Forums - Sony Discussion - How Sony will respond Game Pass?

Nautilus said:
0D0 said:

Tell us more about it, pls. Sony and Microsoft have been selling the same product with the same capabilities and specs so they naturally have to compete for the same audience. They're natural competitors in all basic business sense. How do you think their biggest competitor is Nintendo instead?

Do I have to? It's pretty obvious...

1 - Nintendo is the oldest player in this game. You never subestimate Nintendo.

2 - On the more tangible reasons, any company that is inside the gaming industry is competing with each other, dierctly and indirectly. And that's especially true for MS, Sony and Nintendo, which are all console manufacturers. MS and Sony are now catching up with Nintendo, entering into the 9th gen, which Nintendo has a "3 year advantage". Not only Nintendo has a bigger library that uses the Switch full capabilities, but it's an extremely strong library of first and third party games.Not only that, but it's biggest gun going into this holiday it's that it's going to be much cheaper than the PS5 and the Series X, potentially being 250 dollars during Black Friday.

When Nintendo was weak(During Wii U), it not only beat Sony in the handheld market, but it came back strong with the Switch. After countless failures, Nintendo never left the console war, while MS seems to be going the Sega route(which would eliminate it as a competitor, as far as Sony is concerned). And the the most important part of the industry, the software, is where Nintendo is easily the strongest of the three, in sales numbers, quality, quantity and variety.

Sony and MS may be similar in the hardware design, but that alone dosen't mean that they are their only direct competitors.They are first and foremost a hardware maker, and thus it makes Nintendo a direct competitor too. Add to that Nintendo strenghts, and they are easily it's strongest foe.

What? Oldest still playing, there were some before.

Mostly indirectly. Nin has an unbeatable portfolio of franchises and have been free to do their own thing for years. Console, portable, motion controls, they didn't rush to add online or trophies, they aren't focused on specs and graphics which therefore leads to lower prices, and so on. I mean sure they're in the same market but the truth is they've found a comfortable place as a secondary console to those who have another main platform. A sale is a sale. Of course this gen has been such a success they've gotten enough third party support to be a primary platform again. They don't have to worry too much about what everyone else is doing.

Countless failures? The hell? Other than the VB what could you be talking about? The U wasn't their strongest but I don't think it failed. I have a nice library of games on it. For sure, software is their strongest point. First party games have carried much of the weight through several gens.



Around the Network
Nautilus said:
0D0 said:

Tell us more about it, pls. Sony and Microsoft have been selling the same product with the same capabilities and specs so they naturally have to compete for the same audience. They're natural competitors in all basic business sense. How do you think their biggest competitor is Nintendo instead?

Do I have to? It's pretty obvious...

1 - Nintendo is the oldest player in this game. You never subestimate Nintendo.

2 - On the more tangible reasons, any company that is inside the gaming industry is competing with each other, dierctly and indirectly. And that's especially true for MS, Sony and Nintendo, which are all console manufacturers. MS and Sony are now catching up with Nintendo, entering into the 9th gen, which Nintendo has a "3 year advantage". Not only Nintendo has a bigger library that uses the Switch full capabilities, but it's an extremely strong library of first and third party games.Not only that, but it's biggest gun going into this holiday it's that it's going to be much cheaper than the PS5 and the Series X, potentially being 250 dollars during Black Friday.

When Nintendo was weak(During Wii U), it not only beat Sony in the handheld market, but it came back strong with the Switch. After countless failures, Nintendo never left the console war, while MS seems to be going the Sega route(which would eliminate it as a competitor, as far as Sony is concerned). And the the most important part of the industry, the software, is where Nintendo is easily the strongest of the three, in sales numbers, quality, quantity and variety.

Sony and MS may be similar in the hardware design, but that alone dosen't mean that they are their only direct competitors.They are first and foremost a hardware maker, and thus it makes Nintendo a direct competitor too. Add to that Nintendo strenghts, and they are easily it's strongest foe.

You said that Nintendo's the true biggest competitor. This is not a very common perception and not pretty obvious. When the console market is analysed, even by professionals, is always in terms of Xbox vs PS.

Nintendo is getting far different than Sony and MS since GC. With Switch, what Nintendo is selling is totally different than current gen consoles.

If we consider every platform that sell games a competitor. Yes, Nintendo, Google, Apple, Steam, etc are in the game. However, in terms of current generation classic console with the standard 3rd party library, there are only two choices: Playstation and Xbox.

It's obvious to see that Playstation owners might also buy Nintendo, Apple, Android, Google, Steam games. The same for Xbox owners. But Xbox owners usually don't buy PS and vice versa. So they're directing competing for the same audience. That's how they're each other's biggest competitors. Nintendo is a competitor, but not really the biggest competitor.



God bless You.

My Total Sales prediction for PS4 by the end of 2021: 110m+

When PS4 will hit 100m consoles sold: Before Christmas 2019

There were three ravens sat on a tree / They were as blacke as they might be / The one of them said to his mate, Where shall we our breakfast take?


d21lewis said:
0D0 said:

Tell us more about it, pls. Sony and Microsoft have been selling the same product with the same capabilities and specs so they naturally have to compete for the same audience. They're natural competitors in all basic business sense. How do you think their biggest competitor is Nintendo instead?

PC and Nintendo gamers have it great but they're always left out of the conversation and many resent that. 

In terms of game sales business, we have Apple, Google, Android, Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, Steam, Ubisoft own subscription, etc. All competitors, true. But it's no surprise that when the analysis is about PS and Xbox, the other ones, like Google or Nintendo, are left out. Xbox is the only device that can directly impact PS sales and vice versa.

Switch is a gaming console in formal sense, but it's actually something else in terms of library and technology. You can convince anyone to buy a Switch, but it's tough to convince a Xbox owner to buy a PS and vice versa. That explains why they focus so much on each other. They're each other's main threat.



God bless You.

My Total Sales prediction for PS4 by the end of 2021: 110m+

When PS4 will hit 100m consoles sold: Before Christmas 2019

There were three ravens sat on a tree / They were as blacke as they might be / The one of them said to his mate, Where shall we our breakfast take?


GamePass have 11million subscribers? PS Now has like 2 million, but not to mention PS + has 42 million subscribers. Meanwhile Microsoft is too shy/ashamed to announce their Xboxlive subscriber numbers. 



0D0 said:
Nautilus said:

Do I have to? It's pretty obvious...

1 - Nintendo is the oldest player in this game. You never subestimate Nintendo.

2 - On the more tangible reasons, any company that is inside the gaming industry is competing with each other, dierctly and indirectly. And that's especially true for MS, Sony and Nintendo, which are all console manufacturers. MS and Sony are now catching up with Nintendo, entering into the 9th gen, which Nintendo has a "3 year advantage". Not only Nintendo has a bigger library that uses the Switch full capabilities, but it's an extremely strong library of first and third party games.Not only that, but it's biggest gun going into this holiday it's that it's going to be much cheaper than the PS5 and the Series X, potentially being 250 dollars during Black Friday.

When Nintendo was weak(During Wii U), it not only beat Sony in the handheld market, but it came back strong with the Switch. After countless failures, Nintendo never left the console war, while MS seems to be going the Sega route(which would eliminate it as a competitor, as far as Sony is concerned). And the the most important part of the industry, the software, is where Nintendo is easily the strongest of the three, in sales numbers, quality, quantity and variety.

Sony and MS may be similar in the hardware design, but that alone dosen't mean that they are their only direct competitors.They are first and foremost a hardware maker, and thus it makes Nintendo a direct competitor too. Add to that Nintendo strenghts, and they are easily it's strongest foe.

You said that Nintendo's the true biggest competitor. This is not a very common perception and not pretty obvious. When the console market is analysed, even by professionals, is always in terms of Xbox vs PS.

Nintendo is getting far different than Sony and MS since GC. With Switch, what Nintendo is selling is totally different than current gen consoles.

If we consider every platform that sell games a competitor. Yes, Nintendo, Google, Apple, Steam, etc are in the game. However, in terms of current generation classic console with the standard 3rd party library, there are only two choices: Playstation and Xbox.

It's obvious to see that Playstation owners might also buy Nintendo, Apple, Android, Google, Steam games. The same for Xbox owners. But Xbox owners usually don't buy PS and vice versa. So they're directing competing for the same audience. That's how they're each other's biggest competitors. Nintendo is a competitor, but not really the biggest competitor.

In business the perception is very rarely the reality.  I remember watching a talk by Peter Thiel (Paypal cofounder) where he said every business in a highly competitive field is pretending to be a monopoly.  Meanwhile every monopoly is pretending to be in a highly competitive field.  One example he gave was Google, which has a monopoly on search engines, so they portray themselves as an advertising platform.  So many businesses are trying to misrepresent the reality, and sometimes the other "players" like analysts and journalists are actually doubling as marketers.

So the reality for gaming is that Nintendo and Sony are the two biggest players and both of these companies realize it even if they don't let on.  Microsoft is a significant player, but they've never had success in gaming anywhere near the other two.  How many generations has Microsoft won?  Zero.  Have they ever had a handheld system?  Nope.  They are, at best, as significant as Sega in their prime, but even Sega had a handheld system.

Meanwhile both Nintendo and Sony have a track record worth talking about.  Nintendo has won 50% of home generations that they were in (NES, SNES, Wii).  They've won 100% of handheld generations.  That's a very impressive track record.  Sony has won 75% of home generations that they were in (PS1, PS2, PS4), but they've won 0% of handheld generations.  Also, Sony successfully defeated Sega permanently in the home console market and that is like double points when you defeat a competitor for good.  However, Nintendo defeated Sony permanently in the handheld console market and that is again, like a double win.  Nintendo is the most dominant player in the video game industry, but Sony is a very worthy competitor.

Meanwhile, the perception is that Sony and Microsoft are the big players and Nintendo is this quirky little company doing it's own thing.  Nothing is further from the truth.  Microsoft is actually the one trying the weird, quirky strategies because they are trying to move all of gaming online.  They tried doing it at XB1 launch and they are trying it again with Gamepass.  Microsoft is very good about controlling the messaging on the internet, but they aren't so hot at actually understanding gaming, so I expect Gamepass to be another failed experiment.  However, Nintendo permanently defeated Sony in the handheld market, and then they launched the Switch.  The Switch, being a hybrid, means they can make a handheld device that also invades the home market.  That is the real threat to Sony.  It isn't Gamepass.  It's the Switch.

People think that Nintendo hasn't been competing with Sony and Microsoft since the Wii, but that begs a question.  "Why did Sony and Microsoft make motion control devices?"  It's because they considered themselves to be directly competing with Nintendo, even in the Wii era.  Nintendo doesn't make and market keyboard and mouse controls to compete with Steam, yet Sony and Microsoft did make and market motion controls to compete with Nintendo.  These 3 console makers all consider themselves competitors, but they also try to portray something very different to the rest of us.



Around the Network

Hopefully they just continue to do what they've been doing which has lead to them doubling the hardware sales of the competition. I don't want or need a netflix like gaming service. I can continue to just buy the games I want and not buy the games I dont want.



If Sony needs to respond to Gamepass that isn`t really something hard to do, they have bigger userbase, more noteworthy exclusives, at least as good relationship with devs. So putting a selection of games available through subscription wouldn`t take then long to make. Will they do it? I don`t think so, but if Gamepass gets to much traction or impacts PS5 sales to much Sony could do copy and paste improving or not the concept.
Would be a little harder to compete with it put together with XCloud, but since PSNow already exists it would be a matter of improving it.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Two curious things, the suggestion that devs pay to be on gamepass (seem this throw in one thread) or that they offer to put it for free on GP to get publicity (done here), last I heard publishers liked to receive for people to play their games not to pay for MS to profit from it.

Another curiosity is Gamepass have like 100 games on it? In 6 years of PS+ I have received at least more than 100 games permanently (considering my library says I have over 350 digital games and certainly didn`t buy more than 50, that is actually 300 tiles received some way or another without paying for it specifically). So PS+ and PSNow already do most of what GP offers.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Drakrami said:

GamePass have 11million subscribers? PS Now has like 2 million, but not to mention PS + has 42 million subscribers. Meanwhile Microsoft is too shy/ashamed to announce their Xboxlive subscriber numbers. 

They give a MAU or total XBL subs, which was lower than PS+ the last time we saw.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

If the gameindustry as a whole becomes a controlled environment like gamepass then wouldnt that be dangerous for devs that want to stay independent and would it not influence the amount of investment being put in exclusives?
And like with Netflix that overall did lower in quality pretty fast after gaining a huge marketshare of the movie/series streaming platform,recently they start to put more effort in the netflix originals again because of the competition but would that happen without competition?

Ofcourse atm gamepass seems like a good deal but it does worry me about what it can become.