Which is why I don't think we should do away with half-tiers (or rather dedicated GPU's would have their own tiering system by generation and budget, as they do.)

And we are talking about lighting, geometry, render pipelines, etc. here, not just mere game support for its own sake. The reason why the GTX 1080ti can't play Indiana Jones is because it doesn't support ray-tracing global illumination accelerated at the hardware level. That is an actual performance difference that affects the capacity to do a 9th Generation capable render-load. And it just happens to be the case that when you take 8th Generation (and equivalent hardware) out of the picture (as has finally been done with consoles, quite late for my preference) things that 8th Generation (and equivalent hardware) can't do very well (like RTGI or GS) suddenly are prioritized and game support for these 9th Generation workloads increases, with support for the old hardware dropping.

My 4090 doesn't even handle real RT that well.  I wouldn't expect much from a RT perspective on the S2.  I keep RT on low with my 4090 because high RT is a fps killer.  

You are free to do what you want.  I don't believe in half tiers.  Not sure what else to tell you.

Let me ask you this.  If we have a linear line for performance.  The ps4 is a 1, the ps5 is a 10...  what number do you give the S2?

DF talked about this very same subject in the star wars switch 2 preview, and feel like so much sacrifices are being made that it would be much better just porting games that fit 8th gen hardware as it's ps4 level hardware.

It depends on what the scale is measuring when we reduced all of the variation to this single dimension. 

An aggregation of image quality, graphics effects, and performance in GPU-bound 8th Generation-like titles? Docked mode is a 4 (with Series S being a 6) and PS4 Pro being a 3. Handheld mode is a 1 to 2. Generally what we see is that the Switch 2 (when Docked) is capable of playing some 8th Generation titles that are capped to 30fps on PS4 base at about 40-60fps, but with better effective image quality (and often internal resolution), much better texture quality, and some other asset enhancements. The Series S does better than Switch 2 here. 

Same aggregation in current generation titles that use 9th Generation render pipelines or titles that have some optional 9th Generation features? 5, with the Series S being a 7, and the PS4 Pro being a 2. In this case, the scale is measuring something like "relative likeliness to have a good port without a very diminished experience." 

Switch 2 is a series s now? What impressive 30fps ps4 games is Switch 2 running at 60fps. Sounds like you are describing series s.

I think there is where we disagree.  No way would I put the Switch at a 4 or 5 on either scales..  the implies the S2 is half way between the ps4 and ps5....  dude it isn't remotely half way between the ps4 and ps5.  If it were half way elden ring wouldn't be 1080p/30fps.  But looks like we will have to agree to disagree.  I think DF analysis (the Outlaws one as well) is spot on.

I have the same question.  Unless I missed something Yakuza 0, Elden, SF6, Cyber all run at similar fps to the ps4.  

I edited the post to replace 60fps with 40-60fps. But no the Series S is capable of much more than this. The system is just riddled with lazy ports. There are quite a few Series S titles that should have a variable 60-120fps that are capped on PS4 at 30fps. Equivalent PC hardware (say a Ryzen 2700x + RX 6500xt) tends to heavily outperform the PS4 in titles like God of War and Horizon Zero Dawn that pushed that console to its limits. You can get 70-80fps in God of War at original PS4 settings 1080p. Even more (near 90fps) with FSR Quality.

Also note, when I say "8th Generation titles" I am not talking about cross-generation titles that had 9th Generation consoles as their real target platforms like Cyberpunk, but the average title released in 2013->2020. 

None of this a representative of the average PS4 game.

Yakuza 0 is really a seventh-generation title in terms of render-pipeline and is capped at 60fps on both platforms.

The other three are cross-generation titles, targeting the current generation platforms and are more CPU demanding than your typical 8th Generation title. 

No Man's Sky is an example of your standard PS4 30fps game that isn't cross-generation. It targets 1080p 60fps (really variable 45fps - 60fps, hence the edit) or 1440p 30fps on Switch 2 and only 1080p 30fps on base PS4.