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Forums - Sales Discussion - PS5 Ships 13.4 Million Units as of September 30, PS4 Ships 116.6 Million

The_Liquid_Laser on 28 October 2021
Dulfite said:
DonFerrari said:

Different from PS2 days and before when the launch in markets were a lot more tiered and they had less historical data, probably now they have enough that show the drop in SW sales is step even if they keep selling systems so it is pointless to cut the price and keep the tail going for years when they can put that money in accelerating the current gen and earn more profits (PS4 and PS5 profits shows that it is working much better than PS1 to PS3 eras). PS2 dominated and outsold competition like 5:1 and had 1.5B sold of SW still PS4 was having profits that possibly in every year outdone the combined years of PS2.

Exactly. And I've said it before, PS2 only sold as many HW units as it did because it had a ridiculously long life, which helped contribute to PS3 having a LOT less units sold by the end of PS3's life (amongst other reasons). But as you point out, it's about profits, and that's why PS4 is tanking now and PS5 is thriving, and it's also the main reasoning behind why I think Nintendo will cut the cord on Switch 1 in 2023 to fully embrace Switch 2. All about profits, which you achieve on newer systems with excited fanbases willing to pay full price for new games, full price for consoles, and full price for accessories.

Software sales will be a joke in 2023 for Switch 1 compared to what Switch 2 could do, just like they are a joke right now for PS4 compared to what PS5 is doing.

Long life the 6 year cycle!

Systems have the highest profit margins when they are old.  Hardware manufacturing costs are low, and software sales often continue to be strong for 1-2 years after hardware sales have dropped significantly.  The hit games are already made, so development costs are already spent.  At that point it's almost pure profit.

On the other hand Sony especially has always had a business model where they take a loss early on, because they know they'll make better profits later.



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Doctor_MG on 28 October 2021

Q1 they sold 500k PS4 units and in Q2 they sold 200k PS4 units. That's down from 1.9M units and 1.5M units respectively. Last year they only sold 1.4M PS4 units in Q3, so I'm not expecting anything above 400-500k for PS4 this quarter.

This is it folks. The end of the cycle. Unless Sony changes trajectory, PS4 will stop at around 17.5M units sold. It didn't beat the Gameboy, but being the fourth best selling video game console ever made (or fifth by the end of Switch's life cycle) is pretty dang impressive.



kirby007 on 28 October 2021

Now i'm not 100% sure how Sony does it, but why would you use capacity on producing PS4's if that capacity can also be used for 5's.
The PS4 userbase is large enough to maximize profits. Why add another 5-10%, if you can grow your smaller userbase for the next cycle faster?

EDIT everything above 80million is just food for the fanwars



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League http://www.vgchartz.com/predictions

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DonFerrari on 28 October 2021
kirby007 said:

Now i'm not 100% sure how Sony does it, but why would you use capacity on producing PS4's if that capacity can also be used for 5's.
The PS4 userbase is large enough to maximize profits. Why add another 5-10%, if you can grow your smaller userbase for the next cycle faster?

EDIT everything above 80million is just food for the fanwars

I don't think the capacities competes, different wafers and manufacturing process I would say.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

kirby007 on 28 October 2021
DonFerrari said:
kirby007 said:

Now i'm not 100% sure how Sony does it, but why would you use capacity on producing PS4's if that capacity can also be used for 5's.
The PS4 userbase is large enough to maximize profits. Why add another 5-10%, if you can grow your smaller userbase for the next cycle faster?

EDIT everything above 80million is just food for the fanwars

I don't think the capacities competes, different wafers and manufacturing process I would say.

that is like saying a car factory can only produce one kind of car

I am quite sure the lowered demand on the ps4 opened room to swap part of the processes over.



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League http://www.vgchartz.com/predictions

Instead of seeking to convince others, we can be open to changing our own minds, and seek out information that contradicts our own steadfast point of view. Maybe it’ll turn out that those who disagree with you actually have a solid grasp of the facts. There’s a slight possibility that, after all, you’re the one who’s wrong.

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Rafie on 28 October 2021
curl-6 said:

PS4 really seems to be nearing the end of the road.

The pandemic pretty much killed it. After stock went out, no more PS4s were getting manufactured. Of course priority shifted to the new consoles. Hence the stalled hardware. Shame really. I thought for sure it would have gotten to at least 125m.



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DonFerrari on 28 October 2021
kirby007 said:
DonFerrari said:

I don't think the capacities competes, different wafers and manufacturing process I would say.

that is like saying a car factory can only produce one kind of car

I am quite sure the lowered demand on the ps4 opened room to swap part of the processes over.

Sure you can change the factory to make PS5 where it used to do PS4. But your analogy about cars would be like would make sense for a Ford plant to swap from making Ford Focus to Fiat Panda? You would need to change most equipment and tools, possible but not really worth.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

kirby007 on 28 October 2021
DonFerrari said:
kirby007 said:

that is like saying a car factory can only produce one kind of car

I am quite sure the lowered demand on the ps4 opened room to swap part of the processes over.

Sure you can change the factory to make PS5 where it used to do PS4. But your analogy about cars would be like would make sense for a Ford plant to swap from making Ford Focus to Fiat Panda? You would need to change most equipment and tools, possible but not really worth.

a prime example of this is Nedcar ( check vdlgroep if interested ) same factory makes multiple models even for multiple brands



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League http://www.vgchartz.com/predictions

Instead of seeking to convince others, we can be open to changing our own minds, and seek out information that contradicts our own steadfast point of view. Maybe it’ll turn out that those who disagree with you actually have a solid grasp of the facts. There’s a slight possibility that, after all, you’re the one who’s wrong.

Kakadu18 on 28 October 2021
Dulfite said:
DonFerrari said:

Different from PS2 days and before when the launch in markets were a lot more tiered and they had less historical data, probably now they have enough that show the drop in SW sales is step even if they keep selling systems so it is pointless to cut the price and keep the tail going for years when they can put that money in accelerating the current gen and earn more profits (PS4 and PS5 profits shows that it is working much better than PS1 to PS3 eras). PS2 dominated and outsold competition like 5:1 and had 1.5B sold of SW still PS4 was having profits that possibly in every year outdone the combined years of PS2.

Exactly. And I've said it before, PS2 only sold as many HW units as it did because it had a ridiculously long life, which helped contribute to PS3 having a LOT less units sold by the end of PS3's life (amongst other reasons). But as you point out, it's about profits, and that's why PS4 is tanking now and PS5 is thriving, and it's also the main reasoning behind why I think Nintendo will cut the cord on Switch 1 in 2023 to fully embrace Switch 2. All about profits, which you achieve on newer systems with excited fanbases willing to pay full price for new games, full price for consoles, and full price for accessories.

Software sales will be a joke in 2023 for Switch 1 compared to what Switch 2 could do, just like they are a joke right now for PS4 compared to what PS5 is doing.

Long life the 6 year cycle!

PS4 life cycle was more than 7 years. Switch software sales will only tank when Switch 2 does actually release in 2023. If the PS5 would release this year in November instead of last year PS4 would have sold way better this year in terms of soft- and hardware.

The PS2 sold so much longer mainly because the PS3 was so insanely overpriced.



DonFerrari on 28 October 2021
kirby007 said:
DonFerrari said:

Sure you can change the factory to make PS5 where it used to do PS4. But your analogy about cars would be like would make sense for a Ford plant to swap from making Ford Focus to Fiat Panda? You would need to change most equipment and tools, possible but not really worth.

a prime example of this is Nedcar ( check vdlgroep if interested ) same factory makes multiple models even for multiple brands

Do they make on the same tools and equipment/lines products that need different ones?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."