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Forums - Sales Discussion - Famitsu Sales: Week 30, 2020 (Jul 20 - Jul 26)

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src said:
MasonADC said:

MH on switch would’ve expanded their 3ds monster hunter audience more IMO, so capcom ARE missing out on something

Wishful thinking. 3DS MHs were already a decline from PSP.

HoangNhatAnh said:

Why do you ignore my post?

What was there to it?

You posted some fake numbers and blatantly incorrect statements: timed exclusives factually have a big effect. Just look at FF7R. Timed exclusives usually mean the majority of the sales and audience of a series happens on one platform.

Do this at the beginning of a generation and you've effectively tied down an entire genre if you get the right games. SFV ensured the PS4 was the console for fight game fans. FF will ensure that PS gets the large slice of the JRPG pie. COD marketing (not even timed) ensures PS gets the majority of the FPS console fans.

It all adds up. If you can't see what Sony is doing, your going to be left behind.

Capcom already built the engine for 3ds with Resident Evil Revelation, just need to use that engine for their later 3ds games. And 3ds games is very cheap to make. Meanwhile, ps4 is HD and super expensive compared to 3ds. Capcom made MH3 for Wii instead PS3 because PS3 costed too much, PS4 would only cost even more, simple logic.

Bold: maybe, except none of those fighting games can come close to Super Smash Bros sale.

2nd bold: Nintendo handheld is the same, no, sometimes it have even more JRPGs than PS.

3rd bold: majority of the FPS fans are from NA. Nintendo have Pokemon, Mario and Zelda for the worldwide audience, your point?



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Famitsu Sales: Jul 2020 (Jun 29 - Jul 26)

01./01. [NSW] Animal Crossing: New Horizons # <ETC> (Nintendo) {2020.03.20} (¥5.980) - 275.678 / 5.280.398 (-14%)
02./00. [PS4] Ghost of Tsushima <ADV> (Sony Interactive Entertainment) {2020.07.17} (¥6.900) - 266.302 / NEW
03./00. [NSW] Paper Mario: The Origami King <ADV> (Nintendo) {2020.07.17} (¥5.980) - 159.735 / NEW
04./00. [NSW] eBaseball Powerful Pro Baseball 2020 <SPT> (Konami) {2020.07.09} (¥6.980) - 145.689 / NEW
05./00. [PS4] eBaseball Powerful Pro Baseball 2020 <SPT> (Konami) {2020.07.09} (¥7.980) - 134.751 / NEW

Top 5


NSW - 3
PS4 - 2

SOFTWARE

Nintendo - 892.000
Sony Interactive Entertainment - 319.000
Konami - 290.000

HARDWARE

System This Month Last Month Last Year YTD Last YTD LTD
             
NSW # 387.557 295.606 219.589 3.054.439 1.703.469 14.437.870
PS4 # 13.940 51.219 46.910 449.752 694.115 9.197.995
3DS # 3.679 4.280 10.095 37.019 140.450 24.533.166
XB1 # 150 213 343 2.835 4.155 114.081
             
ALL 405.326 351.318 277.880 3.544.045 2.578.840 48.283.112
             
NSW L 72.199 85.996 1.379.489 2.424.872
NSW 315.358 209.610 219.589 1.674.950 1.703.469 12.012.998
XB1 X 81 152 216 2.009 2.835 20.651
XB1 S 69 61 127 826 1.320 21.428
PS4 Pro 5.827 22.352 17.722 173.389 250.075 1.568.359
PS4 8.113 28.867 29.188 276.363 444.040 7.629.636
n-2DSLL 3.408 3.977 8.587 34.742 112.786 1.138.988
n-3DS 271 303 1.508 2.277 26.573 5.888.192


src said:
Slownenberg said:

While obviously it is Nintendo's loss, it is also obviously Capcom's loss. Capcom could be greatly increasing their profits if they also made MH games on Switch, that'd add probably 5-10 million sales to their totals for a single game. 

Its not though. Capcom have a finite number of teams and devs working on MH. They made the right choice in putting their resources into MHW and leaving Nintendo.

Or they could make another MH game for PS4/5/PC and sell another 10-15 million.

Did they though, make the right choice? On Switch there's a good chance it would have sold just as well or at least nearly as well, considering Switch's Japan dominance. But it would have cost less to make for Switch. So I wouldn't say keeping it off Switch was the right decision at all.

Or they could make another MH game for Switch and sell another 10-15 million, and have it cost less to make. So what's your point? Or they could double up and make a version for those other systems and a version for Switch and sell maybe 25 million without having to make a whole new game. Either way you cut it, Capcom isn't doing the smart thing. Seems to come down to third parties want to promote games with the highest level graphics, and they'll decide to forego more money simply for that sake. Hard to understand the business behind that, but that is what we've clearly seen for years now.



Marth said:

Famitsu Sales: Jul 2020 (Jun 29 - Jul 26)

01./01. [NSW] Animal Crossing: New Horizons # (Nintendo) {2020.03.20} (¥5.980) - 275.678 / 5.280.398 (-14%)
02./00. [PS4] Ghost of Tsushima (Sony Interactive Entertainment) {2020.07.17} (¥6.900) - 266.302 / NEW
03./00. [NSW] Paper Mario: The Origami King (Nintendo) {2020.07.17} (¥5.980) - 159.735 / NEW
04./00. [NSW] eBaseball Powerful Pro Baseball 2020 (Konami) {2020.07.09} (¥6.980) - 145.689 / NEW
05./00. [PS4] eBaseball Powerful Pro Baseball 2020 (Konami) {2020.07.09} (¥7.980) - 134.751 / NEW

Top 5


NSW - 3
PS4 - 2

SOFTWARE

Nintendo - 892.000
Sony Interactive Entertainment - 319.000
Konami - 290.000

HARDWARE

System This Month Last Month Last Year YTD Last YTD LTD
             
NSW # 387.557 295.606 219.589 3.054.439 1.703.469 14.437.870
PS4 # 13.940 51.219 46.910 449.752 694.115 9.197.995
3DS # 3.679 4.280 10.095 37.019 140.450 24.533.166
XB1 # 150 213 343 2.835 4.155 114.081
             
ALL 405.326 351.318 277.880 3.544.045 2.578.840 48.283.112
             
NSW L 72.199 85.996 1.379.489 2.424.872
NSW 315.358 209.610 219.589 1.674.950 1.703.469 12.012.998
XB1 X 81 152 216 2.009 2.835 20.651
XB1 S 69 61 127 826 1.320 21.428
PS4 Pro 5.827 22.352 17.722 173.389 250.075 1.568.359
PS4 8.113 28.867 29.188 276.363 444.040 7.629.636
n-2DSLL 3.408 3.977 8.587 34.742 112.786 1.138.988
n-3DS 271 303 1.508 2.277 26.573 5.888.192

So for the month of July, a Switch to PS4 ratio of 28:1.



Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023.

Nintendo eShop Sales: July 2020

01./New. – eBaseball Powerful Pro Yakyuu 2020 (Konami) [09.7.2020]
02./New. – Paper Mario: The Origami King (Nintendo) [17.7.2020]
03./01. – Clubhouse Games: 51 Worldwide Classics (Nintendo) [05.6.2020]
04./02. – Animal Crossing: New Horizons (Nintendo) [20.3.2020]
05./07. – Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (Nintendo) [28.4.2017]
06./00. – Moto Rush GT (Baltoro Games) [26.3.2020] (currently 93% off)
07./04. – Human: Fall Flat (Teyon Japan) [28.12.2017]
08./08. – Splatoon 2 (Nintendo) [21.7.2017]
09./09. – Super Smash Bros. Ultimate (Nintendo) [07.12.2019]
10./19. – Overcooked! 2 (Team17) [07.8.2018]
11./03. – Minecraft Dungeons (Mojang / Microsoft Japan) [26.5.2020]
12./00. – Real Time Battle Shogi Online (Silverstar Japan) [09.1.2020] (was 95% off)
13./13. – The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild [03.3.2017]
14./00. – Catch ‘Em! Goldfish Scooping (D3 Publisher) [02.8.2018] (was 80% off)
15./14. – Minecraft (Microsoft Japan) [21.6.2018]
16./00. – Elemental Knights R (Winlight) [27.9.2018] (currently 96% off)
17./16. – Futari de! Nyanko Dai Senso (Ponos) [20.12.2018]
18./11. – Pokémon Sword (The Pokémon Company) [15.11.2019]
19./00. – Perfect Angle: Illusion Puzzle (Rainy Frog) [11.10.2018] (was 89% off)
20./00. – Fitness Boxing (Imagineer) [20.12.2018] (currently 20% off)



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Slownenberg said:
src said:

Its not though. Capcom have a finite number of teams and devs working on MH. They made the right choice in putting their resources into MHW and leaving Nintendo.

Or they could make another MH game for PS4/5/PC and sell another 10-15 million.

Did they though, make the right choice? On Switch there's a good chance it would have sold just as well or at least nearly as well, considering Switch's Japan dominance. But it would have cost less to make for Switch. So I wouldn't say keeping it off Switch was the right decision at all.

Or they could make another MH game for Switch and sell another 10-15 million, and have it cost less to make. So what's your point? Or they could double up and make a version for those other systems and a version for Switch and sell maybe 25 million without having to make a whole new game. Either way you cut it, Capcom isn't doing the smart thing. Seems to come down to third parties want to promote games with the highest level graphics, and they'll decide to forego more money simply for that sake. Hard to understand the business behind that, but that is what we've clearly seen for years now.

MH only sells 3-4 million in JP, SW is not going to change that.

MH on Nintendo sold 1-2 million overseas while MHW on PS4/PC sold 12 million+ overseas. Cost means very little when one PS4/PC game outsells every single 3DS game across 7 years in just 2 years: return on investment is so much bigger with MHW.

The idea that the old model is more profitable is factually wrong. Capcom broke their FY records with MHW.

PS4/PC simply have a bigger audience for MH than SW ever will.

Some of you say you want Capcom to do a spinoff for SW. Again, not the best route, as a spinoff on PS4/PC/PS5 would sell multiple times better than a SW game.



Marth said:

Nintendo eShop Sales: July 2020

01./New. – eBaseball Powerful Pro Yakyuu 2020 (Konami) [09.7.2020]
02./New. – Paper Mario: The Origami King (Nintendo) [17.7.2020]
03./01. – Clubhouse Games: 51 Worldwide Classics (Nintendo) [05.6.2020]
04./02. – Animal Crossing: New Horizons (Nintendo) [20.3.2020]
05./07. – Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (Nintendo) [28.4.2017]
06./00. – Moto Rush GT (Baltoro Games) [26.3.2020] (currently 93% off)
07./04. – Human: Fall Flat (Teyon Japan) [28.12.2017]
08./08. – Splatoon 2 (Nintendo) [21.7.2017]
09./09. – Super Smash Bros. Ultimate (Nintendo) [07.12.2019]
10./19. – Overcooked! 2 (Team17) [07.8.2018]
11./03. – Minecraft Dungeons (Mojang / Microsoft Japan) [26.5.2020]
12./00. – Real Time Battle Shogi Online (Silverstar Japan) [09.1.2020] (was 95% off)
13./13. – The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild [03.3.2017]
14./00. – Catch ‘Em! Goldfish Scooping (D3 Publisher) [02.8.2018] (was 80% off)
15./14. – Minecraft (Microsoft Japan) [21.6.2018]
16./00. – Elemental Knights R (Winlight) [27.9.2018] (currently 96% off)
17./16. – Futari de! Nyanko Dai Senso (Ponos) [20.12.2018]
18./11. – Pokémon Sword (The Pokémon Company) [15.11.2019]
19./00. – Perfect Angle: Illusion Puzzle (Rainy Frog) [11.10.2018] (was 89% off)
20./00. – Fitness Boxing (Imagineer) [20.12.2018] (currently 20% off)

I'm actually impressed to see eBaseball top the best selling list since Paper Mario had vouchers. Konami again showing that their strategy is far better than some other major Japanese 3rd parties. Also  Human: Fall Flat & Overcooked 2! continue to be the evergreen Western Indies. Sadly Candance of Hyrule hasn't gone up after being spotlighted on the Mini-Direct last month. Considering it got 8% of the total airtime, I was expecting it to rise a bit in the rankings but it's failing to chart. There is a physical version launching at the end of October, we shall see how strongly Nintendo Japan push this since they are the ones that gave Brace Yourself Games to use the Zelda IP. This remains one of the most surprising actions by Nintendo this year and one of the reasons indies are doing so well on the system. They've been far more interested in pushing indies both in Japan and elsewhere and now are even working with a select few of them on incorporating their Intelectual Property into their new games. You can read more about how Candance came about in the article below:

https://www.ign.com/articles/2019/03/21/how-an-indie-developer-is-making-an-official-zelda-game



src said:
Slownenberg said:

Did they though, make the right choice? On Switch there's a good chance it would have sold just as well or at least nearly as well, considering Switch's Japan dominance. But it would have cost less to make for Switch. So I wouldn't say keeping it off Switch was the right decision at all.

Or they could make another MH game for Switch and sell another 10-15 million, and have it cost less to make. So what's your point? Or they could double up and make a version for those other systems and a version for Switch and sell maybe 25 million without having to make a whole new game. Either way you cut it, Capcom isn't doing the smart thing. Seems to come down to third parties want to promote games with the highest level graphics, and they'll decide to forego more money simply for that sake. Hard to understand the business behind that, but that is what we've clearly seen for years now.

MH only sells 3-4 million in JP, SW is not going to change that.

MH on Nintendo sold 1-2 million overseas while MHW on PS4/PC sold 12 million+ overseas. Cost means very little when one PS4/PC game outsells every single 3DS game across 7 years in just 2 years: return on investment is so much bigger with MHW.

The idea that the old model is more profitable is factually wrong. Capcom broke their FY records with MHW.

PS4/PC simply have a bigger audience for MH than SW ever will.

Some of you say you want Capcom to do a spinoff for SW. Again, not the best route, as a spinoff on PS4/PC/PS5 would sell multiple times better than a SW game.

MH Stories target Yokai Watch audience, how did Yokai Watch on ps4 sold? More than 3ds version?



src said:
Slownenberg said:

Did they though, make the right choice? On Switch there's a good chance it would have sold just as well or at least nearly as well, considering Switch's Japan dominance. But it would have cost less to make for Switch. So I wouldn't say keeping it off Switch was the right decision at all.

Or they could make another MH game for Switch and sell another 10-15 million, and have it cost less to make. So what's your point? Or they could double up and make a version for those other systems and a version for Switch and sell maybe 25 million without having to make a whole new game. Either way you cut it, Capcom isn't doing the smart thing. Seems to come down to third parties want to promote games with the highest level graphics, and they'll decide to forego more money simply for that sake. Hard to understand the business behind that, but that is what we've clearly seen for years now.

MH only sells 3-4 million in JP, SW is not going to change that.

MH on Nintendo sold 1-2 million overseas while MHW on PS4/PC sold 12 million+ overseas. Cost means very little when one PS4/PC game outsells every single 3DS game across 7 years in just 2 years: return on investment is so much bigger with MHW.

The idea that the old model is more profitable is factually wrong. Capcom broke their FY records with MHW.

PS4/PC simply have a bigger audience for MH than SW ever will.

Some of you say you want Capcom to do a spinoff for SW. Again, not the best route, as a spinoff on PS4/PC/PS5 would sell multiple times better than a SW game.

You're failing to account for the fact that MHW opened up the franchise. MHW didn't sell way more than the series had before because it was on PS4/PC and not on Switch, it opened up sales so much because they made gameplay choices that appealed to more people. If it was on the Switch it woulda have destroyed sales of the series as well. It's not a PS4/PC thing. You can't compare old MH games to MHW and then say see it wouldn't have sold on Nintendo. That's like comparing BotW to old Zelda games and claiming previous Nintendo systems just didn't have an audience for Zelda but the audience changed for Switch. It is just plain wrong. The game changed to bring in more people.

If say MHW had come out on Switch instead you'd have 4-5 million sales in Japan alone, plus the expanded western audience due to the additional appeal the game brought in to the series. The western sales wouldn't be as large as they are now probably because yeah the PS4 audience is like built entirely on Fifa, GTA, CoD, and other action games, but the Japan sales would make up for that. Hell it might have even totally thrived in the West on the Switch as much as it has on PS4 because it'd be the only brand new AAA action game on the Switch outside of Nintendo properties.

The point is, they are throwing money away by not making the game for Switch as well, considering that Switch owns Japan and is the hottest selling system worldwide in a decade and we know that even 5 or 10 year old AAA games sell decently on Switch just from people who never played the games back when they came out or deciding to play it again because they can play it portable.

I'm not saying Capcom should abandon Sony/PC and do a Switch exclusive, I'm saying they'd sell many millions more copies of the same game if they spent probably less than 50% more time/money/effort to make a Switch version from the ground up. Unless Capcom is terribly limited in manpower there's no reason not to simply make another cheaper version of a mega selling game that would bring in millions more sales.

I do agree a spinoff isn't a good idea. Nobody wants a spinoff as some cheap consolidation - those are the types of third party games that do fail as one would expect them to on any system. Because there is no reason to not bring the full game built for the Switch to the hottest system on the planet that completely owns the market where MH has always been hugely popular.

Last edited by Slownenberg - on 05 August 2020

Slownenberg said:
src said:

MH only sells 3-4 million in JP, SW is not going to change that.

MH on Nintendo sold 1-2 million overseas while MHW on PS4/PC sold 12 million+ overseas. Cost means very little when one PS4/PC game outsells every single 3DS game across 7 years in just 2 years: return on investment is so much bigger with MHW.

The idea that the old model is more profitable is factually wrong. Capcom broke their FY records with MHW.

PS4/PC simply have a bigger audience for MH than SW ever will.

Some of you say you want Capcom to do a spinoff for SW. Again, not the best route, as a spinoff on PS4/PC/PS5 would sell multiple times better than a SW game.

You're failing to account for the fact that MHW opened up the franchise. MHW didn't sell way more than the series had before because it was on PS4/PC and not on Switch, it opened up sales so much because they made gameplay choices that appealed to more people. If it was on the Switch it woulda have destroyed sales of the series as well. It's not a PS4/PC thing. You can't compare old MH games to MHW and then say see it wouldn't have sold on Nintendo. That's like comparing BotW to old Zelda games and claiming previous Nintendo systems just didn't have an audience for Zelda but the audience changed for Switch. It is just plain wrong. The game changed to bring in more people.

If say MHW had come out on Switch instead you'd have 4-5 million sales in Japan alone, plus the expanded western audience due to the additional appeal the game brought in to the series. The western sales wouldn't be as large as they are now probably because yeah the PS4 audience is like built entirely on Fifa, GTA, CoD, and other action games, but the Japan sales would make up for that. Hell it might have even totally thrived in the West on the Switch as much as it has on PS4 because it'd be the only brand new AAA action game on the Switch outside of Nintendo properties.

The point is, they are throwing money away by not making the game for Switch as well, considering that Switch owns Japan and is the hottest selling system worldwide in a decade and we know that even 5 or 10 year old AAA games sell decently on Switch just from people who never played the games back when they came out or deciding to play it again because they can play it portable.

I'm not saying Capcom should abandon Sony/PC and do a Switch exclusive, I'm saying they'd sell many millions more copies of the same game if they spent probably less than 50% more time/money/effort to make a Switch version from the ground up. Unless Capcom is terribly limited in manpower there's no reason not to simply make another cheaper version of a mega selling game that would bring in millions more sales.

I do agree a spinoff isn't a good idea. Nobody wants a spinoff as some cheap consolidation - those are the types of third party games that do fail as one would expect them to on any system. Because there is no reason to not bring the full game built for the Switch to the hottest system on the planet that completely owns the market where MH has always been hugely popular.

Your logic is fundamentally flawed as you assume two factors are mutually exclusive when they are not. MHW allowed such an expansion directly due to it being on PS4 hardware that allowed a more open design, better graphics, animations and AI, all of which attracted new players into the series.

Not to mention the PS4 is ripe with a userbase that loves JP games, actions games and RPGs (FF, KH, Souls, Nier).

MHW's success is directly tied to PS4 (and later PC). SW only owns JP hardware sales, PS4 still sells a lot of software in JP. More importantly, PS4 owns WW. PSN has 113 million monthly active users, 44 million online subscribers and is far more lucrative to third parties than SW will ever be.

You keep quoting numbers that are baseless. I don't know how to respond to that other than they are baseless.

The reality of gamedev is you have a software pipeline. Said pipeline is a combination of in house devs, in house dev tools, outsourcing devs, infrastructure and talent acquisition. This takes 5-10 years to solidify to the point of efficient output.

SW is too weak to be considered in this pipeline, its Nintendo's own fault. Capcom would have to go out of their way to retune their in house engine and spend in house devs on SW ports of old software, which would have a lower ROI than spending those devs to work on new PS4/5 games. Lets not forget that they need to retool their engine for PS5 as well, a platform their entire output depends on.

TLDR: No one is ignoring the SW. Due to its low power SW dev is in direct competition with PS4 dev and PS4 dev is far more important to Japanese third parties. If SW was close to PS4 in power it would easily get those ports just like XB1 does or low end PCs.