By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming Discussion - Is it so wrong to hate "casual" games?

BMaker11 on 13 May 2009
noname2200 said:
BMaker11 said:
Killergran said:
Basically, you are upset that people do not have the same taste as you do. Spin it any way you want and this is still what it comes down to in the end.

And it's because people don't share his taste, the "gamer" taste, the kind of games he enjoys most won't end up on his system, because the casual games sell millions, while his types of games flop. Developers see the trend and think "do I spend tons of money and years to make a game, of do I toss in $5, make crap, and have it sell 10M? Yea, I'll take the latter option"

I dunno. I mean, most developers are still making big-budget HD games and losing cash hand over fist. Over a tenth of the American game designers were fired last year, and studios are closing at alarming rates.

Long story short, I don't think you have to worry that your favorite developers will suddenly get some business sense.

 

Other than Lair, Haze, and Too Human (of note), how many HD games with "big budgets" have lost money? Stuff like movie tie ins and Naurto: Rise of the Ninja aren't big budget. And other than Free Radical, what studios have closed, and who's been fired?

 



Around the Network
BMaker11 on 13 May 2009
Killergran said:
BMaker11 said:

And it's because people don't share his taste, the "gamer" taste, the kind of games he enjoys most won't end up on his system, because the casual games sell millions, while his types of games flop. Developers see the trend and think "do I spend tons of money and years to make a game, of do I toss in $5, make crap, and have it sell 10M? Yea, I'll take the latter option"

Apart from the "Toss in $5, make crap" part, you're absolutely right.

Good casual games take time and money to develop.

And you're just saying they don't because you're upset that people have different taste than you do.

 

Carnival Games took time and lots of money? Rayman took time and lots of money? Mario and Sonic took time and lots of money?

If by time and money you mean a year, maybe less, and a couple million, then yes these games took "time and money". But they are no Zelda, they are no Halo, and they definitely are no MGS4.

It's not a matter of people having different tastes than me. I know this, and it's precisely why I don't have a Wii. I just see the trend in games that the Wii is receiving and made a decent conclusion, which I think the OP failed to make, and now he's upset. People have different tastes, yes. And those "different tastes" are grounded in the Wii. And those tastes are cheap, multiplayer, party-style, casual games. Not "Halo" or "Madden" casual, but "Mario Party" casual

 



Viper1 on 13 May 2009
BMaker11 said:
noname2200 said:
BMaker11 said:
Killergran said:
Basically, you are upset that people do not have the same taste as you do. Spin it any way you want and this is still what it comes down to in the end.

And it's because people don't share his taste, the "gamer" taste, the kind of games he enjoys most won't end up on his system, because the casual games sell millions, while his types of games flop. Developers see the trend and think "do I spend tons of money and years to make a game, of do I toss in $5, make crap, and have it sell 10M? Yea, I'll take the latter option"

I dunno. I mean, most developers are still making big-budget HD games and losing cash hand over fist. Over a tenth of the American game designers were fired last year, and studios are closing at alarming rates.

Long story short, I don't think you have to worry that your favorite developers will suddenly get some business sense.

 

Other than Lair, Haze, and Too Human (of note), how many HD games with "big budgets" have lost money? Stuff like movie tie ins and Naurto: Rise of the Ninja aren't big budget. And other than Free Radical, what studios have closed, and who's been fired?

 

Read many fiscal year earning reports lately?  How about keeping up with the news.  Several studios have closed and thousands of employees have lost their jobs in the last 2 years.

 



The rEVOLution is not being televised

noname2200 on 13 May 2009
BMaker11 said:

Other than Lair, Haze, and Too Human (of note), how many HD games with "big budgets" have lost money?

Off the top of my head that I can cite sources for? Prince of Persia, Brothers in Arms: Hell's Highway, John Woo's Stranglehold, Mirror's Edge, End War, Turning Point: Fall of Liberty, Heavenly Sword...

There's more, of course, but these are the ones I know I can find a source on and which have occured to me in the past ten seconds.

BMaker11 said:

Stuff like movie tie ins and Naurto: Rise of the Ninja aren't big budget.

 

Movie and T.V. licenses are actually pretty expensive to get. They're also very coveted by producers, since unlike many other games they're basically guaranteed to make a profit due to popular familiarity.

BMaker11 said:

And other than Free Radical, what studios have closed...

 

Midway...Ensemble....Psuedo Interactive...Sega Racing Studio...ACES Studios...Iron Lore...Stormfront...Castaway...Perpetual Entertainment...Factor 5(?)...Brash Entertainment...NCSoft UK...Pivotal...Venom...Flagship...Big Huge Games...Black Box Studios...Locomotive Games...Paradigm...Mass Media...Sandblast Games...

Again, these are just off the top of my head. I can look for more, if you like, as there are plenty more to be found...

BMaker11 said:

...and who's been fired?

 

http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/WandaMeloni/20090508/1344/The_Brief__The_Gaming_Renaissance_Movement.php

"From July 2008 until now there have been over 60 companies that have publicly announced layoffs, with the majority of these layoffs coming just in the past four months.

I have tallied up these figures and a staggering 8450 game industry professionals have been laid off since July. Of these, roughly 6300 or 75% are from North America, with the remainder coming from the UK and Asia. Game Developer Research’s latest Game Developer Census 2008 Report published November 2008 estimated the North American gaming workforce to be 53,900. That puts the current game industry layoffs in the North American at 12% of the total workforce.

On top of the layoffs at least 13 studios including Microsoft’s ACES Studio and Ensemble Studio have announced they were closing. A handful of others are on life support, operating with a skeletal workforce and actively looking for buyers. Yesterday’s news that 3D Realms closed its doors make it just another causality."

 

 

 



Mr Khan on 13 May 2009
MontanaHatchet said:
The Ghost of RubangB said:
If there is a market for games, the games will be made. The only reason for anybody to stop making non-casual games is if non-casual gamers disappear. They spend lots of money on games, and people want that money.

Please name a single company that has stopped making hardcore games to make only casual games. Just one.

I think Majesco fits that criteria, although I dare to get involved in this thread.

 

True, but Majesco was on the brink of complete annihilation. It was "casualize or perish" not "casualize and make more money or not casualize and keep going normally"

 

Equally true for other companies that have embraced that philosophy. Companies on the ropes like THQ and Atari. No single healthy company has done it yet

 



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Around the Network
Lolcislaw on 13 May 2009

I really enjoy casual games such as Wii Sports or Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games. I like story telling games but playing simple titles with your friends and family is just priceless, or just to simply relax and play something for 15 minutes in breaks beetween revision. The hate comes mainly from the fact that the "hardcore" dislike the  "casual" console.

Plus people forget that games like: madden, mario, zelda, gta , halo , mgs , Gran turismo czy CoD do have huge casual appeal, because in order to achieve such sales this appeal is needed.



Bobbuffalo on 13 May 2009
Lolcislaw said:

Plus people forget that games like: madden, mario, zelda, gta , halo , mgs , Gran turismo czy CoD do have huge casual appeal, because in order to achieve such sales this appeal is needed.

Exactly. Let's not forget that games like Doom, Myst and GTA3 were huge successes in "casual" users because they aimed to the whole spectrum of gamers while games like Okami, Madworld and Killer 7 bombed because they were just noticed by a reduced size of gamers. If you want to succeded you can't be subjective.

 



novasonic on 13 May 2009

who cares. just play your games.




8th gen predictions. (made early 2014)
PS4: 60-65m
WiiU: 30-35m
X1: 30-35m
3DS: 80-85m
PSV: 15-20m

Killergran on 13 May 2009
BMaker11 said:

Carnival Games took time and lots of money? Rayman took time and lots of money? Mario and Sonic took time and lots of money?

If by time and money you mean a year, maybe less, and a couple million, then yes these games took "time and money". But they are no Zelda, they are no Halo, and they definitely are no MGS4.

It's not a matter of people having different tastes than me. I know this, and it's precisely why I don't have a Wii. I just see the trend in games that the Wii is receiving and made a decent conclusion, which I think the OP failed to make, and now he's upset. People have different tastes, yes. And those "different tastes" are grounded in the Wii. And those tastes are cheap, multiplayer, party-style, casual games. Not "Halo" or "Madden" casual, but "Mario Party" casual

I've read this post a couple of times now, and I still cannot see your point. Could you please enlighten me as to what it is you want to say?

 



This is invisible text!