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Forums - Sony Discussion - Unreal Engine 5 Announced + PS5 Demo

curl-6 on 20 May 2020
CGI-Quality said:
curl-6 said:

I know. I'm more talking about folks interpreting Sweeney's comments as PS5 being stronger than XSX or a top end PC due to SSD secret sauce, and that we should bear in mind when when people are trying to sell us on something they will obviously highlight its best aspects above all.

Those opinions are mainly fruitless because it just exposes everyone's stake in it. Very much like the meaningless teraflop debates. The PS5 is the weaker overall device, no denying it, cleaning it, what have you, BUT, it will still be able to handle tasks in ways that the XSX will not. No denying that either. 

I get why some are look too far into from both directions, but the hardware is the hardware. No different than when a 1080Ti wins a few points over a TITAN X in a benchmark here or there. Those very rare instances will never remove the latter's very real superiority (and those two devices are even further apart in power than the two upcoming consoles).

Pretty much, yeah. I'm sure the debate will rage on for years to come; might even get interesting when we have actual games to go on. Now we've seen what PS5 can do the ball is really in Microsoft's court to show a similarly impressive example of what XSX can do.



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Pemalite on 20 May 2020
CGI-Quality said:


Carmack weighs in

The plot thickens.

Bandorr said:
CGI-Quality said:


Carmack weighs in

Almost none of that tweet makes sense to me. All I get is SSD = big deal. Everything else flies over my head.

For the average person, that is pretty much what it sums up as. SSD = Good. HDD = Bad.

Soundwave said:
CGI-Quality said:

I have some ideas, but that side of tech isn't my thing. I'm better with the details of graphics hardware (such as TMUs, Bus Interface, and CUDA). What can be deduced though is the pipeline is changing and much of the work is going to be offloaded to the SSD (in NVMe form). This is why some people mistakenly expect the consoles to 'beat' the PC next gen, while not understanding that the PC can already do that, and when it is provided with those types of SSDs in the market, will actually do it better.

AMD's RDNA 7nm processors can't even outperform Nvidia's 12nm Turing line which is like 2 years old architecture now. 

Nvidia Ampere 30-series is going to wipe the floor with AMD, lets be honest. 

AMD is doing wonderful things on the CPU side versus Intel mostly in terms of offering nice performance for cost solutions, but on the GPU side they don't match up very well versus Nvidia. 

Correct. RDNA does come up short against Turing.

But there are edge cases where RDNA will out-edge nVidia, AMD's main dominance since Graphics Core Next debuted has been asynchronous compute and RDNA still does really well there... Not as well as Vega, but still really well, when AMD's OpenCL compiler isn't being shit that is.

curl-6 said:

Pretty much, yeah. I'm sure the debate will rage on for years to come; might even get interesting when we have actual games to go on. Now we've seen what PS5 can do the ball is really in Microsoft's court to show a similarly impressive example of what XSX can do.

Once the next-gen games start rolling out and we can dissect the real-world implicated differences in actual games (What these devices are meant for!) then we will have an idea between platform differences.

Keen to see what the Xbox Series X can do, Microsoft needs to demonstrate that appropriately.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite on 21 May 2020

Before the 8th gen launched, I asserted that one of the big tech focuses moving away from the 7th gen will be geometric complexity, we saw that with 150x-300x improvements in geometry performance and games looked stellar as a result. - Many games still took a baked lighting approach though, some didn't.

I assumed the 9th gen was going to be all about lighting, but it seems the SSD's are enabling some impressive texturing and geometry gains as well.

But I am also excited to see a return to 3D positional Audio, I haven't been this pumped about a console generation in a very very long time.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

curl-6 on 25 May 2020

Alrighty, I am back in the city with semi-decent internet and have finally been able to watch the full 9-minute version in full HD.

Updated thoughts? Still impressive as hell. The richness, intricacy, and absence of the typical video-gamey artefacts and limitations puts it head and shoulders above the best looking graphics of PS4/Xbone.

I don't think it's quite as big as the leap from PS1/N64 to PS2/GC/Xbox or PS2/GC/Xbox to PS3/360, but it's definitely bigger than the last generational gap.

Last edited by curl-6 - on 25 May 2020

setsunatenshi on 27 May 2020

Couldn't be any more clear, for those with weird conspiracy theories:





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Jizz_Beard_thePirate on 04 June 2020

People say a lot of things so I wouldn't take their word on anything until the games actually come out...



The one key thing I would remember when it comes to third party games is that rarely will they build their engines around the highest performing feature on the market... If they build their engine so that it only performs well on PS5's SSD or Series X's GPU or AMD's 64 core threadripper cpu, then they alienate the rest of the market. Majority of the third party games will use the most common spec cause that will be good enough for all platforms while adding some advantages to specific platforms.

With that being said though. PS5's SSD is indeed super fast and MS does have DirectStorage API for PC and Xbox as well as Nvidia is rumoured to have Tensor Memory Compression so we will see how it goes. I wouldn't underestimate PC's capabilities though...



                  

PC Specs: CPU: 7800X3D || GPU: Strix 4090 || RAM: 32GB DDR5 6000 || Main SSD: WD 2TB SN850

kirby007 on 04 June 2020

why do i wanna use the words secret sauce?



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

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Jizz_Beard_thePirate on 04 June 2020
CGI-Quality said:
Captain_Yuri said:

People say a lot of things so I wouldn't take their word on anything until the games actually come out...


With that being said though. PS5's SSD is indeed super fast and MS does have DirectStorage API for PC and Xbox as well as Nvidia is rumoured to have Tensor Memory Compression so we will see how it goes. I wouldn't underestimate PC's capabilities though...

PC isn't really being underestimated here, because it does not have the SSDs ready to go toe-to-toe with the one in the PS5. On top of that, it's more a matter of I/O than even SSD speed. A lot of what is being said is not just fluff to bat chests. These changes are real.

The best example will be in something like a Spider-Man game. See those benches repeated in the game (where they are stored in a folder with that many files in it)? Next gen, it will be one bench stored and the many, many others instanced around the city (keeping folder sizes down and access to the data much faster). That is what is going to make these particular advances in the new machines so important.

I am not saying the changes aren't real. I am sure games will see a huge improvements in game design and etc when moving from hard drives to SSDs. What I am suggesting is that majority of the 3rd party games will not require Ps5's SSD and will work just fine with Series X and a lot of PC's Nvme SSDs, specially with things like DirectStorage API and the rumoured Tensor Memory Compression from Nvidia. Because if it did need PS5's SSDs, then they wouldn't get any sales from Series X or PC which is silly at best... First party games, yea, they can make use of the SSD no doubt...



                  

PC Specs: CPU: 7800X3D || GPU: Strix 4090 || RAM: 32GB DDR5 6000 || Main SSD: WD 2TB SN850

Jizz_Beard_thePirate on 04 June 2020
CGI-Quality said:
Captain_Yuri said:

I am not saying the changes aren't real. I am sure games will see a huge improvements in game design and etc when moving from hard drives to SSDs. What I am suggesting is that majority of the 3rd party games will not require Ps5's SSD and will work just fine with Series X and a lot of PC's Nvme SSDs, specially with things like DirectStorage API and the rumoured Tensor Memory Compression from Nvidia. Because if it did need PS5's SSDs, then they wouldn't get any sales from Series X or PC which is silly at best... First party games, yea, they can make use of the SSD no doubt...

It isn't a matter of a requirement for function, but for real change, yes, these SSDs will be necessary. People don't really understand — developers have been asking for this for more than a generation. No one said that only the PS5's SSD can take advantage of the engine (or any engine, for that matter). That would obviously be a misinformed suggestion given what is coming to PC in the next few years. Rather that it will be better at doing so given its advantage. 

Unless everyone wants just another generation, for more things on screen, better physics, AI, efficient use of raytracing and fuller worlds...

.....then said SSDs will be essential to that move forward.

I suppose I should have specified by saying... Majority of 3rd party who will use UE5...

And yea, I do agree we will see the benefits of SSDs come into play and third parties using them since Hard Drives really have been a bottleneck for a while now. We will see how the difference in SSD plays out though since I have my doubts due to the GPU capabilities.

Last edited by Jizz_Beard_thePirate - on 04 June 2020

                  

PC Specs: CPU: 7800X3D || GPU: Strix 4090 || RAM: 32GB DDR5 6000 || Main SSD: WD 2TB SN850

Oneeee-Chan!!! on 05 June 2020