii successor and 3DS and the war being over has to do with this I don't know.



 

Carl on 21 September 2010
Metallicube said:

Again, to think 360 and PS3 are guarenteed to outlast the Wii is very shortsighted. Nothing is guarenteed. I suppose they could outlast it, but Nintendo will have to either cut the life short by releasing a new console before them, OR compeltely stop releasing games that people want to buy (which essentially happened the first 9 months of this year). Being more of a "core console" (whatever that means) has nothing to do with it.

I hate to butt in, but I can't resist anymore.

It's software that keeps consoles alive. The support they get.

It's getting it's biggest exclusive game before the year is over.
PS3 is getting, and will continue to get excellent 1st party AND 3rd party support.
It just got it's Motion Controller, thus bringing in all new support and interest when (if) word of mouth kicks in. It's already getting new exclusives (Virtua Tennis 2011).
It still has PLENTY of room for pricecuts.
It's still a big console, so it can easily be redesigned. PS2 had multiple redesigns, PS3 can do too.
It can still get multiple colors released for it. 
It's sales have increased every year since it released. Why would it suddenly have "packed it in", especially when it outsold Wii in this region this week (And Japan for Months on end)?

I honestly fail to see how you can think the PS3 has "packed it in". Honestly. It just sounds like a load of wishful thinking biased bullcrap.

If any console has packed it in... You should be looking at the Wii, not the PS3. It's down by a quarter of a Million units YoY , and losing a lot of marketshare. Despite having a pricecut, and NSMB late last year. While the PS3 is up by 1.4 Million units YoY and gaining marketshare...



                            

Seece on 21 September 2010
Metallicube said:
SaviorX said:
Seece said:
SaviorX said:

You of all people should not be judging ANYONE for biased drivel Seece. It's a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

As for this issue, a $300 PS3 with GT5 is something I cannot really accurately predict.When it comes to the PS3, often times I find myself underestimating it. However, after GT5, what is there? Price drops? Even if GT5 sold 60% as fast as NSMB or MW2: 360 did, how much of an extended HW boost will it provide for the PS3?

People place way too much stock in GT5. Now granted, we cannot see how well Move will benefit the PS3 after only one measly week, so Metallicube did jump the gun, but I don't see it rejuvenating PS3 sales to astronomical levels and keeping it that way either.

I give all consoles a fair shot ta very much. I certainly don't spew rubbish like that on here ...

I am not going to argue with you, but I don't believe that for a second. It seems like you are using a cap pistol to shoot for one console and an army tank to give a "fair shot" to another. Either way, I haven't seen such fairness so you are gonna have to point it out to me. Where is it?

Now to get back on-topic, what did Metallicube say that I didn't touch on which was so offbase?

Ugh who knows man. I'm guessing maybe the "PS3 has packed it in" remark, which in retrospect was a little strong. But some Sony fans here get too sensitive. What I meant was more that its best days are behind it, which is a reasonable assumption. The Move, which Sony has seemingly poured much of its focus into, doesn't seem to be making an impact, and it doesn't have much software wise besides GT5. But to be fair, the other consoles are probably going to decline at around the same rate. It'll depend on the strength of the library from here on out as to how fast they decline.

Mmm, I'm not a Sony fan and I couldn't care less who won out of these 2, I'm just saying it how I see it, PS3 and 360 have more fuel left, Wii is running low. Even ioi agree's Move is going to be a slow mover, I didn't quite agree at first either, but it's going to take time for SW to filter through and make any sort of impact. Kinect would have beent he same, had it not been for MS aggressive marketing planning this xmas.



 

Seece on 21 September 2010
Carl2291 said:
Metallicube said:

Again, to think 360 and PS3 are guarenteed to outlast the Wii is very shortsighted. Nothing is guarenteed. I suppose they could outlast it, but Nintendo will have to either cut the life short by releasing a new console before them, OR compeltely stop releasing games that people want to buy (which essentially happened the first 9 months of this year). Being more of a "core console" (whatever that means) has nothing to do with it.

I hate to butt in, but I can't resist anymore.

It's software that keeps consoles alive. The support they get.

It's getting it's biggest exclusive game before the year is over.
PS3 is getting, and will continue to get excellent 1st party AND 3rd party support.
It just got it's Motion Controller, thus bringing in all new support and interest when (if) word of mouth kicks in. It's already getting new exclusives (Virtua Tennis 2011).
It still has PLENTY of room for pricecuts.
It's still a big console, so it can easily be redesigned. PS2 had multiple redesigns, PS3 can do too.
It can still get multiple colors released for it. 
It's sales have increased every year since it released. Why would it suddenly have "packed it in", especially when it outsold Wii in this region this week (And Japan for Months on end)?

I honestly fail to see how you can think the PS3 has "packed it in". Honestly. It just sounds like a load of wishful thinking biased bullcrap.

If any console has packed it in... You should be looking at the Wii, not the PS3. It's down by a quarter of a Million units YoY , and losing a lot of marketshare. Despite having a pricecut, and NSMB late last year. While the PS3 is up by 1.4 Million units YoY and gaining marketshare...

Something to add, in the next few weeks all consoles will be in the 30% marketshare range for the year 2010. Has this EVER happened to a 1st place console ???

http://www.vgchartz.com/home.php#Worldwide YTD



 

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GuyDuke on 21 September 2010
Seece said:
SaviorX said:
Seece said:
 

I give all consoles a fair shot ta very much. I certainly don't spew rubbish like that on here ...

I am not going to argue with you, but I don't believe that for a second. It seems like you are using a cap pistol to shoot for one console and an army tank to give a "fair shot" to another. Either way, I haven't seen such fairness so you are gonna have to point it out to me. Where is it?

Now to get back on-topic, what did Metallicube say that I didn't touch on which was so offbase?

Do you mean in this thread? or in my post history? Cos I aint dredging through 11k posts to apease you ...

I've given my reasons why I think the HD consoles will outlast Wii. I'm not the one stating a console is dead or gonna drop off the face of the earth, his reasoning is pretty bad to boot. (actually did he give any real reasoning, more so sounds like wishful thinking.)

Your reasons don't hold much weight either. Now, this gen has been nuts when it comes to consoles defying trends and history, but do you seriously think, the PS3 or 360 will outsell the Wii in any given years to come? When you say outlast, by how long? By how much? When the successors release, unless the Wii is totally obsolete, history will strike again and it will still sell despite a new console being out. There is nothing pointing to the Wii dropping off the face of the earth except your wishful thinking. Throughout those 11k posts I know there was a LOT of it.

And what if they do outsell the Wii in....2012 or 2013? You think Nintendo will wait until the 3DS has been out for 2 years before dropping a successor? Signs point to Ninty moving on in Japan at the end of 2011 or beginning of 2012 the latest. Getting the early jump on 3rd party support means everything to them right now. The console war is over; any sales after this point is just petty bragging rights, something gaming can use a lot less of.

You think Sony can weather a PS4 around that time (11/11 ; 3/12) after all this investment into Move?

Rubbish, I don't think Wii will drop off the face of the earth so stop putting words in my mouth, and I suggest you go find a few examples before accusing me of something you have wrong

My reasoning is right on pitch. It's irrefutable PS3 and 360 sales are fuled by gamers looking for a gaming console, Nitnendo's userbases for each console were consistantly dropping, and I doubt they've garned any new core gamers this gen judging by how the core games sell on the system.

Wii's price cut has already worn off, actually it wore off a while ago, whilst PS3's was seeing rises YOY up until the slims 1st anniversarys.

PS3 and 360 (only with Kinect) have effective price cuts to come, any price cut the Wii receives seems to diminish rather fast. If they do price cut this xmas, they really will have blown their load so to speak, because next xmas 360 and PS3 are going to be fighting their most brutal yet.

Your 2nd paragraph is just irrelevent, and shows you just have beef with me because I'm "attacking something Nintendo", when I'm not. I'm only talking about PS3 and 360 outlasting Wii, so quite what a wii successor and 3DS and the war being over has to do with this I don't know.

People seem to forget the PS3 sold quite bad before the end of 2009, it's normal it's up YoY because there's so much people out there that didn't buy it because of the 400$ tag. Wii had 3 big years, it's normal the sales dry up at this very time.

And also don't forget the Wii hasn't seen a console redesign like the others two.

This holiday will be very tied this time, not like the Wii outselling the other consoles by a million units. The 360 will be close to the Wii or above it, but I'm not so sure for the PS3. I think it'll finish third, but not by a large margin. Let's see if Nintendo has interesting titles to show for 2011. I bet the Vitality Sensor is somewhere there...



Jordahn on 21 September 2010
Seece said:
psrock said:
Metallicube said:

PS3 has pretty much packed it in I think. The Move as I expected, had a very minimal impact on sales, and Sony has used up most of their cards. MS can milk the 360 a little longer, despite being a year older, with the new console model, Halo Reach, and Kinect. While I don't think Kinect will have a lasting impact either, it will provide a much bigger initial spike in hardware than Move.

Wii is entering the final weeks of its lull until starting to pick up for the holdiay season and the onslaught of Wii titles for Q4, with Kirby, Goldeneye, Wii Party, Just Dance 2, Epic Mickey, DKC, Carnival Games 2, NBA Jam, etc.  Wii has suffered this year having to rely almost entirely on the continued lift of NSMB, considering it basically had no hardware movers this year. While Wii will definitly have huge sales again this holiday, I think it is starting to age, and will be in pretty steady decline after the holiday. Though at the same time, I honestly don't see the HD consoles lasting too far beyond the typical 5-6 year cycle either, especially if Move and Kinect are flops like I expect.


You heard it here first folks, a $299 console with GT5 to arrive in November is dead, dead I tell you.

I've never read so much biased drivel in all my life, and that's saying something for this forum lol


Nice to see you agree with psrock.



Hackers are poor nerds who don't wash.

Carl on 21 September 2010
Seece said:
Carl2291 said:
Metallicube said:

Again, to think 360 and PS3 are guarenteed to outlast the Wii is very shortsighted. Nothing is guarenteed. I suppose they could outlast it, but Nintendo will have to either cut the life short by releasing a new console before them, OR compeltely stop releasing games that people want to buy (which essentially happened the first 9 months of this year). Being more of a "core console" (whatever that means) has nothing to do with it.

I hate to butt in, but I can't resist anymore.

It's software that keeps consoles alive. The support they get.

It's getting it's biggest exclusive game before the year is over.
PS3 is getting, and will continue to get excellent 1st party AND 3rd party support.
It just got it's Motion Controller, thus bringing in all new support and interest when (if) word of mouth kicks in. It's already getting new exclusives (Virtua Tennis 2011).
It still has PLENTY of room for pricecuts.
It's still a big console, so it can easily be redesigned. PS2 had multiple redesigns, PS3 can do too.
It can still get multiple colors released for it. 
It's sales have increased every year since it released. Why would it suddenly have "packed it in", especially when it outsold Wii in this region this week (And Japan for Months on end)?

I honestly fail to see how you can think the PS3 has "packed it in". Honestly. It just sounds like a load of wishful thinking biased bullcrap.

If any console has packed it in... You should be looking at the Wii, not the PS3. It's down by a quarter of a Million units YoY , and losing a lot of marketshare. Despite having a pricecut, and NSMB late last year. While the PS3 is up by 1.4 Million units YoY and gaining marketshare...

Something to add, in the next few weeks all consoles will be in the 30% marketshare range for the year 2010. Has this EVER happened to a 1st place console ???

http://www.vgchartz.com/home.php#Worldwide YTD

Not that I know of. Amazing really when you look at it.

I can't wait to see that Marketshare chart next year though.



                            

Seece on 21 September 2010
Carl2291 said:
Seece said:
Carl2291 said:
Metallicube said:

Again, to think 360 and PS3 are guarenteed to outlast the Wii is very shortsighted. Nothing is guarenteed. I suppose they could outlast it, but Nintendo will have to either cut the life short by releasing a new console before them, OR compeltely stop releasing games that people want to buy (which essentially happened the first 9 months of this year). Being more of a "core console" (whatever that means) has nothing to do with it.

I hate to butt in, but I can't resist anymore.

It's software that keeps consoles alive. The support they get.

It's getting it's biggest exclusive game before the year is over.
PS3 is getting, and will continue to get excellent 1st party AND 3rd party support.
It just got it's Motion Controller, thus bringing in all new support and interest when (if) word of mouth kicks in. It's already getting new exclusives (Virtua Tennis 2011).
It still has PLENTY of room for pricecuts.
It's still a big console, so it can easily be redesigned. PS2 had multiple redesigns, PS3 can do too.
It can still get multiple colors released for it. 
It's sales have increased every year since it released. Why would it suddenly have "packed it in", especially when it outsold Wii in this region this week (And Japan for Months on end)?

I honestly fail to see how you can think the PS3 has "packed it in". Honestly. It just sounds like a load of wishful thinking biased bullcrap.

If any console has packed it in... You should be looking at the Wii, not the PS3. It's down by a quarter of a Million units YoY , and losing a lot of marketshare. Despite having a pricecut, and NSMB late last year. While the PS3 is up by 1.4 Million units YoY and gaining marketshare...

Something to add, in the next few weeks all consoles will be in the 30% marketshare range for the year 2010. Has this EVER happened to a 1st place console ???

http://www.vgchartz.com/home.php#Worldwide YTD

Not that I know of. Amazing really when you look at it.

I can't wait to see that Marketshare chart next year though.

Yup, it won't have as strong a start in 2011 as 2010 gave it, so by this time next year, 360 or PS3 or both could be ahead for total 2011 sales.



 

Metallicube on 21 September 2010
Seece said:
SaviorX said:
Seece said:
 

I give all consoles a fair shot ta very much. I certainly don't spew rubbish like that on here ...

I am not going to argue with you, but I don't believe that for a second. It seems like you are using a cap pistol to shoot for one console and an army tank to give a "fair shot" to another. Either way, I haven't seen such fairness so you are gonna have to point it out to me. Where is it?

Now to get back on-topic, what did Metallicube say that I didn't touch on which was so offbase?

Do you mean in this thread? or in my post history? Cos I aint dredging through 11k posts to apease you ...

I've given my reasons why I think the HD consoles will outlast Wii. I'm not the one stating a console is dead or gonna drop off the face of the earth, his reasoning is pretty bad to boot. (actually did he give any real reasoning, more so sounds like wishful thinking.)

Your reasons don't hold much weight either. Now, this gen has been nuts when it comes to consoles defying trends and history, but do you seriously think, the PS3 or 360 will outsell the Wii in any given years to come? When you say outlast, by how long? By how much? When the successors release, unless the Wii is totally obsolete, history will strike again and it will still sell despite a new console being out. There is nothing pointing to the Wii dropping off the face of the earth except your wishful thinking. Throughout those 11k posts I know there was a LOT of it.

And what if they do outsell the Wii in....2012 or 2013? You think Nintendo will wait until the 3DS has been out for 2 years before dropping a successor? Signs point to Ninty moving on in Japan at the end of 2011 or beginning of 2012 the latest. Getting the early jump on 3rd party support means everything to them right now. The console war is over; any sales after this point is just petty bragging rights, something gaming can use a lot less of.

You think Sony can weather a PS4 around that time (11/11 ; 3/12) after all this investment into Move?

Rubbish, I don't think Wii will drop off the face of the earth so stop putting words in my mouth, and I suggest you go find a few examples before accusing me of something you have wrong

My reasoning is right on pitch. It's irrefutable PS3 and 360 sales are fuled by gamers looking for a gaming console, Nitnendo's userbases for each console were consistantly dropping, and I doubt they've garned any new core gamers this gen judging by how the core games sell on the system.

Wii's price cut has already worn off, actually it wore off a while ago, whilst PS3's was seeing rises YOY up until the slims 1st anniversarys.

PS3 and 360 (only with Kinect) have effective price cuts to come, any price cut the Wii receives seems to diminish rather fast. If they do price cut this xmas, they really will have blown their load so to speak, because next xmas 360 and PS3 are going to be fighting their most brutal yet.

Your 2nd paragraph is just irrelevent, and shows you just have beef with me because I'm "attacking something Nintendo", when I'm not. I'm only talking about PS3 and 360 outlasting Wii, so quite what a wii successor and 3DS and the war being over has to do with this I don't know.

You put far too much importance on price cuts. I've said a thousand times and I'll say it again: It's games games games. People buy consoles for GAMES, they don't buy consoles because they look nice in the living room. If your console has no games, no price cut will help you. The HD consoles both have had slim models (which I contend have done far more than the price drops). And they've also had stronger releases this year than the Wii thus far. A price cut will give a very temporary boost but that's it.

HD consoles could outlast the Wii, but if they do, it'll be because Nintendo wil fail to release games that people want. Wii did bad this year (speaking in relative terms) because people had no new reasons to buy a Wii. It's biggest two games were a Mario Galaxy sequel (which even the first game barely moved consoles) and a Metroid spinoff with very limited appeal.

I don't quite get how you see it as likely that the HD consoles will outlast Wii, when Nintendo has pumped out some of the best selling games of all time for Wii in just 4 years that have insane legs, and chances are good they could release another one.

As for the HD consoles are "gamers" consoles, and have more loyal core gamers or whatever, I'm not gonna bother arguing with that one because it's nothing more than hardcore elitist nonsense.