By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sony Discussion - PS3 a faster money sink than the Xbox? I can see why no price cuts soon.

bumidan on 22 June 2008

@Ail
Yes, you are correct. The analysis that I wanted to make is the TOTAL loss for either software or hardware.

If you feel that the fixed costs are separate, then by all means you can consider that.
However, we can as easily allocate that per division as well.

Again, based on the reported numbers, those are the results that we can guesstimate.

It is not PS3 hardware (component) loss, but also most likely includes R&D, maintenance, ongoing development, etc.

I will go back to previous years to analyze - when PS3 was first mentioned in the reports - which was year ending Mar 2006.

I will start another thread. The key assumption I will make is that PS2 hardware and software actually makes money - unless you or anybody else have a different opinion on that.

that will be interesting.



Around the Network
bumidan on 22 June 2008

http://vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=30468

I have posted a new thread. Please check it out. $11 Billion Loss for PS3 software and hardware since 2005.



madskillz on 22 June 2008
DMeisterJ said:
madskillz said:
DMeisterJ said:

 

Still in stage 1 hey Legend? 

It's time to move onto stage 2, Anger. 

Posted for you:

  1. Denial:
    • Example - "I feel fine."; "This can't be happening."
  2. Anger:
    • Example - "Why me? It's not fair!" "NO! NO! How can you accept this!"
  3. Bargaining:
    • Example - "Just let me live to see my children graduate."; "I'll do anything, can't you stretch it out? A few more years."
  4. Depression:
    • Example - "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"; "I'm going to die . . . What's the point?"
  5. Acceptance:
    • Example - "It's going to be OK."; "I can't fight it, I may as well prepare for it."

Gotta love the way you don't even heed your own advice.

 

Roflcopter.

What advice haven't I heeded?  Hell, I went out and bought a Wii. I'd say that I pretty much ran the gamut from Denial to Acceptance and in quick form I might add... 

But you're still spouting nonsense that Microsoft isn't in a lick of trouble, months later.  So maybe you, as well as Legend11 should heed my advice:  The 360 is in trouble, and there is no victory in it for Microsoft, as Legend believes.  If you believe that being outsold every week for the last seven months is a "victory", you seriously need your head checked.   And if MS's price drop in America goes over as well (or not, lulz) as the European one, the next thirty five weeks, and beyond will be exactly the same.

Dude, this is hella funny. You do realize that the 360 is selling more THIS year than it did last year, right? So, let me ask you - the 360 hasn't had a real price cut in nearly 3 years since release, it continues to sell better than last year and it's a failure and in danger of losing its lead to Sony in ... how long? Of course the PS3 will prevail, but at what cost? It will never have Wiilike numbers or Wiilike success EVER. That's not fiction - that's fact. To beat the Wii, it took what - one of the key Sony exclusives to do that. If the PS3 beats the Wii, it won't be consistently.

Sony is losing money. As a business owner, I definitely understand about taking temporary losses with hopes of recouping that money later on. If I am selling the same number of a certain product for a particular price, actually better than I was last year, why should I cut prices? Just because the guy down the street is selling his product cheaper, but for a loss, doesn't mean I have to slash prices - for what? If I am starting to sell less - significantly - I will lower prices. Otherwise, it's business as usual. I'm still making money.

Stop living in Denial, start being angy so that you can move on.  Once acceptance comes, it's so awesome.

How would you know about moving on when you are one of the biggest PS3 apologists on this site? I can't recall you ever posting a negative comment about the PS3. Oh, you have consistently belittled the 360 but the PS3? The grass is always greener.

Angy? Why would I be angry? I own all 3 consoles - and see all of them for what they are worth. You can call me a 360 fanbot - but review my posts and show me where I am in denial about the 360, Wii or PS3. I am stating firsthand knowledge, because I OWN the systems. I own them, and have the right to voice my opinion. And no, I am not retarded enough to buy a PS3 just to bash it. However, when folks are calling it leaps ahead of the 360, I really just LOL and realize how much brand loyalty can cloud a person's judgment.

I see the console for what they are - games. I enjoy a few on the Wii and PS3, but have found more games on the 360 I like. Until Sony does a better job of keeping me interested, I am going Wii60, son.

Now that I've accepted that the PS3 is not doing that great (comprable to the Wii) this generation, I own a Wii.  A hell of a gaming console that I wouldn't have owned had I not accepted it.  If you just accept that the 360 is relegated to last place, and there is no victory in that for Microsoft, you too could enjoy a hell of a gaming console (The PS3), far more than you hate it.

How in the HELL can you tell me what I will enjoy? That's like a guy telling me I'd love a Dodge Viper and owns a Ford Pinto. He has never owned one, but knows so much about Vipers that he is sure I'd love it. Sadly, that's not the case. I have sat in a Viper - and the cockpit is way too tight for me. I would rather get something that I enjoy.

I own a PS3 and have tried for the life of me to accept it like you, Crazzyman, MikeB and others see it. I don't. I think one day it may be awesome, but it has a long hole to climb out of.

And for me to pay my hard-earned to buy something just to talk about is retarded. What sense does it make for me to pay $$$$ for a PS3 and hate it? Son, it's obvious that anyone who doesn't see it as being awesome and *likes* the 360 for any particular reason is a fanboy. You should consider a class in reading comprehension. We are a free nation - and have choices. I bought a PS3 - I had two of them - and don't find it to be any better than a 360, and prefer the 360 over the PS3 by miles.

Don't be bitter over this loss too long, just move on and accept the truth, and the facts, and the data.  Not the voices in your head, or your delusions.

You are talking about delusions - you own a 360 and have few words of praise for it. Why? Why? Why? You praise the PS3 so much you have folks believing you OWN one. Why not sell your 360 AND Wii and buy a PS3? Your devotion to the PS3's cause makes me really believe you are just on here to try and get a rise out of folks who like the 360. I just find it hard to believe that you can believe the propaganda that you spew.

Thanks for making me laugh for a long, long time this Sunday evening.

 

 



DMeisterJ on 22 June 2008
madskillz said:
DMeisterJ said:
madskillz said:
DMeisterJ said:

 

Still in stage 1 hey Legend? 

It's time to move onto stage 2, Anger. 

Posted for you:

  1. Denial:
    • Example - "I feel fine."; "This can't be happening."
  2. Anger:
    • Example - "Why me? It's not fair!" "NO! NO! How can you accept this!"
  3. Bargaining:
    • Example - "Just let me live to see my children graduate."; "I'll do anything, can't you stretch it out? A few more years."
  4. Depression:
    • Example - "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"; "I'm going to die . . . What's the point?"
  5. Acceptance:
    • Example - "It's going to be OK."; "I can't fight it, I may as well prepare for it."

Gotta love the way you don't even heed your own advice.

 

Roflcopter.

What advice haven't I heeded?  Hell, I went out and bought a Wii. I'd say that I pretty much ran the gamut from Denial to Acceptance and in quick form I might add... 

But you're still spouting nonsense that Microsoft isn't in a lick of trouble, months later.  So maybe you, as well as Legend11 should heed my advice:  The 360 is in trouble, and there is no victory in it for Microsoft, as Legend believes.  If you believe that being outsold every week for the last seven months is a "victory", you seriously need your head checked.   And if MS's price drop in America goes over as well (or not, lulz) as the European one, the next thirty five weeks, and beyond will be exactly the same.

Dude, this is hella funny. You do realize that the 360 is selling more THIS year than it did last year, right? So, let me ask you - the 360 hasn't had a real price cut in nearly 3 years since release, it continues to sell better than last year and it's a failure and in danger of losing its lead to Sony in ... how long? Of course the PS3 will prevail, but at what cost? It will never have Wiilike numbers or Wiilike success EVER. That's not fiction - that's fact. To beat the Wii, it took what - one of the key Sony exclusives to do that. If the PS3 beats the Wii, it won't be consistently.

Sony is losing money. As a business owner, I definitely understand about taking temporary losses with hopes of recouping that money later on. If I am selling the same number of a certain product for a particular price, actually better than I was last year, why should I cut prices? Just because the guy down the street is selling his product cheaper, but for a loss, doesn't mean I have to slash prices - for what? If I am starting to sell less - significantly - I will lower prices. Otherwise, it's business as usual. I'm still making money.

Stop living in Denial, start being angy so that you can move on.  Once acceptance comes, it's so awesome.

How would you know about moving on when you are one of the biggest PS3 apologists on this site? I can't recall you ever posting a negative comment about the PS3. Oh, you have consistently belittled the 360 but the PS3? The green is greener.

Angy? Why would I be angry? I own all 3 consoles - and see all of them for what they are worth. You can call me a 360 fanbot - but review my posts and show me where I am in denial about the 360, Wii or PS3. I am stating firsthand knowledge, because I OWN the systems. I own them, and have the right to voice my opinion. And no, I am not retarded enough to buy a PS3 just to bash it. However, when folks are calling it leaps ahead of the 360, I really just LOL and realize how much brand loyalty can cloud a person's judgment.

I see the console for what they are - games. I enjoy a few on the Wii and PS3, but have found more games on the 360 I like. Until Sony does a better job of keeping me interested, I am going Wii60, son.

Now that I've accepted that the PS3 is not doing that great (comprable to the Wii) this generation, I own a Wii.  A hell of a gaming console that I wouldn't have owned had I not accepted it.  If you just accept that the 360 is relegated to last place, and there is no victory in that for Microsoft, you too could enjoy a hell of a gaming console (The PS3), far more than you hate it.

How in the HELL can you tell me what I will enjoy? That's like a guy telling me I'd love a Dodge Viper and owns a Ford Pinto. He has never owned one, but knows so much about Vipers that he is sure I'd love it. Sadly, that's not the case. I have sat in a Viper - and the cockpit is way too tight for me. I would rather get something that I enjoy.

I own a PS3 and have tried for the life of me to accept it like you, Crazzyman, MikeB and others see it. I don't. I think one day it may be awesome, but it has a long hole to climb out of.

And for me to pay my hard-earned to buy something just to talk about is retarded. What sinces does it make for me to pay $$$$ for a PS3 and hate it? Son, it's obvious that anyone who doesn't see it as being awesome and *likes* the 360 for any particular reason is a fanboy. You should consider a class in reading comprehension. We are a free nation - and have choices. I bought a PS3 - I had two of them - and don't find it to be any better than a 360, and prefer the 360 over the PS3 by miles.

Don't be bitter over this loss too long, just move on and accept the truth, and the facts, and the data.  Not the voices in your head, or your delusions.

You are talking abot delusions - you own a 360 and have few words of praise for it. Why? Why? Why? You praise the PS3 so much you have folks believing you OWN one. Why not sell your 360 AND Wii and buy a PS3? Your devotion to the PS3's cause makes me really believe you are just on here to try and get a rise out of folks who like the 360. I just find it hard to believe that you can believe the propaganda that you spew.

Thanks for making me laugh for a long, long time this Sunday evening.

 

 

Again, you're clearly delusional.

I've stated on many occasions (even recently), that I don't see myself owning a PS3 for some time, as Sony needs to get their act together.  I've talked bad about their online service (or lack thereof, damn your arrogance Sony), slackluster lineup, shoddy ports, and delays out the Wazoo.  I don't expect you to go through my 7500 posts to find those, but they're there.  I'll show you my most recent post about what I think about the PS3 in this Star ocean thread:

http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/post.php?id=862520

It's really so good to be a XBOX 360 owner.

JRPGs, FTW.

Another one:

http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/post.php?id=857616

After Tuesdays announcement, it may be a while before I own a PS3...
I need JRPGs.

Madskillz, pwned?

Anyhoo.  Now that you got owned there.

I don't really care what system you prefer or not, but once you stop hating systems for no reason, there's a lot of good that can come from it.  I haven't had as much fun with a system since I bought the Wii.  It was easily the best 250 I've spent in the last few years...  I'm just telling you, as I can see from your post history, that you don't like PS3 for no other reason for not liking it.  I may not talk about my 360, but that's only because MS pissed me off by having to ship my thing back 3 times.  I didn't much like that, but it's fine now, and I enjoy games (especially JRPGs, ).  I've also never called you an "X-Bot" or anything like that.

Now onto business.

Selling more than it did last year is good, but if it's selling more than it did last year, than that makes the 360 selling more than it did last year look even worse.  360 is having a better year than the previous one and is still getting it's ass whupped on a weekly basis.  That's a damn shame.  Okay, so 360 is making profit, and last quarter, Sony posted a loss.  So where do we go from there?  It's still being outsold weekly, no matter how you look at it, it looks horrible.  So they need to sell more consoles.  And they did have a price drop.  Whether or not it was "real" to you or not is irrelevant.  Because as far as all the sane people in the U.S. are concerned, the 360 dropped in price.  I don't know how it could have been "fake", but I'm pretty sure it happened.  I mean, did they not drop the price last year?

Anyhoo, like I said, move on.  Denial is all fun, but moving on to anger then barganing is cooler.  You get to realize that you were wrong, and then you can enjoy all three consoles you have, instead of kicking your PS3 whenever you see it

Also, please don't relate me to Crazzy and MikeB.  I'm definitely not as in love with the PS3 as they are.



Spankey on 23 June 2008

losing money or not, this graph speaks for itself.

PS3 tracking nicely against PS2 at a similar point in it's hardware WW sales history and is ahead of the 360 at the same time.

so losing money or not, they're still shipping a good amount of product and it's only time before they start making it profitable.

http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=PS2&reg1=All&cons2=PS3&reg2=All&cons3=X360&reg3=All&weeks=150



Proud Sony Rear Admiral

Around the Network
BengaBenga on 23 June 2008
Spankey said:
losing money or not, this graph speaks for itself.

PS3 tracking nicely against PS2 at a similar point in it's hardware WW sales history and is ahead of the 360 at the same time.

so losing money or not, they're still shipping a good amount of product and it's only time before they start making it profitable.

http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=PS2®1=All&cons2=PS3®2=All&cons3=X360®3=All&weeks=150

 

For the love of everything holy, can we please stop this comparison forever?

You can't compare them like that, because the amount of time on th emarket is completely different.

First year

PS2: 12 months Japan, 4 months US, 3 months Others
PS3: 12 months Japan, 12 months US, 8 months Others

Please check PS2 vs PS3 for every region seperately and you'll get the idea.



NJ5 on 23 June 2008
BengaBenga said:

 

For the love of everything holy, can we please stop this comparison forever?

You can't compare them like that, because the amount of time on th emarket is completely different.

First year

PS2: 12 months Japan, 4 months US, 3 months Others
PS3: 12 months Japan, 12 months US, 8 months Others

Please check PS2 vs PS3 for every region seperately and you'll get the idea.

Nope, I don't think we can. This comparison is like music to fanboy ears, so it will keep being sang from generation to generation. That is, until its wheels come off and it drops into a pit of oblivion along with all the other debunked myths.

 



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957

MikeB on 23 June 2008

@ BengaBenga

It's still relevant to look at how the platform is doing as a whole globally. Because launching the PS2 later in regions allowed for more software readily available at launch.

The PS3 is selling much faster than the original playstation did at a much higher entry pricing, we know that platform sold over 100 million units.

The PS3 selling too much early on would have been a problem for Sony. IMO judge when the platform is yielding good profits, Sony then has every reason to push PS3 hardware sales the best they can.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

DirtyP2002 on 23 June 2008

I think it is kind of funny, that the Xbox360 is a competition to Sony without the japanese market. Microsoft is new in this business and is doing very well. 20.000.000 consoles sold just on two of three markets is good. I doubt the PS3 will reach 100 million units. I also doubt the PS3 will last 10 years. Anyway, this Generation is all about Nintendo. They dominate the software, the hardware and the handhelds.

My guess is that the 360 will reach 40 million consoles at the end. The PS3 like 50 million. The 10 million difference is the market in Japan. Wii will hit 80 - 90 million.

Sony will make money with the ps3 but this will take a lot of time.

another guess: The PS3 sales will be reduced as soon as there are other good bluray-player available.

 

Just some thoughts



Imagine not having GamePass on your console...

NJ5 on 23 June 2008

@DirtyP2002:

Fact: According to your total numbers for each platform, this generation would see less consoles sold than the last. What's the reason for that drop in the console market?

Hint: The Wii will sell much more than you think in the end. 80 million will be attained in the first half of 2010, the Wii will keep selling well after that.

 



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957