It's called having internet access at work. I do 90% of my posting at work. Given the fact that whenever I'm turn on my 360 when I get home, I see Benga Benga along with half of VGChartz, It's safe to assume that a lot of us post from work.

Side note: As for you other post, I find it certainly is irony. All of the patches, game updates, and mandatory installs are the worse thing to ever come this generation. It's part of the reason that the games of this generation have been bug filled messes. If you took off the goggles you might actually see this.

Darc, I'm sorry if you think that's the worst thing that's happened this gen.

Personally mine would be for my roomate to return his console to Microsoft for the 3rd time because his disc tray no longer works from being tipped over. That, or chewing through brand new games because the systems disc tray is a pile of sh*t. THAT, or paying $50 a year just to play online with my friends >_>

Mandatory installs is a minor concern that does not warrant this type of criticism, effort, and or time. It sucks sure, but your looking at the fly in the room while the elephant is destroying your couch. Every console this gen has some huge problems, and this is one of the worse we can come up with about the PS3? Please. I'd prefer we nag on the PS3 for being too expensive.

 Yep. I have a 60 gig, and 27 retail games. Still have pleanty of HD space too. It's not all roses mind you, but the PS3/HD/mandatory install situation has easy solutions for those with encroaching memory issues.

Dirty, there is so much cherry picking in your following posts, it's nasty.

That is actually pathetic, going on gaming forums in stead of actually working.  Hope you get paid for the work you do, which sounds minimal at best.

If Uncharted did it, everyone else should also do it.

You seem to be missing my larger point. Installs are just part of the problem. Things that have annoyed me about PC gaming seems to be weasling their way into our consoles and no seems to give damn. Look at Jo21's comment about Nintendo having patches next gen. That's not a good thing.

The set top box philosphy of Sony and MS are bringing things into console gaming that fly in the face of why consoles were created in the first place. The fact that no one seems to give a damn makes it the worse thing that has happened this generation. It's a trend that will likely carry on to the next generation and with a growing number of games being on both console and PC. It makes me wonder why I should pay $60 for something I can pick up on PC for $40 to $50. The convenience factor has diminished greatly this gen and it's showing no signs of subsiding in the next.

The hardware issues MS has had this gen are terrible. So where the hardware issues Sony had with PS1 and PS2. So where the hardware issues Nintendo had with the Famicom/NES. Nintendo has had stellar hardware since. Sony has gotten its act together with the PS3's reliablity and MS is unlikely to have the same issues next gen, but the patches/updates/installs will still be an issue and probably a more prevalent one at that.

Since PC's have better graphics for the same hardware price tag, and cheaper software, why buy a console if it has all the same downsides? Consoles are great because they are simple to use, turn on fast, no patching or games randomly not working (in theory), no installs, and their main use is to just play games. If consoles are going to mimick PC's, then I'd rather buy a PC since it has a greater set of uses (office use, better internet, graphics, and other general purpose uses)

The sad part is, is that no one seems to care that the simplicity of console gaming is being thrown away, and it isn't just the installs, it is all the downsides to PC gaming, like patches.

Well first and foremost, were really not talking about the same price, that argument has been beaten to death by so many people, and I'd rather not prompt it again in here. Your simply putting your own words to what you think a console should be doing. To me, I don't see the difficulty in mandatory installs, it's still "simple". You put the disc in, and it tells you what to do. Yes it sucks, I'm not going to argue with you there, but it's not like the hardware has changed and there's a "need" for an install, it's just developers at that point. And you'll notice not all games do it.

There still fast to boot, patches shouldn't be viewed as a bad thing as they can tweak the online play when needed (which almost every game that's ever been played extensively online has needed), and our games always work. It's still an entertainment system that built for those values, not for it's ability to help you out with work and such. PC gaming and Console gaming are still worlds apart in terms of purpose and function.

The big thing that consoles have going for them is that all the hardware is the same. That's what draws my favor towards console gaming vs pc gaming. I don't have to worry about drivers, I don't need to worry about specs, I don't need to worry about shit running in the background that might interfere with my gaming, and I don't need to worry about virus's. Installs have so little to do with anything. And the day you get 4 player games on your 15" monitor is the day I worry about the gaming community o.O;

So while I'll agree that there "shouldn't" be patches, I accept that there are and I refuse to bitch about it. It's a developers problem, not a consoles. Whereas it's just un-avoidable for pc's.

Adding to the point, the mandatory installs are only on the PS3 because a lot of developers can't invest the time and money required to get a streaming system going for the PS3 architechture w/ blu-ray. So if Sony learned their lesson (which they better fucking have after the bitchslaps they have recieved this generation), they will be using blu-ray in the next generation as well, but with faster drives, which means faster loading from disc.

So in my eyes, the install problem is hopefully limited to this generation, and should by all logic not be seen again until we turn to a new format some time in the future. If we will ever see it again that is.

Patches are a good thing though (mostly). Sure, there are a few games that need a patch from launch (Assassin's Creed, Rainbow Six Vegas 2, LittleBigPlanet), but the majority of patches are made to improve multiplayer or add features. Like in Burnout Paradise, Call of Duty 4, Resistance 2 and also here, LittleBigPlanet. Not to speak of trophy patches.

Don't get me wrong, I think it is stupid to release a game that isn't done, but that is the downside to patches, where as the aforementioned are upsides to patches. So it all evens out in my mind (for the patches that is).

So as far as I am concerned, installs are bad, but devastating? Hell no. And while patches can mean that some developers will be sloppy (or be forced to release an unfinished game by the publisher to meet deadlines, I don't know), they can also make good games better!