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Forums - Sony - A controversial view - PS3 now hurting BD?

bdbdbd on 21 December 2008
Onyxmeth said:

If it's an issue now, I don't think it'll be an issue for long. Aren't Blu-Ray players permanently lower than the price of the PS3 now? I don't mean every model of course, but some of them are. It should be able to self sustain itself at this point.

Yes, they are. And have been for a while now. The point was, that if you buy a PS3 instead of standalone BD player to play your BD:s, the studios can't be sure whether the console is bought for games alone or to play movies. And of course, i wasn't saying that PS3 would be killing BD, only hurting it.

 



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Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

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Onyxmeth on 21 December 2008
bdbdbd said:
Onyxmeth said:

If it's an issue now, I don't think it'll be an issue for long. Aren't Blu-Ray players permanently lower than the price of the PS3 now? I don't mean every model of course, but some of them are. It should be able to self sustain itself at this point.

Yes, they are. And have been for a while now. The point was, that if you buy a PS3 instead of standalone BD player to play your BD:s, the studios can't be sure whether the console is bought for games alone or to play movies. And of course, i wasn't saying that PS3 would be killing BD, only hurting it.

 

I think they have other methods of figuring out if the investment is worth it. They sell the movies on BluRay. If the software sales of BluRay are increasing, then it continues to be a good investment. If it starts decreasing, then it's an investment that may be dropped in the future. They don't need to know the hardware sales at all. Software trends will do the job. They are on the rise, so BluRay is a good investment. That's my opinion on the matter also, that BD is a good and profitable venture.

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



bdbdbd on 21 December 2008
Onyxmeth said:
Max King of the Wild said:
libellule said:
1/ "lack of good games even these days" ?

...

2/ people wanting a console and buying PS3 for games may discover BR later
==> new consumer attraction

u3/ BR player are very low in price now so u dont need to buy the expensive PS3 to play BR
==> BR players less sales hurted than before ?

just my 2 cents

 

 I'm having a huge case of deja vu right now while reading this post.... has this thread happened before?

Well some of the arguments do have the stink of 2007 on them, so you may want to search around then. Don't blame bdbdbd though. He's just trying to be retro, like when bellbottoms went back in style.

 

 

You guys are way too fast for me...

 

No, this isn't a "retro" or "doom and gloom" -thread, just a thread where i wanted to view the other side of the coin. It's very much clear, that BD wouldn't be at the position it's now without PS3, but since PS3 isn't selling in huge numbers, which alone would be enough to make the BD versions anyway, it's not all just good for BD.



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

Max King of the Wild on 21 December 2008

First blu-ray movie without a dvd counter part - Spiderman 4



Lil_D420 on 21 December 2008

wat ever BD got me interested a full year after launch & its down for me BD is not doing BAD fur no1



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bdbdbd on 21 December 2008
Onyxmeth said:
bdbdbd said:
Onyxmeth said:

If it's an issue now, I don't think it'll be an issue for long. Aren't Blu-Ray players permanently lower than the price of the PS3 now? I don't mean every model of course, but some of them are. It should be able to self sustain itself at this point.

Yes, they are. And have been for a while now. The point was, that if you buy a PS3 instead of standalone BD player to play your BD:s, the studios can't be sure whether the console is bought for games alone or to play movies. And of course, i wasn't saying that PS3 would be killing BD, only hurting it.

 

I think they have other methods of figuring out if the investment is worth it. They sell the movies on BluRay. If the software sales of BluRay are increasing, then it continues to be a good investment. If it starts decreasing, then it's an investment that may be dropped in the future. They don't need to know the hardware sales at all. Software trends will do the job. They are on the rise, so BluRay is a good investment. That's my opinion on the matter also, that BD is a good and profitable venture.

 

 

Profitable - yes, but the companies look also the part whether the (expected) profit margins are good enough. The current economic downturn isn't going to increase the confidence in the high-end entertainment market. What the studios want, is to increase their margins. This doesn't mean that they would cut away their BD support, but to re-evaluate the the BD releases.



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

Onyxmeth on 21 December 2008
bdbdbd said:
Onyxmeth said:
bdbdbd said:
Onyxmeth said:

If it's an issue now, I don't think it'll be an issue for long. Aren't Blu-Ray players permanently lower than the price of the PS3 now? I don't mean every model of course, but some of them are. It should be able to self sustain itself at this point.

Yes, they are. And have been for a while now. The point was, that if you buy a PS3 instead of standalone BD player to play your BD:s, the studios can't be sure whether the console is bought for games alone or to play movies. And of course, i wasn't saying that PS3 would be killing BD, only hurting it.

 

I think they have other methods of figuring out if the investment is worth it. They sell the movies on BluRay. If the software sales of BluRay are increasing, then it continues to be a good investment. If it starts decreasing, then it's an investment that may be dropped in the future. They don't need to know the hardware sales at all. Software trends will do the job. They are on the rise, so BluRay is a good investment. That's my opinion on the matter also, that BD is a good and profitable venture.

 

 

Profitable - yes, but the companies look also the part whether the (expected) profit margins are good enough. The current economic downturn isn't going to increase the confidence in the high-end entertainment market. What the studios want, is to increase their margins. This doesn't mean that they would cut away their BD support, but to re-evaluate the the BD releases.

Yeah, that seems plausible. It may for a bit cut into which movies get BD releases, as opposed to the entirety of their releases. Let's use Warner Bros. They will continue to put high budget, special effects heavy and male oriented films on BD(The Dark Knight), but may hold back on Warner Independent releases(Slumdog Millionaire, Towelhead, etc).

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



Munkeh111 on 21 December 2008
bdbdbd said:
Munkeh111 said:
The lack of good PS3 games?

When a PS3 is sold, it adds to the potential user base of bds. The more bds sold the better. However, by somebody buying a PS3 instead of dedicated bd player, who is being hurt? It is the other hardware manufacturers, and why would Sony care about that. I am sure Sony would prefer someone buys a PS3 instead of one of their BD players, as that means more money for them in the future with games and bd sales and expanding the PS3's userbase, encouraging more investement there.

It does not stop the movie studios from making bds as they are not the ones making the hardware

 

Yes. What's the idea in making BD a huge issue instead of the lack of appealing titles in the library? As you can see, the better the PS3 library is becoming, the less people use BD as a selling point for PS3.

Becuase BD is an extra added bonus

It's hurting Sony aswell, if they are selling PS3 at a loss, they lose money, if they are selling PS3 with less profit than standalone players, they make less money. Let's take a theoretical situation, where all the other HW manufacturers would stop making BD players, BD would soon end up being new UMD and be seen as "PS3 proprietary format". That would cause the studios to drop support.

Sony still wants to sell PS3s. They will become more profitable, and their price model is that they make back money by selling games. If sony did not want to sell their console at a loss, they would have delayed the PS3 for even longer, and tried to decrease cost more before launch

The potential of selling their movies to customers is very important. Basically any PS3 owner could buy BD movies, but since the majority of consoles traditionally are found in kids rooms, plugged into small SDTV, it is creating uncertainities for the userbase. And today, the studios really don't want to make bad investments.

We really don't know where most of these consoles are, it is just guess work. Also, I am sure they could look at attach rates of movies to see how well they are selling, and that could give a rough estimate of how many PS3 owners are using bd. The Dark Knight BD launched recently and sold very well. It sold 100k in the UK, and sold 600k including US and Canada. Though that is the best selling (to my knowledge) non-bundled bd (Casino Royale has probably sold more) it does give some sort of indication how many people are buying these, and showing that there is a decent market out there. {figures from engadget}

 

 



bdbdbd on 21 December 2008

@Onyxmeth: That was my original idea. I should have put it in the OP in the first place.
Basically the comparision with the PS3 game releases and BD movie releases, you mentioned, would indicate that PS3 has impact on the releases, but then again, the early BD adopters could just as well be in the same age and sex group (even with little overlap).

@Munkeh: No, BD isn't an added bonus. It's a cost increasing feature, whether you wanted it or not.

Yes, Sony wants to sell more of their consoles, wants to profit from them and the price will go down along with the costs. But, selling a PS3 instead of a BD player, where BD player would profit more, isn't actually a great businessmodel. Also, nothing guarantees that PS3:s bought as BD players will be used for games, where they aren't making any money from games. The ultimate business strategy would be to sell a games console and a BD player and profit from both.

We don't know that, you're right. That's why i mentioned where they traditionally are placed. Also, the games library is heavily geared towards teenagers, which would indicate that the consoles can be found from the kids rooms, when DVD would be more propable movie format used. Of course, i've noticed that it's becoming more common for stores to market PS3 as a BD player and a gimped PC.
Problem with attach rate is, that we don't have anything to compare it with. Or maybe the DVD attach rate? Also the "X number of BD movies for PS3 buyers" -bundles are gearing the attach rate up, since you got the movies even if you didn't want to or never bought BD movies outside the bundle.



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

Kantor on 21 December 2008
bdbdbd said:

As we all know, BD have been touted as the main selling point, over 360, for PS3 ever since PS3 had its launch. Even these days, you still see BD being mentioned as an important feature for PS3, to offset its lack of good games. But what do the PS3 sales numbers mean to movie studios and hardware manufacturers?

Every PS3 sold to view BD movies, is away from the profitable standalone players, whether it's Sony, Toshiba or LG, only makes the industry to lose profits. Despite every PS3 being a BD capable player, every PS3 isn't used to view BD movies, unlike every standalone player, creating uncertainity among the publishers about how many BD players there are in reality and causing them to cut down their investments to BD.

 

What do you think? Discuss.

I suppose you're right.

I think I'll go play Uncharted now, when I've finished that I'll play some R2, then start playing my new LBP. I have to see if I can find Valkyria Chronicles in stores anywhere. By the way, I hope MGS4 gets a trophy patch. I just finished my second playthrough of Tools of Destruction.

Sorry, what were you saying?

OT: Nah. People who want blu-ray get standalone players. People who want a Sony console OR a console and blu-ray get the PS3. Although I suppose it is confusing, they should do a survey of PS3 users, and see which use them for gaming purely (me), gaming and blu-ray and only blu-ray viewing.



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