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Forums - Politics Discussion - (POSSIBLE SPOILERS INSIDE) The agenda and political discussion of Naughty Dog

 

Have politics damaged the quality of ND games

No 39 41.94%
 
Yes 54 58.06%
 
Total:93
iron_megalith on 06 July 2020
DonFerrari said:
iron_megalith said:

Indirectly he does refer to TLOU2 which is HIS project. What else can he be referring to?

Certainly TLOU1 or any other past projects is not the topic here.

Him saying his work challenges conventions is quite narcissistic of him. His statement about HIS project is subjective. You let your art do the talking and let the crowd judge and decide. This is him looking like a fool by unnecessarily exalting his work.

If he had just stuck with defending people's hard work in this project(which deserves to be recognized) without self proclaiming any titles, it would have been totally fine.

Sure you wouldn't have made it sound bad anyway since you have been doing it on TLOU2 threads for almost all related to the game?

Considering the professional reviews and fan bomb reviews I would agree with him that the game subverted conventions and expectations. You are the one trying to say he is picking all the glory for himself.

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say that I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.



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DonFerrari on 06 July 2020
iron_megalith said:
DonFerrari said:

Sure you wouldn't have made it sound bad anyway since you have been doing it on TLOU2 threads for almost all related to the game?

Considering the professional reviews and fan bomb reviews I would agree with him that the game subverted conventions and expectations. You are the one trying to say he is picking all the glory for himself.

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a proper conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.

You sure post a lot for someone who doesn't care.



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iron_megalith on 06 July 2020
DonFerrari said:
iron_megalith said:

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a proper conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.

You sure post a lot for someone who doesn't care.

TLOU2 =/= Naughty Dog. Two different subjects. Learn to read.

Nice try.



Hynad on 06 July 2020
iron_megalith said:
DonFerrari said:

Sure you wouldn't have made it sound bad anyway since you have been doing it on TLOU2 threads for almost all related to the game?

Considering the professional reviews and fan bomb reviews I would agree with him that the game subverted conventions and expectations. You are the one trying to say he is picking all the glory for himself.

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say that I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.

Regardless or your interest in TLOU2, your input, along with EnricoPalazzo’s, has been toxic in most threads related to this game. If you didn’t care about the game, as you so claim, you’d stay away from the topics discussing it.



iron_megalith on 06 July 2020
Hynad said:
iron_megalith said:

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say that I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.

Regardless or your interest in TLOU2, your input, along with EnricoPalazzo’s, has been toxic in most threads related to this game. If you didn’t care about the game, as you so claim, you’d stay away from the topics discussing it.

I highlighted a part of my post just to further drill down what I'm bringing up in this thread. I believe me discussing Naughty Dog and Neil Druckmann should not imply me delving any further in TLOU2's faults.

Also, I don't really know what that other person you're bringing up as an example here, so I will only speak on my behalf. If you think that discussing a matter about a game and being objective about it is toxic, then I'm very sorry for disturbing your echo chamber of peace.



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Runa216 on 07 July 2020
Hynad said:
iron_megalith said:

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say that I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.

Regardless or your interest in TLOU2, your input, along with EnricoPalazzo’s, has been toxic in most threads related to this game. If you didn’t care about the game, as you so claim, you’d stay away from the topics discussing it.

This. This right here. There's a world of difference between toxic hatred and criticism. If this was just 'eeh, I don't like it', they wouldn't be putting so much effort into trying to push their agenda. 



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EricHiggin on 07 July 2020
iron_megalith said:
vonny said:

Can you show me where he said his work? Clearly speaking on behalf of everyone that worked on the game over the last 5 years, your assumption are just painting a narrative you wont to exist. 

Indirectly he does refer to TLOU2 which is HIS project. What else can he be referring to?

Certainly TLOU1 or any other past projects is not the topic here.

Him saying his work challenges conventions is quite narcissistic of him. His statement about HIS project is subjective. You let your art do the talking and let the crowd judge and decide. This is him looking like a fool by unnecessarily exalting his work.

If he had just stuck with defending people's hard work in this project(which deserves to be recognized) without self proclaiming any titles, it would have been totally fine.

It's his Twitter account as well, not ND's correct? Being one of the problems doesn't mean he's the entire problem, only a portion, large or small.

Neil also heavily implies that TLOU2 was entertaining and popular before it was even released. "Unfortunately, this is now the cost of making popular entertainment that challenges conventions".

No Neil. Unfortunately, that's not how it works. Just because you and your team thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread during development, doesn't mean that's what the players will think. It's the audience who decides whether something is entertaining, and the higher the overall positivity towards the medium, the larger the audience should grow, in which the more popular it will be said to be. 

Neil is clearly taking it quite personally, and there may be more than a few reasons for that which impact him personally, but it's not how he should be conveying his defense to the naysayers. At the very least, he should simply agree to disagree if he won't just ignore it, especially based on the position he holds.



Hynad on 07 July 2020
EricHiggin said:
iron_megalith said:

Indirectly he does refer to TLOU2 which is HIS project. What else can he be referring to?

Certainly TLOU1 or any other past projects is not the topic here.

Him saying his work challenges conventions is quite narcissistic of him. His statement about HIS project is subjective. You let your art do the talking and let the crowd judge and decide. This is him looking like a fool by unnecessarily exalting his work.

If he had just stuck with defending people's hard work in this project(which deserves to be recognized) without self proclaiming any titles, it would have been totally fine.

It's his Twitter account as well, not ND's correct? Being one of the problems doesn't mean he's the entire problem, only a portion, large or small.

Neil also heavily implies that TLOU2 was entertaining and popular before it was even released. "Unfortunately, this is now the cost of making popular entertainment that challenges conventions".

No Neil. Unfortunately, that's not how it works. Just because you and your team thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread during development, doesn't mean that's what the players will think. It's the audience who decides whether something is entertaining, and the higher the overall positivity towards the medium, the larger the audience should grow, in which the more popular it will be said to be. 

Neil is clearly taking it quite personally, and there may be more than a few reasons for that which impact him personally, but it's not how he should be conveying his defense to the naysayers. At the very least, he should simply agree to disagree if he won't just ignore it, especially based on the position he holds.

It's difficult to take this out of context, considering the tweet includes examples of what human garbage are posting to both him and the actress, yet you managed to do it. Probably because, like so many, you will understand whatever you already set your mind to, regardless of what it really says.

He's not addressing the naysayers. He's addressing the morons who take the hate too far and make death threats. 



iron_megalith on 07 July 2020
the-pi-guy said:
iron_megalith said:

Indirectly he does refer to TLOU2 which is HIS project. What else can he be referring to?

Certainly TLOU1 or any other past projects is not the topic here.

Him saying his work challenges conventions is quite narcissistic of him. His statement about HIS project is subjective. You let your art do the talking and let the crowd judge and decide. This is him looking like a fool by unnecessarily exalting his work.

If he had just stuck with defending people's hard work in this project(which deserves to be recognized) without self proclaiming any titles, it would have been totally fine.

Why is it "his" project?  

He worked with two other directors, another writer.  Not to mention ND's structure is flat.  Anyone can suggest anything to anyone.  

I doubt he considers it solely his project.  

Did I say that it was solely HIS project? That's like saying Interstellar is not Christopher Nolan's project because many people worked on it.

the-pi-guy said:
iron_megalith said:

There you go again. If you think I have some vendetta about this game, I think it's time for you to let go of that boogeyman. I haven't even engaged in a conversation about TLOU2 ever since you lashed out on me in the other thread. Because I really just don't care about that game at this point and I've already said my piece.

Now if you think that post of mine is regarding TLOU2, then you're sorely mistaken. And if you say that I am the only one who has raised an eyebrow at Neil's statement, open your god damn eyes.

Considering the dialogue around the game and ND since a few months ago, has included death threats and complaining about things that don't exist, no one should give half a mind how many people "raised an eyebrow". 

Like I said, if he really wanted to just defend his colleagues, he could have worded that in a different way. You could have taken those few words away that unnecessarily exalts his project and substitute that with something more meaningful and encouraging words to their team. And also, this is not the first time he did something like this.

Last edited by iron_megalith - on 07 July 2020

EricHiggin on 07 July 2020
Hynad said:
EricHiggin said:

It's his Twitter account as well, not ND's correct? Being one of the problems doesn't mean he's the entire problem, only a portion, large or small.

Neil also heavily implies that TLOU2 was entertaining and popular before it was even released. "Unfortunately, this is now the cost of making popular entertainment that challenges conventions".

No Neil. Unfortunately, that's not how it works. Just because you and your team thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread during development, doesn't mean that's what the players will think. It's the audience who decides whether something is entertaining, and the higher the overall positivity towards the medium, the larger the audience should grow, in which the more popular it will be said to be. 

Neil is clearly taking it quite personally, and there may be more than a few reasons for that which impact him personally, but it's not how he should be conveying his defense to the naysayers. At the very least, he should simply agree to disagree if he won't just ignore it, especially based on the position he holds.

It's difficult to take this out of context, considering the tweet includes examples of what human garbage are posting to both him and the actress, yet you managed to do it. Probably because, like so many, you will understand whatever you already set your mind to, regardless of what it really says.

He's not addressing the naysayers. He's addressing the morons who take the hate too far and make death threats. 

Out of context? What it really says?

"This kind of hate"?

What kind exactly? Since that's not explained by him. If he's referring to something else, then that allows for, interpretation.