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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Zelda hype can go down the sewers if...

griffinA said:
hsrob said:
twesterm said:
68soul said:
hsrob said:
No chance, too many loyaly fans earned over the years. There is no way a new franchise could engender such loyalty. Plus if making a Zelda-like game that is actually better than Zelda was so easy why hasn't anyone tried yet?

 

That's important to notice: in an industry full of copycats, releasing tens of Nintendogs and Wii Sports wannabees (amongst many others, from RPG's to shooters), where are the action/adventure games that could equal the Legend of Zelda, and where are the platformers that could equal Super Mario? If Nintendo's so lazy, it should be really easy to do even better, at least a couple of times each year, right? :)

But strangely, nothing... of course, there are other good action/adventures, and other good platformers... but with such a creativity? Such brillant level designs? Such perfect controls? And so many things right, and perfectly blended in the same package?

I could wait for another decade, or i'd have stopped gaming if Nintendo wasn't there... but i'm not a "hardcore gamer", i'm just a Nintendo fan, so of course, i don't know what i'm talking about, i know nothing about what makes a game really great...  :))

To be fair I think the rest of the industry has caught up to Zelda in the terms of action/adventure (they haven't caught up to it in integrating puzzles for the most part) though there still isn't much that comes close to the sublime platforming of a Mario title.

Look I agree, I don't think Zelda can any longer claim to be king of all that is action/adventure or all aspects of gameplay that the genre entails, but what I meant is that no one has made a game to compete directly with Zelda in it's own space the way say Crash Bandicoot was pitted against Mario 64 in the Playstation 1 era.

Some people (not me) would probably argue that Okami came pretty close to equaling a Zelda game.

You and I had better hope that Monty isn't around because while I agree that Okami is a very good game, I feel it's lacking something that I can't quite put my finger on.



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Khuutra said:
Guys it is perfectly reasonable to think that another Zelda-style game would eventually be better than Zelda. There's nothing wrong with it.

Hell, I'm pretty sure some (Hi, Montana) would argue that Okami already did that.

If Shadow of Colossus had more bosses and some enemies on field, it would be on par to me...



Nothing would kill Zelda hype. Zelda is Zelda. Just like not even Forza could kill GT hype, etc.



Khuutra said:
Guys it is perfectly reasonable to think that another Zelda-style game would eventually be better than Zelda. There's nothing wrong with it.

Hell, I'm pretty sure some (Hi, Montana) would argue that Okami already did that.

It's reasonable to think it but it is also reasonable to think that Zelda will still continue to be one of the greatest franchises in the history of gaming even so many years after the first game int he series.  Seems like a mute point eh.  Obviously I'm quite a huge Zelda fan (even admittedly to that of Outlaw as a fanboy) but when it comes to Zelda there is just something special about it when you play a game in that franchise... someting I don't feel too often for many other series.

 

I'm not going to argue against another series possibly (or maybe already) having the potential to be better than a Zelda game, but I just want to make sure that series knows that it isn't just facing any great series but one of the masterpieces of the gaming industry as a whole.



twesterm said:
68soul said:
hsrob said:
No chance, too many loyaly fans earned over the years. There is no way a new franchise could engender such loyalty. Plus if making a Zelda-like game that is actually better than Zelda was so easy why hasn't anyone tried yet?

 

That's important to notice: in an industry full of copycats, releasing tens of Nintendogs and Wii Sports wannabees (amongst many others, from RPG's to shooters), where are the action/adventure games that could equal the Legend of Zelda, and where are the platformers that could equal Super Mario? If Nintendo's so lazy, it should be really easy to do even better, at least a couple of times each year, right? :)

But strangely, nothing... of course, there are other good action/adventures, and other good platformers... but with such a creativity? Such brillant level designs? Such perfect controls? And so many things right, and perfectly blended in the same package?

I could wait for another decade, or i'd have stopped gaming if Nintendo wasn't there... but i'm not a "hardcore gamer", i'm just a Nintendo fan, so of course, i don't know what i'm talking about, i know nothing about what makes a game really great...  :))

To be fair I think the rest of the industry has caught up to Zelda in the terms of action/adventure (they haven't caught up to it in integrating puzzles for the most part) though there still isn't much that comes close to the sublime platforming of a Mario title.

 

You're right, the most "basic" aspects of Zelda may have been equalled in a few occasions: combats with impressive bosses, immersive quests, huge worlds to explore, light puzzle or platforming elements, all of these may be found in many other (good to excellent) games...

But the Zelda's puzzles and the use of the weapons, the way they're designed in the dungeons and become one of the main ingredient of the serie, that's something i've never experienced elsewhere, not even in Okami or Metroid Prime...

And in the end, the sum of all its parts has that little bit of extra magic, something "special" i just can't name, but bring me joy and fun... :)

Now, i'd like to be wrong, and i'd like to play more and more games in that vein... as many said, Okami was one of the only very good example... and the Team Ico games are also awesome: but even then, there should be at least a handful of these to make me buy another console...

If PS3 had a decent backwards compatibility, i'd definitely buy Ico and Shadow of the Colossus in addition to the Last Guardian... but when you look at the numbers of games released each year, on all consoles, that's not much, not much at all... 4 or 5 games in that vein and of this quality, in the last 10 years? And with the exception of Okami, they're not really "Zelda-like" anyway...

And no one to say the gaming industry is lazy, of couuurse...  :)

The fact is, it takes a lot of time and lot of talent to create a 50 hours-long adventure of such a quality, and the genre isn't as popular as 1st person shooters or RPG's... plus, if you create a really original game, with a deep story and a unique visual style, it may alienate a large part of the "hardcore mass market", as we've seen with Okami, so... no guarantee to make profits... that's sad, but it must be one of the main reason, i guess...



 

"A beautiful drawing in 480i will stay beautiful forever...

and an ugly drawing in 1080p will stay ugly forever..."

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its impossible to kill Zelda hype.. i mean that game has been around for years.. the game is immortal to gamers eyes lol




SIXAXIS redux?



I dunno.. Have you seen Sony's list of launch games for the wand? It's a freakin joke! Definitely tells me they don't care much about supporting the wand so I doubt they'd take the time to make an epic Zelda like adventure game for it.



68soul said:
hsrob said:
No chance, too many loyaly fans earned over the years. There is no way a new franchise could engender such loyalty. Plus if making a Zelda-like game that is actually better than Zelda was so easy why hasn't anyone tried yet?

 

That's important to notice: in an industry full of copycats, releasing tens of Nintendogs and Wii Sports wannabees (amongst many others, from RPG's to shooters), where are the action/adventure games that could equal the Legend of Zelda, and where are the platformers that could equal Super Mario? If Nintendo's so lazy, it should be really easy to do even better, at least a couple of times each year, right? :)

But strangely, nothing... of course, there are other good action/adventures, and other good platformers... but with such a creativity? Such brillant level designs? Such perfect controls? And so many things right, and perfectly blended in the same package?

I could wait for another decade, or i'd have stopped gaming if Nintendo wasn't there... but i'm not a "hardcore gamer", i'm just a Nintendo fan, so of course, i don't know what i'm talking about, i know nothing about what makes a game really great...  :))

I personally thought -for example- that Okami was a better Zelda than Z:TP. It had creativity and good design in spades, though my experience was marred by some pacing problems.

As for "basic" platformers, I've often wondered why it isn't a much more trodden path nowadays. I love playing LBP with friends, but it's more of a physics-based controlled chaos -fun- experience than a skill rewarding one.

Edit: I see that the Okami case has been furthered by others as I was slowly jumping between the compiler window and typing. I'll take your responses to those other posts :)



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman

Yea.. I can totally play a PS3 game on my Wii.



Pixel Art can be fun.