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Forums - Sony Discussion - PS5's operating income already more than PS1, PS2, PS3 & PS4 combined.

EpicRandy said:
Tober said:

Good Catch. 2020/2021 Sony had trouble shipping PS5, so it's likely most profits came from the PS4 platform.

Numbers can always interpreted in different ways and Sony's leadership choose to attribute it to the PS5 generation to juice up morale.

Yes, and it's even more concerning given the fact Sony, in the same document, claims their users are still evenly split between Ps4 and Ps5 at 49m active users As of April 30, 2024.

This means that PS4 was likely leading in monthly active users in 2023, the last year of reported profitability. The PS5 can certainly be attributed with most 2023 profits but still, the PS4 was likely very substantial.

Also looking at 2023 the gap between revenue and profits has never been that huge since the early PS3 years, which means that substantial investments are required to keep the business running and that despite revenue and profits for 2020-2023 going up ROI is significantly down.

People waiting for a ps5 pro?  Or cross generational games byproduct?  



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Just the first two years during the high of the pandemic and the launch of PS5 and a big active PS4 base at the time made those results make sense really. Most VG enterprise experienced such growth. Problem is the last two years saw their operative income decrease up to a point that their board and the company decided it was worth killing studios and projects to appease the shareholders overlords.

They must be extremely happy that something like Helldivers II exploded has it did as a premium live service game, cuz the current fiscal year would've looked grim in this regard again.

But yeah, they are effectively and operationally more successful than ever. Just sucks that we went through an unsustainable economic bubble because of the recent years event and the economic model demands that line keeps on growing.

I mean we're already seeing the stretching of such mindset hard nowadays with all the layoffs in the tech industry due to said unsustainable growth and speculation bubbles flopping hard.
But I digress now so I'll stop



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Chrkeller said:
EpicRandy said:

Yes, and it's even more concerning given the fact Sony, in the same document, claims their users are still evenly split between Ps4 and Ps5 at 49m active users As of April 30, 2024.

This means that PS4 was likely leading in monthly active users in 2023, the last year of reported profitability. The PS5 can certainly be attributed with most 2023 profits but still, the PS4 was likely very substantial.

Also looking at 2023 the gap between revenue and profits has never been that huge since the early PS3 years, which means that substantial investments are required to keep the business running and that despite revenue and profits for 2020-2023 going up ROI is significantly down.

People waiting for a ps5 pro?  Or cross generational games byproduct?  

Hard to say for sure. I doubt PS5 pro to be a main factor since there's have not been any official announcement yet making those knowing about it most likely to be enthusiast which are themselves a group most likely to have already upgraded.

Cross gen support may be a factor but you have to think what would have been the impact of not doing so on profitability and revenue. IMO cross gen support as become essential and unavoidable.

We can safely categorise those who haven't upgraded into 2 main categories with few sub category though we can only make educated guess as to how important of a factor they are:

  1. Those who have no intention of upgrading (as of now)
    1. who did upgrade to other device (Switch, mobile, PC, Xbox...)
    2. Those wanting/Waiting to upgrade to other device (Switch 2 and other.)
    3. Those still satisfied with 8th proposals (Cross gen support but also PS4 have a huge backlog XD)
    4. Casual user who lost interest or only have sporadic interest into gaming
    5. Those whose financial capacity don't allow it
  2. Those with intention of upgrading
    1. Those waiting for better proposals. (Better deals or more backlog)
    2. Waiting for pros 
    3. Those whose financial capacity don't allow it (yes this on can fit both)


Main reason I believe previous PS generations kept selling strong through the years is the big price drop in the second half of the generation. I think people are waiting for PS5 price to drop. If that does not happen, it will be interesting to see how this will go.



Still on PS4 Pro myself and happy out. I see no reason to upgrade apart from Balduars gate 3 which I'm happy to wait on cause I know it'll not be surpassed in it's genre, this gen. Good to see it doing well, regardless but personally I'll whip up the best of the generation on the cheap when it's nearing it's end and I'll grab a price reduced PS5 pro Gotta wonder how many Pro users got stuck in the same boat.



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LegitHyperbole said:

Still on PS4 Pro myself and happy out. I see no reason to upgrade apart from Balduars gate 3 which I'm happy to wait on cause I know it'll not be surpassed in it's genre, this gen. Good to see it doing well, regardless but personally I'll whip up the best of the generation on the cheap when it's nearing it's end and I'll grab a price reduced PS5 pro Gotta wonder how many Pro users got stuck in the same boat.

Tough to say. Roughly 20 million or more Pro models were sold out of all the PS4s sold so I don't know how much impact it will have if a good amount of them don't get a PS5. And we don't know how many of them might already have a PS5. 

Unless PS6 takes until 2028, I don't see PS5 outselling PS4 even if it gets close. 



Lifetime Sales Predictions 

Switch: 161 million (was 73 million, then 96 million, then 113 million, then 125 million, then 144 million, then 151 million, then 156 million)

PS5: 115 million (was 105 million) Xbox Series S/X: 48 million (was 60 million, then 67 million, then 57 million)

PS4: 120 mil (was 100 then 130 million, then 122 million) Xbox One: 51 mil (was 50 then 55 mil)

3DS: 75.5 mil (was 73, then 77 million)

"Let go your earthly tether, enter the void, empty and become wind." - Guru Laghima

That's why all the discourse about profit margins, the shrinking console market, Microsoft's multiplatform pivot and Sony Too, was a bit too hyperbolic for my liking.

Don't get me wrong, issues such as longer development time and massive budgets are definitely worrying, but the PlayStation platform is stronger and more sustainable than its ever been, and that includes the PS2 generation. I think many are overlooking the fact that Sony's first party IP's are still growing on the PS5 despite higher prices and less discounts. GoWR, SpiderMan 2, Helldivers 2, and GT7 are all primed to hit close to 1B+ in revenue, with their first party portfolio accounting for nearly 20% of overall software sales on the platform, with their legacy IP leading the way for engagement in terms of PS+ Premium subscribers, which has around 8M - 9M users.



LegitHyperbole said:

Still on PS4 Pro myself and happy out. I see no reason to upgrade apart from Balduars gate 3 which I'm happy to wait on cause I know it'll not be surpassed in it's genre, this gen. Good to see it doing well, regardless but personally I'll whip up the best of the generation on the cheap when it's nearing it's end and I'll grab a price reduced PS5 pro Gotta wonder how many Pro users got stuck in the same boat.

Same here. Have not upgraded to PS5 (yet). There has not been a PS5 exclusive game I consider a must play enough to make the jump. A later gen price cut like the previous generations had, could sway me though.



Tober said:

Main reason I believe previous PS generations kept selling strong through the years is the big price drop in the second half of the generation. I think people are waiting for PS5 price to drop. If that does not happen, it will be interesting to see how this will go.

Isn't PS5 selling strong as well? I thought they sold the most consoles ever last quarter? Did the PS4 continue selling more in it's 4th year compared to the 3rd year or did it's sales also drop?



Tober said:
LegitHyperbole said:

Still on PS4 Pro myself and happy out. I see no reason to upgrade apart from Balduars gate 3 which I'm happy to wait on cause I know it'll not be surpassed in it's genre, this gen. Good to see it doing well, regardless but personally I'll whip up the best of the generation on the cheap when it's nearing it's end and I'll grab a price reduced PS5 pro Gotta wonder how many Pro users got stuck in the same boat.

Same here. Have not upgraded to PS5 (yet). There has not been a PS5 exclusive game I consider a must play enough to make the jump. A later gen price cut like the previous generations had, could sway me though.

The big ones like Horizon FW, GoW Ragna and GT7 are still all on PS4. You are only really missing out on BG3, Ratchet and Spiderman 2, also FF games and Stellar blade. But after 3.5 years that's not a lot and in the foreseeable future the list is not growing all that much.



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar