| RolStoppable said: What I was saying is that your made-up story is what the Harris campaign actually did. Before it was ignorance on your part, but now it's denial. |
How could Harris enact such policies, if she was Vice President? Did you actually read what I wrote? The Biden administration did something, but by far not enough. I showed the statistics, more and more people get poor and have problems, while the rich continually gets richer. If it is all the economy, why have only the working class to take the burden? That is something policy can do something about, that is what Bernie Sanders called out. Harris couldn't do anything yet about that, she wasn't president. She did indeed though find nothing worthy to change over the Biden administration.
| RolStoppable said: Votes in California are still being counted because the deadline for mail-in ballots is apparently today; estimate is that ~25% are left to count in that state which amounts to at least 4 million votes. In other words, the final numbers of this election aren't even in yet. But more importantly, because of the American voting system you have to look at state results instead of national results, and specifically the seven swing states which were really the only ones that mattered because all the other states were regarded as secure and turned out that way too. The counting in the swing states is pretty much done, so this is worth looking at. Arizona: Harris -160k compared to Biden in 2020 (Trump +30k compared to himself in 2020); Georgia: Harris +70k (Trump +200k); Michigan: Harris -70k (Trump +150k); Nevada: Harris -10k (Trump +60k); North Carolina: Harris +0k (Trump +130k); Pennsylvania: Harris -120k (Trump +170k); Wisconsin: Harris +40k (Trump +90k). There's something of everything in these results. Arizona falls in line with your assertion that Harris lost votes that Trump didn't gain. Georgia, North Carolina and Wisconsin have both candidates gaining, but Trump moreso. Michigan, Nevada and Pennsylvania have Trump gain at the expense of Harris. |
Sure, but most is counted. And lets concede, yes maybe some former democrats now voted Trump. I assume more people came from non-voters, but that is just an assumption. The fact stays, that the majority of vote the democrats lost didn't go over to Trump.
| RolStoppable said: The working class has financial problems. The Harris campaign said "we hear you, here are concrete proposals to make things better for you" while Trump rambled about tariffs which are an additional tax on all Americans, including the working class. The fact remains that it is irrational and stupid to pick the latter option. But be my guest and deny it another time that the Harris campaign kept talking about the costs of living. |
Both campaigns had ads about pretty much everything. The Harris campaign had 1 billion dollar to burn. But what was the main messaging here? Working class? Nah. That barely made a dent. And given that under the democratic administration of Biden the working class had to suffer the economic downfall and not the rich, people got fed up to begin with. In that surrounding the messaging just wasn't convincing. There should have been more and bolder proposals.
| RolStoppable said: Lastly, you've said it before that you don't want to help the right. But that's exactly what you are doing by picking up their narrative that the Democrats are to blame for everything, with no responsibility whatsoever lying with the voters. |
The gaslighting is strong with you. I didn't pick up any right-wing propaganda. I cited Bernie Sanders, Mike Figueredo, Kyle Kulinski, Hasan Piker - actual left wingers. Not the center-right of the mass of the democratic party you are going so hard to bat for. You want to deny that any fault lies with the Democrats and that they lost big parts of the electorate because they don't care for them. You are telling people that live a harder live because of their circumstances that they should suck it up and they are being idiots and should vote dems - without expecting more than a bare minimum. You go on to state points what you make out as reasons declaring it as facts.
In denying people their reality you are actually the one helping the right, and you keep on doing so. If that is indicative of the democratic party, than probably the better course of action is not to try to reform the dems, but actually create a left-wing workers party. Because it is evident, that the current far-right Reps and center-right Dems are leaving behind more and more of the country. There is a lot of space left of them.
Last edited by Mnementh - 1 day ago
