They are no longer a gaming company for gamers, their a gaming company for non gamers.

Alby_da_Wolf said: It's me or walls of text made of white characters on gray background are almost unreadable?

It's not just you xD

But if you look at the latest, I summarized all his points in an easy-to-read way, and then responded to each individual point.

amp316 said:
I'm going to start all of my threads with the name Malstrom from now on.

Threads that start with the name Malstrom always get over 200 responses.

@ dahuman )

No, the argument would still holds weight, because you don't "need" something that is purely _optional_.

And all MS has to do is implement the recognization software, so you can use a range of different objects and then make it mandatory for "360-licensed" plastic models to have wristbands (although I think that may be not needed as those likely weigh far less than a wiimote).They don't need to manufacture those themselves.

From my understanding that should protect them from possible lawsuits as people could have used different objects (e.g. the "safe" licensed models) or no object at all to play.

OMG this is going to be long.

I should have stopped caring about your post when you started to talk about "hardcore" and casuals. Seiously, do you even know what "Hardcore" is? Starcraft is a hardcore game, with a competitive arena and E-sport status, Gears of war is not! It's casual. Counterstrike is more of a Hardcore game, Killzone is not! People that do godly speedruns of Super Mario Bros, the lost levels are hardcore. People that trash talk over Xbox live are not! Seriously people need to get the difference!

To quote you from earlier in the thread: "It's inevitable, MS will take over the gaming industry. Look at all it's gained in it's short time in the industry against heavily established, deeply entrenched companies like Sony and Nintendo. Do you think it's going to stop? BTW, you are aware that the HD consoles are getting closer and closer to the Wii's sales, right?"

Yea, you never said microsoft wouldn't take over the gaming industry, riiiiiight.

Looks like it's time for me to go get my Wii bingo board, I think I can get at least one bingo from this :P.

You are assuming:

1: Controllers need to get even more innovative, like it's some kind of tech race. lol

2: Microsoft and Sony will push the technology and the ideas that Nintendo introduced beyond what Nintendo is capable off.

3: Microsoft has better strategies than Sony or Nintendo, and that they will never ever let go if they get a grip on the industry.

4: Nintendo haven't responded to Sony's and Microsoft's attempts at invading the new market.

5: Just because Nintendo cannot survive as many mistakes as Sony and MS, they are bound to make as many mistakes.

6: BAAAAWWWWW Nintendo betrayed the "Hardcore" Their core franchises are too few and far between.

7: Titles like Wii sports and Wii fit are shovelware.

8: "HARDCORE!!!1!!!11!!1" titles don't sell on Nintendo systems.

9: Motion controls is everything that separate Nintendo from the competition.

10: Apple is going to enter that market, and together with MS they are going to OMG PWN everything.

As for my answers:

1: It's not a tech race. Everything boils down to what the software can do with the interface. HD systems are very expensive to develop for unlike the Wii. This means that it is highly unlikely that Sony and MS will ever be able to provode enough motion control software for the systems to be able to compete with the Wii.

2: Nintendo are experts when it comes to hardware. No need to worry about them. Oh sorry, I forgot, they are d00med!

3: Microsoft having a better strategy than Sony this gen is just because of the mistakes Sony made, counting them out in the next generation is just stupid. Nintendo have proven that they have the best and most profitable strategy, Microsoft is still stuck using their tricks from their PC buisness.

4: Nintendo revealed the motion plus at E3 2008, because that's when they expected the competition to introduce their motion controls. But the competition was just too slow. Nintendo was way ahead all the time. Nintendo is ready for whatever the others will do to counbter.

5: You cannot predict if a company is going to make mistakes. Nintendo has made mistakes in the past, but so far, Iwatas strategy has proven itself to be almost flawless. You cannot predict something as random as mistakes to be the downfall of Nintendo. Wait, I forgot, Nintendo are d00med!

6: Are you seriously even trying to make sense? The Wii was the first Nintendo system ever to launch with a Zelda game. Nintendo titles are coming out faster than any other Nintendo system before it. It's great to be a Nintendo fan these days with Nintendo games coming out this fast. Three Marios in the same gen haven't happened since the NES!

7:The titles are quality. You just don't like them becuse they are not made for you.

8: When is the last time a REAL game was made for Wii that was not by Nintrendo? We got a black and white slaughter fest, a GTA clone that wasn't as good as GTA (No more heroes fans, pleas don't hate me. I didn't mean what I said, it's just what the game looks like the first time you look at it.) And, of course the bloody "hardcore you've been waiting for" LIGHT GUN GAME. How about third parties make an RPG? A true Final Fantasy game perhaps? How about an FPS that's built for Wii not PS2? How about a decent 3D fighter like Soul Calibur and not some spinoff? After these games show up, we can talk about sales. Also your definition of "hardore" games, just like many others is really messed up

9: What separates Nintendo from the competition is not just tech. It's their software and buisness model.

10: Apple would be foolish to enter such a crowded market. They are much better off just trying to disrupt from elsewere (iPhone, iPod)

I said microsoft was going to take over the industry as in become number 1. Becoming number one does not equal a monopoly, which is what I pointed out never to have said. I simply said this is how microsoft thinks, it is their goal, wether they meet it or not.

You seem to be confusing niche with hardcore. I'm using hardcore in the simplest terms. A game made for traditional gamers would fall under 'hardcore'. Hardcore is just a term to differentiate the nature of one class of games vs. the nature of another class of games. It is simply for naming purposes, so everyone knows what I'm talking about. I'm not going to come up with the most accurate politically correct label and have no one understand what I'm saying. You may disagree with the categorizations, but did you not instantly know the games I might be refering too? Mission accomplished.

You also seem to be equating 'hardcore' with popular. Just because a game is popular does not make it 'casual' or whatever u'd like to call it. Shooters have become the most popular genre. A decade and a half ago shooters only existed on PCs and were the pride and joy of diehard computer gamers. Suddenly they've reached a broader audience in the console market and become very popular so their casual? Did the nature of the genre change or something? No it has not. If anything the genre has continued to evolve.

Games from Gears to Valkyria chronicles no matter how they sell are 'hardcore'. These games take years to make and place heavy emphasis on battle systems, a intuitive HUD, storylines and more efficient gameplay mechanics etc. They are made for the traditional gamer. The traditional gamer doesn't have to be taught that in a conventional JRPG players have to exchange blows in a manner similar to a board game. They don't have to be taught what HP means or XPs and leveling up systems. All these aspects of gameplay are assumed by the developers. My mother is 55 years old. She knows what a phone is and can use one but if I give her my Iphone she'll find it nearly impossible to make a call. The original Iphone had a fairly intuitive UI for a cell phone yet none of us would take more than an 30 mins (at the absolute most) to learn the general ins and outs of the phone. This is because we speak a universal language OS language. We all know what a widget is and what it's there for. In all their shapes, sizes and names, a widget is a widget. Someone like my mother just doesn't understand that. Games and gamers are no different. We all speak a universal game language. A language that the casual gamers that make up most of the Wii's userbase simply don't speak. Hence, the games are simplified. They are dumbed down so they can be more accesible. How are games ever gonna continue to evolve if the Wii iteration of games becomes the standard?

Nintendo definitely turned up the heat this E3 but why are you praising them for it. This was their obligation. I don't know if you recall, last E3 was just starved of games for the traditional gamer. The E3 before that wasn't as bad but still warranted a lackluster review. You got 3 marios in one E3. Amazing. One of these marios is a multiplayer iteration of all the 2d marios. Idc that it's a new storyline with new power ups and enemies blah blah. The game is nothing more than Nintendo recycling age old IP's. On an HD console it would hold the title of arcade game at best. I wonder how much 360 or PS3 would be getting bashed if they announced 3 gears and 3 MGS games along with fable 3 and halo 4 as their big hardcore titles? Nintendo is so removed from the traditional gamer that they don't even attempt to make new IPs. They simply release the 10th or 15th sequel of every major franchise they've made over the last 27 years.

I no longer support Nintendo because I've outgrown them. The main reason is because they're boring and safe. Zelda is my favorite franchise of all time, and even my beloved Zelda is losing it's luster. At least for me. You might be as excited as ever, idk. Then again, what choice do you have? A sequel is all you're gonna get from Nintendo. That and Wii fit.

edited to get rid of massive block of quotations. Good god dude - Torillian