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Forums - Gaming - should games be desexified while every other social media focusses on sex and appeal?

kirby007 said:

I was wondering about this because frankly social media accounts and apps by woman focus more and more on themselves as sex and sexual appeal since its inception.

while on the other hand games like BMX XXX, DOA or even tomb raider aren't made anymore or desexualised.

why does /must this exist in gaming while every other media totally shits on this "femalefriendly/woke" principle?

Hmm I think I see what your getting at here. Gaming is male dominated, so I guess they don't like fictional women being created by men to appeal to the male gaze. A woman going on Twitch sexualizing herself and taking advantage of lonely dudes is fine though because it's a real female benefitting from the male gaze. 



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KLXVER said:
JWeinCom said:

The situations make sense. With Luca she was amusing herself at the fact that he thinks she is evil but he still is obviously turned on by her. As for why she's sexy, some people are like that. And obviously it's pandering to the player to a point. I don't recall her ever being overtly sexual with the child characters.

The difference is that the developers decided to sometimes show off her being sexual, and sometimes other features. As opposed to in DOAX3 where they decided we are going to sexualize these characters literally 100% of the time. 

Well I guess we just have different opinions on sexualization then. The girls in DOAX are just being sexy. They dont really force it on everyone like Bayonetta does. I dont get how its ok for Bayonetta to be sexy because she likes it, but the DOAX girls should somehow be held to a higher standard.

Because Bayonetta and the girls in DOA aren't sexualizing anyone. They're digital, they literally can't.  It's the developers who do the sexualization. The developers of Bayonetta decided that sometimes they're going to showcase her sexual side, and sometimes they'd show off other traits. The developers of DOAX3 decided they were only going to showcase the characters in a sexualizing way, 100% of the time. 

Virtual every person is sexual amount of the time, some more so than others, so it makes sense that every videogame characters will be as well.  When a developer decides to focus on that aspect of a character to the exclusion of everything else, that's unacceptable sexualization. 



I will start this reply by highlighting my disproportionate vested interest in this matter as VGC's...like only active female contributor, for whatever that's worth.

In my view, the whole premise of the OP is judgmental and sexist and his motivation boils down to 100% selfishness. It's really not more complicated than that.

The fact that I am a (marginally) sexual creature and female at the same time doesn't mean that all games about women should be Lollipop Chainsaw clones for the sake of 'logical consistency with women's slutty lifestyles'. That's a highly disingenuous and frankly offensive argument and the author of the OP knows it.

It's more than fine with me if there are women game characters who are, well, sexual creatures. That's not the issue. The issue is that the OP seems to want to reduce all representation of women in video games to sex appeal. I'm not on board with that.

Last edited by Jaicee - on 05 August 2020

JWeinCom said:
KLXVER said:

Well I guess we just have different opinions on sexualization then. The girls in DOAX are just being sexy. They dont really force it on everyone like Bayonetta does. I dont get how its ok for Bayonetta to be sexy because she likes it, but the DOAX girls should somehow be held to a higher standard.

Because Bayonetta and the girls in DOA aren't sexualizing anyone. They're digital, they literally can't.  It's the developers who do the sexualization. The developers of Bayonetta decided that sometimes they're going to showcase her sexual side, and sometimes they'd show off other traits. The developers of DOAX3 decided they were only going to showcase the characters in a sexualizing way, 100% of the time. 

Virtual every person is sexual amount of the time, some more so than others, so it makes sense that every videogame characters will be as well.  When a developer decides to focus on that aspect of a character to the exclusion of everything else, that's unacceptable sexualization. 

Well first of all I disagree that its unacceptable. Developers should be allowed to make whatever game they want.

I have never played DOAX3, so I cant say at what percentage they are being sexualized, but even when Bayonetta shows off other traits, she is still in a skin tight leather suit that looks nothing like the hair its supposed to be.



JWeinCom said:

When a developer decides to focus on that aspect of a character to the exclusion of everything else, that's unacceptable sexualization. 

Assuming we're still talking about fictional characters, I'm curious why you find this unacceptable.



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KLXVER said:
JWeinCom said:

Because Bayonetta and the girls in DOA aren't sexualizing anyone. They're digital, they literally can't.  It's the developers who do the sexualization. The developers of Bayonetta decided that sometimes they're going to showcase her sexual side, and sometimes they'd show off other traits. The developers of DOAX3 decided they were only going to showcase the characters in a sexualizing way, 100% of the time. 

Virtual every person is sexual amount of the time, some more so than others, so it makes sense that every videogame characters will be as well.  When a developer decides to focus on that aspect of a character to the exclusion of everything else, that's unacceptable sexualization. 

Well first of all I disagree that its unacceptable. Developers should be allowed to make whatever game they want.

I have never played DOAX3, so I cant say at what percentage they are being sexualized, but even when Bayonetta shows off other traits, she is still in a skin tight leather suit that looks nothing like the hair its supposed to be.

I meant unacceptable to me personally. As I've already said, people who enjoy those games can keep on enjoying them. And I'm not going to be on a moral high horse acting like I don't have errrrr... videos that objectify women on my hard drive, but it's just not what I like in my gaming. 

Bayonetta does wear tight clothing... Again, I'm not disputing that she was a sexual creature. And her hair is magic, so it's supposed to look like what it looks like. But, IMO Bayonetta in general is acceptable. She's (most of the time) not being displayed purely to titillate the mostly male gamers, and most of the time when she is it's in a wink wink nudge nudge kind of way. Based on what I've seen from DOA3X, the girls are sexualized to the exclusiong of everything else, to the point where they are objects and not characters which, again to me personally, is an unacceptable degree of sexualization. And I certainly don't accept that she's the most sexualized character in gaming. Play some DOAX3 and Senren Kagura and tell me if you still think that.



Jaicee said:

I will start this reply by highlighting my disproportionate vested interest in this matter as VGC's...like only active female contributor, for whatever that's worth.

In my view, the whole premise of the OP is judgmental and sexist and his motivation boils down to 100% selfishness. It's really not more complicated than that.

The fact that I am a (marginally) sexual creature and female at the same time doesn't mean that all games about women should be Lollipop Chainsaw clones for the sake of 'logical consistency with women's slutty lifestyles'. That's a highly disingenuous and frankly offensive argument and the author of the OP knows it.

It's more than fine with me if there are women game characters who are, well, sexual creatures. That's not the issue. The issue is that the OP seems to want to reduce all representation of women in video games to sex appeal. I'm not on board with that.

I don't read that as OP's argument. I don't think he's saying that all games should be like Lollipop Chainsaw, so much as saying that those types of games shouldn't be forbidden, although justifying that by appealing to social media usage is a bit dubious.

Please address the argument itself, rather than the OPs intention. If you think the post is being made in bad faith, report it and explain why. I'll consider this post a report, and request that the OP clarifies why exactly women posting sexualizing content on social media should make it more acceptable for game developers to sexualize female characters.

Last edited by JWeinCom - on 05 August 2020

JWeinCom said:
KLXVER said:

Well first of all I disagree that its unacceptable. Developers should be allowed to make whatever game they want.

I have never played DOAX3, so I cant say at what percentage they are being sexualized, but even when Bayonetta shows off other traits, she is still in a skin tight leather suit that looks nothing like the hair its supposed to be.

I meant unacceptable to me personally. As I've already said, people who enjoy those games can keep on enjoying them. And I'm not going to be on a moral high horse acting like I don't have errrrr... videos that objectify women on my hard drive, but it's just not what I like in my gaming. 

Bayonetta does wear tight clothing... Again, I'm not disputing that she was a sexual creature. And her hair is magic, so it's supposed to look like what it looks like. But, IMO Bayonetta in general is acceptable. She's (most of the time) not being displayed purely to titillate the mostly male gamers, and most of the time when she is it's in a wink wink nudge nudge kind of way. Based on what I've seen from DOA3X, the girls are sexualized to the exclusiong of everything else, to the point where they are objects and not characters which, again to me personally, is an unacceptable degree of sexualization. And I certainly don't accept that she's the most sexualized character in gaming. Play some DOAX3 and Senren Kagura and tell me if you still think that.

I see your point. I agree that the women in those games are not deep characters. However thats all they do. Bayonetta keeps talking sexy and acting sexy in moments when it just becomes silly. And she never shuts up about it for more than a short scene. She cant have a lollipop without acting sexy with it. I dont only see women being sexualized when they pretty much become sex objects. The women in the other games doesnt keep acting sexy and talking dirty a lot of the time. They play volleyball and minigames, but they are not acting or speaking sexy. They are just wearing very little clothes. Theres just that photoshoot mode where they act sexy. Maybe a few other times. Bayonetta keeps preforming for the player a lot of the time. Like some sort of private striptease. 



KLXVER said:
JWeinCom said:

I meant unacceptable to me personally. As I've already said, people who enjoy those games can keep on enjoying them. And I'm not going to be on a moral high horse acting like I don't have errrrr... videos that objectify women on my hard drive, but it's just not what I like in my gaming. 

Bayonetta does wear tight clothing... Again, I'm not disputing that she was a sexual creature. And her hair is magic, so it's supposed to look like what it looks like. But, IMO Bayonetta in general is acceptable. She's (most of the time) not being displayed purely to titillate the mostly male gamers, and most of the time when she is it's in a wink wink nudge nudge kind of way. Based on what I've seen from DOA3X, the girls are sexualized to the exclusiong of everything else, to the point where they are objects and not characters which, again to me personally, is an unacceptable degree of sexualization. And I certainly don't accept that she's the most sexualized character in gaming. Play some DOAX3 and Senren Kagura and tell me if you still think that.

I see your point. I agree that the women in those games are not deep characters. However thats all they do. Bayonetta keeps talking sexy and acting sexy in moments when it just becomes silly. And she never shuts up about it for more than a short scene. She cant have a lollipop without acting sexy with it. I dont only see women being sexualized when they pretty much become sex objects. The women in the other games doesnt keep acting sexy and talking dirty a lot of the time. They play volleyball and minigames, but they are not acting or speaking sexy. They are just wearing very little clothes. Theres just that photoshoot mode where they act sexy. Maybe a few other times. Bayonetta keeps preforming for the player a lot of the time. Like some sort of private striptease. 

I feel like there was some X rated Bayonetta director's cut that you played that I didn't.

I typed in Bayonetta 2 gameplay, and this was the first video that came up.

https://youtu.be/z-5W745cGLg

Aside from spinning around a pole in the beginning, I can't see anything overtly sexual. In the cutscene she's not doing anything sexual at all, but is demonstrating compassion and showing that she wants to protect Loki.

https://youtu.be/nquoynXKskM

On the other hand, this is the first gameplay video for DOAX3. First thing the game does past the title screen is shove a girl's bum in my face and tell me her measurements.  Within 5 minutes they're picking out bikinis to dress up the character. For the next five minutes the girl is on a bed in the bikini while the player controls the camera to get the best angles. The gameplay is literally just moving the camera around to look at the girl.

11 minutes she's bent over by the poolside entering the water in the least practical way possible. Twelve minutes in she's napping in a bikini while again the player controls the camera. At 13 minutes the player is instructed to take photos of Kasumi relaxing and to get a picture of butt battle. 15 minutes back to bikini shopping and bed. At 19 minutes we're butt battling. 20 minutes, posing on the bed again. 26 minutes in the player is buying "pose cards" and lingerie. You can also buy suntan lotion.

Then, there's this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MST12aDCkHc

Bayonetta is more sexualized? Come on dude...

Last edited by JWeinCom - on 05 August 2020

No reason to censor or restrict game developers if they want sex appeal in their games, especially with the ESRB rating system in place - it's fiction. If it makes certain people uncomfortable then frankly that's their problem and they simply shouldn't play them. It's as simple as that. 



 

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