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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Female protagonist? What do you think?

I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays, while female portrays with those characteristics are very limited.



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lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays than on female portrays.

Mmm, it sounds more like a stereotype to me. Stereotypes are sexist sometime right?



lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays than on female portrays.

Yeah but these emo kid are always strong and independant (which is the inverse with the girl in fire emblem) and they are usualy the main character or the big bad guy who control everyone.



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I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays than on female portrays.

Mmm, it souds moe like a stereotype to me.


A stereotype is when a whole group is targeted due to it's own unique characteristics, and that group encompasses both genders. That's why Goth, Punk, Hippie, and many other labels are stereotypes, they target everyone that fits those parameters. 

A characterization that targets a specific gender in detriment of another, which also show the same parameters, but are often overlooked, that's a very primordial type of sexism. The type of sexism in the old mentality, like "Cooking and sewing is a women's work", when clearly it's something that both genders can do proficiently. 



Current PC Build

CPU - i7 8700K 3.7 GHz (4.7 GHz turbo) 6 cores OC'd to 5.2 GHz with Watercooling (Hydro Series H110i) | MB - Gigabyte Z370 HD3P ATX | Gigabyte GTX 1080ti Gaming OC BLACK 11G (1657 MHz Boost Core / 11010 MHz Memory) | RAM - Corsair DIMM 32GB DDR4, 2400 MHz | PSU - Corsair CX650M (80+ Bronze) 650W | Audio - Asus Essence STX II 7.1 | Monitor - Samsung U28E590D 4K UHD, Freesync, 1 ms, 60 Hz, 28"

lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays than on female portrays.

Mmm, it souds moe like a stereotype to me.


A stereotype is when a whole group is targeted due to it's own unique characteristics, and that group encompasses both genders. That's why Goth, Punk, Hippie, and many other labels are stereotypes, they target everyone that fits those parameters. 

A characterization that targets a specific gender in detriment of another, which also show the same parameters, but are often overlooked, that's a very primordial type of sexism. The type of sexism in the old mentality, like "Cooking and sewing is a women's work", when clearly it's something that both genders can do proficiently. 

I know what sexism is. I think emos fit in the stereotypes, don't you think? I mean, it's like a goth in a certain way.



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Weegee said:
lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays than on female portrays.

Yeah but these emo kid are always strong and independant (which is the inverse with the girl in fire emblem) and they are usualy the main character or the big bad guy who control everyone.

There are always exceptions to the rules. In FF13, you had Hope, which was probably one of the most vulnerable and unprotected male character created as of late, which constantly fell in the "whinny kid" label. In contrast, you had Vanille and Fang, which were both very independent women, with their own strong convictions and ideals, even though Vanille supposedly portrayed the "innocent damsel" role. 

And, if you see from my interchange with Khuutra, there are also quite some cases where the female protagonist is also a very strong willed female character. 

I'm not able to speak on behalf of FE, since I'm not particularly into the story of the latest FE games (i've forgotten quite a large deal of the GBA FE's stories), but to generalize that an entire gender is portrayed like "weak and dependent" based on few examples is not the correct thing to do. 

It's true that some developers do portray females (and males) with sexists characteristics, but from what I could grasp from your conversation with Khuutra, you were pinpointing japanese developers exclusively for this fault, which is far from the truth.

Sexism exists everywhere in the world, and those same kind of attitudes are found in the western world in the same frequency (if not more) than in occidental cultures.



Current PC Build

CPU - i7 8700K 3.7 GHz (4.7 GHz turbo) 6 cores OC'd to 5.2 GHz with Watercooling (Hydro Series H110i) | MB - Gigabyte Z370 HD3P ATX | Gigabyte GTX 1080ti Gaming OC BLACK 11G (1657 MHz Boost Core / 11010 MHz Memory) | RAM - Corsair DIMM 32GB DDR4, 2400 MHz | PSU - Corsair CX650M (80+ Bronze) 650W | Audio - Asus Essence STX II 7.1 | Monitor - Samsung U28E590D 4K UHD, Freesync, 1 ms, 60 Hz, 28"

I_hate_Itagaki said:

I know what sexism is. I think emos fit in the stereotypes, don't you think? I mean, it's like a goth in a certain way.

Aaaaaaaaand I'm out. Goodnight everybody! It was a fun topic, kind of!



I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:
lestatdark said:

Female protagonists, as long as they're well portrayed, with actual human similarities and their own intricacies are just as good as a well developed male protagonist. 

Some of my favourite protagonists, not only in games, but in films, are female protagonists, who exude an aura of self-esteem and ability to resolve problems, while still keeping human faucets that are intrinsic to natural human behavior. 

Aya Brea, Selen and Milennia are probably the best videogame protagonists (both female and male) ever created.

OT - I said it on another thread and I'll say it again. People nowadays have no grasp about what the actual meaning behind the word sexist really portrays. Which is an actual shame indeed, seeing how easy such a strong word is thrown around in here, with no actual direct reason as to use it. And it's also extremely funny how somehow, sexist seems to limit itself to a single gender bias against another. It works both ways.

I know you are talking about me. I know what sexism means. Strong word? Most people I met don't care about sexism (just look at the numbers of sexist anime/games, I'm pretty sure you know more than 2 of them). Sexism works both ways, but do you have exemples of games that is sexist towards men? It's quie normal that I hate sexism towards female, because it exists.

Sexism is probably one of the strongest words ever created, because it implies a very serious issue, that's still very preponderant in today's society. 

The lack of interest from most people just shows that it's not as correctly addressed as it should be.

And sexism towards men in games? Pretty easy actually. Usually young boys, kids and some young males are portrayed as annoying brats or whinny "emos" that pretty much get stick not only from men, but from most female gamers as well. It's demeaning to generalize a certain age group like, thus that demeaning act becomes a sexist act, because it's extremely frequent on male portrays than on female portrays.

Mmm, it souds moe like a stereotype to me.


A stereotype is when a whole group is targeted due to it's own unique characteristics, and that group encompasses both genders. That's why Goth, Punk, Hippie, and many other labels are stereotypes, they target everyone that fits those parameters. 

A characterization that targets a specific gender in detriment of another, which also show the same parameters, but are often overlooked, that's a very primordial type of sexism. The type of sexism in the old mentality, like "Cooking and sewing is a women's work", when clearly it's something that both genders can do proficiently. 

I know what sexism is. I think emos fit in the stereotypes, don't you think? I mean, it's like a goth in a certain way.


The "emo" portray is a stereotype. To isolate it and portray it as a male-exclusive stereotype, that's sexist, because the characteristics defining an "emo", does not discern genres. 

Just like trying to isolate and portray a low self-esteem characterization as being a female-exclusive stereotype it's sexist.



Current PC Build

CPU - i7 8700K 3.7 GHz (4.7 GHz turbo) 6 cores OC'd to 5.2 GHz with Watercooling (Hydro Series H110i) | MB - Gigabyte Z370 HD3P ATX | Gigabyte GTX 1080ti Gaming OC BLACK 11G (1657 MHz Boost Core / 11010 MHz Memory) | RAM - Corsair DIMM 32GB DDR4, 2400 MHz | PSU - Corsair CX650M (80+ Bronze) 650W | Audio - Asus Essence STX II 7.1 | Monitor - Samsung U28E590D 4K UHD, Freesync, 1 ms, 60 Hz, 28"

personally I find the female leads a lot better than the male ones, they tend to be deeper more well developed characters imo.

now this is a generalisation so there are exceptions but It tends to be that the male chars are the more one dimensional powerful, irresponsible, arrogant and brutal whereas female ones tend to be more emotive and give reasons for what they are doing, Even the more tongue in cheek characters like bayonetta have more emotion to their character and depth to their personality than a similar male character, say for example kratos

and don't get me started on cloud strife, the guy's pesonality is as thin as a piece of paper, lightning is a million times better developed and her motives are more well reasoned than his, cloud is not even a person whereas lightning is so vivid it feels like she could be an old friend. to be fair to square though cloud is their only bad male protagonist, most of them are great characters, though I am aware they fall well in the 'emo' bracket by western perceptions.

the thing is based on the fact that most leads in games have exceptional superpowers/training/abities, it makes no sense why gender would make any difference when looking at the suspension of disbelief between chars. A female with massive superpowers could easily be feasibly as strong as a male with similar powers (as the powers give the attributes normally, not the gender), especially if the majority of enemies do not have the same level of powers/training/ability (as is normally the case)

sorry If I sound sexist, I am a girl and I tend to stick mainly to rpg's due to the lack of depth of characters in male dominated genres like shooters (I also despise action movies on the same principle), I know I should let it be because most gaming genres are not supposed to have developed stories/characters (thats why I read Books, though to gamings credit some RPG stories are on par with book level stories) so sorry if i overstepped the mark. this is just my opinion, don't mean to sound like a horrible elitist/feminist or anything.



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Khuutra said:
I_hate_Itagaki said:

I know what sexism is. I think emos fit in the stereotypes, don't you think? I mean, it's like a goth in a certain way.

Aaaaaaaaand I'm out. Goodnight everybody! It was a fun topic, kind of!

Wow, great info.