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Forums - Sony Discussion - Ps4 shipment reached 110.4mill

I think they probably could get to 150 million, but they just don't want it.

I mean they could cut the price to $199.99 and then further in the future to say $159.99 ... but the consumer that buys at that price doesn't pay a lot for games and I think there's not much incentive for Sony to lose that much in unit profit per unit just to get more sales from the type of people that don't buy a lot of new software.

These are not the types of people that are going to spend hundreds of dollars for Sony on PSN, they are the types of people that want dirt cheap software and $19.99 bargain clearance games from Best Buy and maybe the yearly single COD or FIFA. 

Doing the math it probably makes them more money to keep the fatter $100+ profit margin they likely enjoy on the PS4 even if it only sells 15-20 million more units rather than cut that margin substantially just to hit 140, 150 million. 



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BraLoD said:
vonny said:

Profit is more important than sales, Sony hardly made anything from the ps2 success. 2 billion > 20 million more sales.

Of course, and having more PS+ subscribers to keep things aflot during the first PS5 year of cashing back R&D costs is way better than having a big drop right before it.

Having a bigger userbase is way more than just those one time sales. PS+ and more people to buy TLoU2 is where the money is at, not profiting in hardware sales.

$100 price drop is equal to about 3 game sales at full price, only one in two people actually buy PS+. People that hold off until the end of a generation wont be buying dozens of games and I highly doubt there would be a high PS+ attachment rate.

Not dropping the price doesn't mean the userbase isn't increasing, there's a reason why the ps2 barely made more than the gamecube.



Soundwave said:

I think they probably could get to 150 million, but they just don't want it.

I mean they could cut the price to $199.99 and then further in the future to say $159.99 ... but the consumer that buys at that price doesn't pay a lot for games and I think there's not much incentive for Sony to lose that much in unit profit per unit just to get more sales from the type of people that don't buy a lot of new software.

These are not the types of people that are going to spend hundreds of dollars for Sony on PSN, they are the types of people that want dirt cheap software and $19.99 bargain clearance games from Best Buy and maybe the yearly single COD or FIFA. 

Doing the math it probably makes them more money to keep the fatter $100+ profit margin they likely enjoy on the PS4 even if it only sells 15-20 million more units rather than cut that margin substantially just to hit 140, 150 million. 

I agree with your think.

At the same time, I'd say that putting PS4 at the hands of the biggest number of houses possible (without losing profitability) is important. Many people that could get access to a cheap PS4 might not invest a lot on it but some of them could start getting into it and upgrade to a ps5. I mean, fans and gamers will always invest, but in order to get less enthusiastically crowds to turn them into fans, cheaper price helps. There's also those who are on the other side: I have a xbox fan friend that would pick up a ps4 just to try out if it was bit cheaper. If he could buy one today, he could get into TLOU, love it and end up preordering TLOU2 and maybe in a few years he could be more enthusiastic about Sony or even become a fan.

Anyway, I agree that profit comes first and selling 150m ps4 doesn't mean anything, but I'm just saying that at the same time, completely disregarding the idea of a new price cut is not what I'd do if I were running Playstation business. 



God bless You.

My Total Sales prediction for PS4 by the end of 2021: 110m+

When PS4 will hit 100m consoles sold: Before Christmas 2019

There were three ravens sat on a tree / They were as blacke as they might be / The one of them said to his mate, Where shall we our breakfast take?


Soundwave said:

I think they probably could get to 150 million, but they just don't want it.

I mean they could cut the price to $199.99 and then further in the future to say $159.99 ... but the consumer that buys at that price doesn't pay a lot for games and I think there's not much incentive for Sony to lose that much in unit profit per unit just to get more sales from the type of people that don't buy a lot of new software.

These are not the types of people that are going to spend hundreds of dollars for Sony on PSN, they are the types of people that want dirt cheap software and $19.99 bargain clearance games from Best Buy and maybe the yearly single COD or FIFA. 

Doing the math it probably makes them more money to keep the fatter $100+ profit margin they likely enjoy on the PS4 even if it only sells 15-20 million more units rather than cut that margin substantially just to hit 140, 150 million. 

My rough estimative considering the new buyer where to keep the attach ratio for SW and PS+ (10 or so titles, 40% PS+ for 5 years) for a 100 pricecut they would need at least 10M extra sales due to the cut. So instead of 130 they would need 140M. There is just to little time to achieve that. They would need to have made the cut like 2 years ago. And even like that perhaps they already knew the sales wouldn't increase enough long term. They would just shift the sales to earlier. So now they are cutting because they are keeping profitability and also putting a new system out so they need to have a good gap in prices.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

PS4 is on track to end his life having sold something between 115~120M. It can be described as nothing less than a huge victory for Sony.

The amount of pessimism about Sony after PSVita failure and losses taken with PS3 was big. I still remember the grim predictions that many here did for the future of PS4 in 2012.



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zumnupy10 said:
PS4 is on track to end his life having sold something between 115~120M. It can be described as nothing less than a huge victory for Sony.

The amount of pessimism about Sony after PSVita failure and losses taken with PS3 was big. I still remember the grim predictions that many here did for the future of PS4 in 2012.

It will sell over 120M without question. It needs to ship 10M from now until PS5 release plus 2 years or more after, don't think that will have any challenge. The only challenge is crossing 125M to reach 130M.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

 244.9m games sold during the past fiscal year.  That is the number I find most interesting.  I mean, on this site we focus more on hardware, but hardware is a simple number that is easier to track.  It's a good benchmark.  But software is really what is important.  Software is important to gamers, and software is where a company makes it's profits.

On Nintendo's recent financial report they sold 168.7m software units.  That tells me that PS4 is still the most popular system in the world right now.  Eventually people move on to another system, but most PS4 players have not moved on yet.  Given, PS4 has about twice the install base of Switch and it is not selling anywhere near twice the software.  Some have moved on to the Switch or at least gotten tired of their PS4 for a while.  But still, the bottom line is that PS4 is still the most popular platform in the world right now.  It's still selling the most games even if hardware sales have died down.



The_Liquid_Laser said:

 244.9m games sold during the past fiscal year.  That is the number I find most interesting.  I mean, on this site we focus more on hardware, but hardware is a simple number that is easier to track.  It's a good benchmark.  But software is really what is important.  Software is important to gamers, and software is where a company makes it's profits.

On Nintendo's recent financial report they sold 168.7m software units.  That tells me that PS4 is still the most popular system in the world right now.  Eventually people move on to another system, but most PS4 players have not moved on yet.  Given, PS4 has about twice the install base of Switch and it is not selling anywhere near twice the software.  Some have moved on to the Switch or at least gotten tired of their PS4 for a while.  But still, the bottom line is that PS4 is still the most popular platform in the world right now.  It's still selling the most games even if hardware sales have died down.

You are making a slight mistake on for one portion considering how much sw were sold on the year but then making ratio of that with the cumulative hw sales.

If you look at total SW sale PS4 sold more than twice of what Switch done (at least last I checked), if you look at current year then PS4 sold like 50% more SW on half the HW sold.

PS4 will be a healthy system until it is replaced by PS5 and will even keep selling some after that.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

 244.9m games sold during the past fiscal year.  That is the number I find most interesting.  I mean, on this site we focus more on hardware, but hardware is a simple number that is easier to track.  It's a good benchmark.  But software is really what is important.  Software is important to gamers, and software is where a company makes it's profits.

On Nintendo's recent financial report they sold 168.7m software units.  That tells me that PS4 is still the most popular system in the world right now.  Eventually people move on to another system, but most PS4 players have not moved on yet.  Given, PS4 has about twice the install base of Switch and it is not selling anywhere near twice the software.  Some have moved on to the Switch or at least gotten tired of their PS4 for a while.  But still, the bottom line is that PS4 is still the most popular platform in the world right now.  It's still selling the most games even if hardware sales have died down.

You are making a slight mistake on for one portion considering how much sw were sold on the year but then making ratio of that with the cumulative hw sales.

If you look at total SW sale PS4 sold more than twice of what Switch done (at least last I checked), if you look at current year then PS4 sold like 50% more SW on half the HW sold.

PS4 will be a healthy system until it is replaced by PS5 and will even keep selling some after that.

You may be misinterpreting what I am saying, so let me try to say it again.  I mostly want to figure out what is the most popular platform right now.  It's the PS4.  I am not looking at lifetime software results.  I am just talking about right now, or more accurately, the past fiscal year. 

But if you look in terms of install base, PS4 has twice the install base of Switch, but didn't sell twice the software during the past fiscal year.  Not all of those PS4 owners are actively buying software.  PS4 has about 110m potential owners to buy software, while Switch only has about 55m potential owners.  If all owners were equally engaged, then PS4 would sell about twice the software of the Switch just in the past fiscal year.  That is why I am comparing annual software sales to total hardware sales.  Even people who bought a PS4 in 2013 can still buy games.  But the double install base is not resulting in double software sales.  The average PS4 gamer is not currently engaged like the average Switch user is currently engaged. 

My conclusion is that some, a minority, of PS4 users are tired of their PS4.  They either moved onto the Switch or they simply stopped playing games.  

Last edited by The_Liquid_Laser - on 14 May 2020

120 Million lifetime for the PS4 is a lock at this point.

Too bad we didn't get any software numbers for SIE titles. I wonder if GoW & Horizon have crossed the 15 Million lifetime barrier, or if Spiderman is approaching 20 Million lifetime sales.