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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - IGN N-Podcast 60 and Summary - How Wii doesn't even compare to Current Gen.

Listening to the podcast myself finally... and first thing I hear "This is Craig Harris, Daemon Hatfield, and Greg Miller" and I knew exactly how it was going to go down from that point on.

You've got the guy that panned NSMB Wii for no having online co-op, the guy that has trolled the Wii on one of the other podcasts, and the guy that always reviews Wii game multiplats lower than their HD counterparts even if they're the same game and said the PSP Chinatown Wars blows the DS game away lulz.

Honestly this is not a true Nintendo voice chat podcast since it only has ONE guy from the Nintendo team.



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wick said:
The_vagabond7 said:

There is only one of two possibilities with the wii.

Either (A)The wii isn't directly competing with the PS360. It intentionally is a side step to target a different market, and has little to do with the original gaming market that the PS360 attempt to continue to tap like conventional consoles in the past.

or (B) The wii is attempting to directly compete with the PS360. It tries to have it's cake and eat it too. It wants the new market of freshly inducted "for fun" gamers that don't take it too seriously, and also is trying to get the traditional gamer that listens to Videogame podcasts and has more than one Videogame website in their bookmarks to check regularly, and will spend more of their money and time on gaming than the former group.

If it's (A) then the wii is a smashing success. But the loyal Nintendo fans don't want to hear it called this, unless it is in the most praising glowing terms of Nintendo's Genius and various maelstrom colloquialisms on Nintendo's daring and foresight. Should some one say it's a great system for kids, and grandma, and something you break out for parties and collects dust the rest of the time, it is a condescending travesty and trolling. Even though the expanded market is kids and older adults, and new people who don't invest that much time or money in gaming.

If A is true, then it is no wonder the enthusiast press is very sour on it, they are not the market for it. And just like a food critic is under no professional obligation to praise McDonalds up and down for it's populace appeal, salty and fatty meals that many find tasty, and their competitive marketing to poor minorities, the enthusiast press is under no obligation to praise Nintendo up and down for taking alot of shortcuts, adding no frills, overcharging for a cheap product, and marketing it to people that don't play many videogames just because it's a success at doing that. The general populace can be satisfied with it and the enthusiast press can still call them out for them making an extreme profit with business savvy at the expense of the inexperienced, non enthusiast consumer. There is no wrong doing there, they are not forced to pander to enthusiast gamers who are also extreme Nintendo loyalists. And the new market isn't reading their website, and don't even know IGN exists.

If (B) is true then Nintendo has just done an atrocious job, and they should rightly be called out on it. If the wii is meant to compete with the PS360, then it is only fair to directly compare it to the other two, in which case it is overpriced, underpowered, and is missing a ton of functionality. The PS360 will both have motion control in some fashion next year, the wii won't have the same online functionality, horsepower, streamlined multimedia functions, ect. If (B) is true, it's not a different experience, it's a lesser experience. Even if you personally don't mind inputting a 12 digit friend code for every person in each game individually, and can't tell who's playing what without popping in different games, or calling them first to co-ordinate you gaming, the other systems offer something drastically better in their online functionality. If (B) is true then there is no wrongdoing on the part of the press because they are perfectly justified on calling Nintendo out on apathetically offering an inferior system.

IGN is calling it like it sees it. The ones complaining are largely just Nintendo loyalists that would rather have them cup Nintendo's balls while they are working the shaft. That's not how it works. They called the 360 out for it's terrible hardware, they've panned the PS3 for it's atrocious launch, PSN's constant game of catch up to LIVE , it's inferior ports, and stupid failures such as "HOME". It's not isolated to just the problems the wii has. I have a wii, I love my wii for what it is, but I acknowledge it has it's abundance of faults. I listen to Nintendo Voice Chat every week, and I didn't hear anything this week that I disagree with. Trying to say that the enthusiasts press's view of the wii is totally unjustified is just putting fanboy blinders on. It's a good system for children and grandma's to pull out every few months, but for people that actually play games (IE the people that go to discuss them on websites) it's got a host of problems that shouldn't be ignored. I can buy No More Heroes 2 on day 1, and still say that the wii has god awful online functionality, and is missing alot of features for the price it sells at. That doesn't make me or the gamers at IGN raging trolls.

Option C: The Wii was built to make Nintendo money.................... Success.

C can fit into A or B without altering either, and thus doesn't need to be a category unto itself.



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Khuutra said:
noname2200 said:
So, I'm not sure how much longer this thread is going to go, but if there are any folks here who are looking for a great Nintendo podcast to replace the never-all-that-fun IGN one, I'd like to suggest Radio Free Nintendo. It's funny, it's not-at-all fanboyish (all the cast have other systems too, and talk about those games at least once per episode), and the Retroactive's are AWESOME. Download the Super Metroid one in particular; I'm sure it'll make you want to listen to more.

Subscribed to the RSS feed. Thanks!

Hope you enjoy it! This week was especially interesting: they had a guest who went from IGN to Nintendo PR to Pandemic Studios. Quite the oddysey.

Oh, and see if you can find the Zelda II retroactive. I think you'd appreciate it.



noname2200 said:
Khuutra said:

Subscribed to the RSS feed. Thanks!

Hope you enjoy it! This week was especially interesting: they had a guest who went from IGN to Nintendo PR to Pandemic Studios. Quite the oddysey.

Oh, and see if you can find the Zelda II retroactive. I think you'd appreciate it.

"I think it necessary to take a 'Be Depressed' moment here, if you'll indulge me. Lucas - just a matter of a few days into the New Year, in response to a talk-back thread about this very podcast, you said this: 'Sorry guys, afeter listening to some other podcasts and then listening to this one, NWR's podcast doesn't hook me anymore"

"Fuuuuuuuuuuck"

This is pretty great



hsrob said:
Gnizmo said:
The_vagabond7 said:

If you really think that the wii has trouble rendering 7 or 8 goombas at a time, or can't "process" having more somewhere in the level waiting for you, I'm guessing you don't really know how computer specs work either. The wii isn't a beast by any stretch of the imagination, but come on, look at the game!

 

 

 

That is not the pinnacle of what the wii can handle! Do you think those koopa troopers are more complex than the enemies in the conduit? Really? You think those teeter totter physics are more intense than those of Boom blox? Or is it the combination of the teeter totter physics with the koopa troopa, and keeping track of which direction those coins are moving that is really pushing it?

The best explanation I can think of is they looked at it in terms of network latency. The Wii couldn't handle all of that and keep an acceptably low ping under most circumstances. Some games handle some slow down better than others, and NSMBWii does require twitch reflexes on occasion.

Besides the explanation of wanting to focus on local multiplayer I think this is the only reasonable explanation for not including online.

Have played 232 hours on Mario Kart (most of it online) I can very much see how the kind of problems seen in it's online could reek havoc on a 2D Mario game and before you say it I have decent internet with low ping. 

In Mario Kart I can't count the number of times that I have crossed the line in first place only to discover i've actually finished second or third.  I once spent an entire race against one other person comfortably holding off their challenge but wondering why they didn't use their red shells to then discover i was the one actually sitting in second place for the entire race.  Weapons, particularly shells, can be extremely unreliable online, I've had shells materialise under the wheels of my kart, karts appear in front of my eyes as if from no where but in the end Mario Kart still works because it still has one very basic principle to fall back on.  Weapons might play a role in the game but if latency causes issues with collision detection and precise positions of characters and items on the track the game can still rely on ye olde, who get's from point A to point B the fastest.

This simply wouldn't be good enough in a competitive or cooperative game of NSMBWii because it's not about who gets from point A to point B the fastest.  It's primarly about interaction with the other characters and items on screen in a very precise fashion.  What happens when your partner throws a koopa shell against a pipe which rebounds and kills you even though the koopa is still walking undisturbed on your screen?  What happens when the game goes to recalculate the precise positions of the four characters on the screen and discovers that the leading character and trailing character are actually four screens apart?

Now maybe someone who knows more about network latency and how Nintendo handles it's online can tell me that these problems could be overcome in NSMBWii but these are the problems that first occured to me when I thought about the possibility of online on in this game.

Bingo.  Great post.



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Khuutra said:
noname2200 said:
Khuutra said:

Subscribed to the RSS feed. Thanks!

Hope you enjoy it! This week was especially interesting: they had a guest who went from IGN to Nintendo PR to Pandemic Studios. Quite the oddysey.

Oh, and see if you can find the Zelda II retroactive. I think you'd appreciate it.

"I think it necessary to take a 'Be Depressed' moment here, if you'll indulge me. Lucas - just a matter of a few days into the New Year, in response to a talk-back thread about this very podcast, you said this: 'Sorry guys, afeter listening to some other podcasts and then listening to this one, NWR's podcast doesn't hook me anymore"

"Fuuuuuuuuuuck"

This is pretty great

Where was that one from?



noname2200 said:
Khuutra said:

"I think it necessary to take a 'Be Depressed' moment here, if you'll indulge me. Lucas - just a matter of a few days into the New Year, in response to a talk-back thread about this very podcast, you said this: 'Sorry guys, afeter listening to some other podcasts and then listening to this one, NWR's podcast doesn't hook me anymore"

"Fuuuuuuuuuuck"

This is pretty great

Where was that one from?

The beginning of the podcast that includes the beginning of the Zelda II retrospective.

...

...Kinda makes me want to try out making a forum member-driven podcast.



Khuutra said:

The beginning of the podcast that includes the beginning of the Zelda II retrospective.

...

...Kinda makes me want to try out making a forum member-driven podcast.

Ah, I see you beat me to it then! It's been a while since I listened to it, but I remember that the whole time I was thinking to myself "that's a good point" AND "psh, wusses."

The podcast idea's a good one. I remember Zucas once proposed doing something similar, but I'd imagine it'd take a ton of effort to pull off.



noname2200 said:
Khuutra said:

The beginning of the podcast that includes the beginning of the Zelda II retrospective.

...

...Kinda makes me want to try out making a forum member-driven podcast.

Ah, I see you beat me to it then! It's been a while since I listened to it, but I remember that the whole time I was thinking to myself "that's a good point" AND "psh, wusses."

The podcast idea's a good one. I remember Zucas once proposed doing something similar, but I'd imagine it'd take a ton of effort to pull off.

Maybe not. The harder part would be trying to make sure people have like two free hours. I'm sure we have plenty of folks who would be willing to participate, and it wouldn't be hard to divide them up so we could get a regular rotation going.



My predictions are very solid and reliable to happen.

I'm still predicting 500+ posts in this thread till 17 December 00H00 (GMTzero)