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shikamaru317 said:
gtotheunit91 said:

My guess is sales weren't so hot? For how much marketing Sony did for the game, it never was topping sales charts. At least the major ones. 

Last info I saw was that it was the 18th most downloaded game on the PlayStation Store for 2021 in the US and Canada. Or it could have been a pre-established deal with the game since it'll be just a few days after the game loses its exclusivity window. 

Yeah, but Phil could have just advertised the heck out of the Xbox launch, instead of selling Sony PS+ rights to the game on the same month the game releases on Xbox. That's a bad look, allowing a first party game to release on your closest competitor's service the same month it releases on Xbox.

Maybe, but this all based on assumption that Deathloop releases in around two weeks. I can bet that it doesn't, so I don't really see any problem here.

WoodenPints said:

I'm curious outside of playing them "Free on Gamepass" how many of us here are buying Xbox games physical still? I used to be a physical only buyer last gen but with all the installer on a disc or the the Xbox One version only on a disc requiring full game download for Series X anyway it's made me care very little for physical copies on the Series X but I also care just as little for digital game prices in the UK.

I still try to buy physical games whenever possible, especially in case of my most anticipated releases that I want to have in collection, but it's getting harder and harder and I don't have the same collector's passion as I did a few years back. I used to buy everything that's cheap (with big discounts) and that I have at least some interest in even I knew that some of these games I'll never play. Now, I only buy the games that I know for sure that I'm gonna play in the next couple months. I don't care that much if the game requires download or not, I just prefer the physical versions in general. I did buy Series S as my secondary Xbox console for better portability in case of travels, so this also kinda adds to not caring as much about physical media as much as I did before. Will probably be moving more and more into digital, with occasional double dips for some most wanted games.

gtotheunit91 said:

Gonna add Persona 5 Royal to that list when it goes up? I was looking into getting Soul Hackers 2 but I keep hearing/reading of how it's a lower budget title that only the diehard Atlus fans will really enjoy. I still might pick it up later on sale. 

I'm playing it right now and I somewhat can confirm that it's definitely a lower budget project that you shouldn't expect a lot from it. I really enjoy it but I'm biased because I love Atlus games and it was definitely my most anticipated game the moment it was announced. It's quite short from what I understand, it's battle system is a bit primitive compared to recent Atlus games. It's a good addition to library and definitely worth checking out if you are into JRPGs, but I would say that Persona 5 Royal or Shin Megami Tensei V are objectively more interesting Atlus releases.

gtotheunit91 said:

I wonder the likelihood of any of these titles coming to Xbox

Raiden IV is definitely coming at least. It was already announced sometime before.

Ryuu96 said:

I do agree with most things but honestly is it just me who feels like ray tracing is the most overhyped/disappointing feature of this generation? I really couldn't care less if Halo gets it or not, Lol. Feels like not many games have it anyway cause it's stupid demanding and if they do get it, quite a few receive it after launch when I've stopped caring about the game and beyond that, a few really don't provide huge differences to already great lighting.

It's not really about whether raytracing is overhyped or not. Or does local coop matter these days or not. It's simply about not delivering on your promises. Just releasing the game in an unfinished state was not the right thing to do from the start. When it comes to raytracing, I think 343 decided not to waste their time for it at launch and then maybe come back to it at a later date. But as it turned out, there is not much hype about it anymore, so there is no reason to waste resources on this feature. The same with local co-op. I don't believe them at all when they say that they have some technical difficulties with especially when we have proofs that it is possible for it to work based on the fans that got it working. There is no technical difficulties with local co-op, they just have some data that suggests that spending resources on it is not worth it. But anyway, this shouldn't have been promised and announced at all in this case. I totally understand Halo fans frustrations with the state the game is currently in, and I will probably say a bit controversial opinion on this, but it's time for Microsoft to have a balls and do either of these three things: publicly acknowledge that they failed, move on from Halo Infinite to the next entry built from scratch by either giving the last chance for 343 under Joseph Staten, not using the Slipspace engine or whatever it's called and move to UE or idTech, or to just try to give the right to make a new game to some other studio, because let's face it - 343 had enough chances already. Or do just something that seems completely unimaginable and put Halo franchise to rest entirely. Halo had it's prime time and will always be remembered as one key Xbox franchises, but unfortunately, the new generation of gamers just doesn't care enough about this franchise and 343 doesn't seem to know how to make it work with younger audiences anyway. Considering how Halo isn't as big these days as it was before, I really doubt that Xbox brand will somehow struggle if we won't see any new Halo games. Microsoft now has a lot of studios and I'm fairly confident that they are capable of making modern new IPs that can replace Halo in the future as flagship franchise.

gtotheunit91 said:

Fans have already gotten split screen co-op to work in Infinite

https://twitter.com/halocreation/status/1565750119500324867?s=46&t=hafqOFPqQqVnz-Vc7NLt8Q

And here is a proof to what I said above.



 

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gtotheunit91 said:

My god. I’ve never seen the Halo community and franchise in general in such disarray. It really makes me think something is going to happen soon out of this. Idk what, but something.

With Modern Warfare II releasing a week and a half before the Winter Update, Microsoft putting a freeze on hiring, so I fully expect more delays, idk how Infinite survives the remainder of this year.

My brother told me that Infinite already has less total players than the new BF, which is a far worse game, so...yea. Not good.



@poll

Voted for exclusives but don't really care about any of these options that much. As for GamePass, with a limited time I have, if the game is good I don't have any problem to buy it at full price even at launch. I have GamePass Ultimate, but simply because it's not that much more expensive than Gold, and Gold is needed to play multiplayer anyway. I use GamePass usually in two cases: to play the digital only games that are there that I'm interested in, because I don't see much value in buying a game digitally. And to play the games that I have physically in case I need to on Series S console. Having said that, deals that put a certain game in GamePass day one do nothing for me at all, unfortunately. If the game is good and I'm interested in playing it - I'll play it anyway, GamePass or not. 

As for exclusives, personally don't really care that much as well. I don't need the game to be available just for me and the people who chose the same console as me to enjoy it. I think that 90%+ games that I play these days are available on all platforms anyway. But @shikamaru317 is right in the conclusion that exclusives give a nice marketing boost. The more people joining ecosystem, console sales grow, which means more money for devs, bigger audience, more games coming to Xbox, more developers interested in developing for the platform, etc. Yes, it's not a consumer friendly practice, but that's just how this business has been working for decades. So, based on this, exclusives edge this out for me.



 

Nah, Bonnie gotta go



Angelus said:

Nah, Bonnie gotta go

Agreed.



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Ryuu96 said:
NobleTeam360 said:

Agreed.

And Frankie*
And they need to fix their engine*
And they need to staff up a lot*

Suppose my main issue is soundbites like "Bonnie gotta go" seems to imply that she is the sole issue and removing her would fix everything but it wouldn't by a long shot, Frankie is the man responsible for development of Halo 5/Infinite so he should go too, then there is the contractor policy which isn't 343's fault at all, it's Microsoft's policy, there is nothing 343 can do about that other than hiring more permanent staff.

Not at all, Bonnie is one person removing her would likely result in further departures or firings with whoever new steps in to lead the studio. It's clear the issue at 343 starts from the top and that ineptitude has infected the rest of the studio, so calling for the leaders head seems like a natural thing to want and is a start to fixing the studio. 



Ryuu96 said:
NobleTeam360 said:

Not at all, Bonnie is one person removing her would likely result in further departures or firings with whoever new steps in to lead the studio. It's clear the issue at 343 starts from the top and that ineptitude has infected the rest of the studio, so calling for the leaders head seems like a natural thing to want and is a start to fixing the studio. 

Sure, I didn't disagree with that...

Still doesn't fix the engine issue, the contractor policy or 343 being understaffed (the latter of which could be Microsoft's fault rather than 343's).

And I mean...Most of the creative leads have already been let go, so I'm not sure who else is left aside from Bonnie and Frankie.

Joe already took charge as "Head of Creative" of Halo, a new Multiplayer lead was put in place, a new Live Service lead was put in place, Studio Head for Halo Infinite specifically was removed entirely, a lot of people are already being cycled out, Idk whether that is people leaving of their own accord or the staff being shaken up but people ARE being replaced one way or another already.

Just going to take a while for the new guys to take over and fix this mess, Lol.

My point is that there is a number of issues that need tackling, some which aren't going to be fixed just cause Bonnie is canned, not that I'm disagreeing that she should be canned, but, if she goes and Frankie somehow remains (which is a possibility) then you still have the man responsible for Halo 5/Infinite's messy development leading the next development.

Who should replace Bonnie too? Definitely not Joe Imho, Joe has never led a studio and his expertise isn't business, I want him to remain in development, having a creative input, managing the actual development teams, u'know, Frankie's job, Lol.

No idea who would replace her, and yeah, I acknowledge that many of the issues that plague 343 likely aren't her fault but when things go wrong, the leader bears the brunt of the blame and sure get rid of Frank as well. Bonnie and him have been involved with the failures of Halo for the past few games. 

Of course, like you pointed out earlier, I'm not actually expecting MS/Xbox to get rid of Bonnie (let alone Frank) because it's not like Infinite is the first Halo game to face significant issues under Bonnie or Frank and both are still here despite those failings. 



I'd question whether it would be best for Halo to just drop the MP and live service support and just go and become the flagship big budget game with more regular campaign releases which would streamline development and speed things up it's not like there would be much room in the first party list of MP/Live Service games when ABK joins Xbox they will have a premium FPS and Battle Royale with CoD and a top arena Shooter with Overwatch they could fully focus on instead.



Ryuu96 said:
NobleTeam360 said:

Not at all, Bonnie is one person removing her would likely result in further departures or firings with whoever new steps in to lead the studio. It's clear the issue at 343 starts from the top and that ineptitude has infected the rest of the studio, so calling for the leaders head seems like a natural thing to want and is a start to fixing the studio. 

Sure, I didn't disagree with that...

Still doesn't fix the engine issue, the contractor policy or 343 being understaffed (the latter of which could be Microsoft's fault rather than 343's).

And I mean...Most of the creative leads have already been let go, so I'm not sure who else is left aside from Bonnie and Frankie.

Joe already took charge as "Head of Creative" of Halo, a new Multiplayer lead was put in place, a new Live Service lead was put in place, Studio Head for Halo Infinite specifically was removed entirely, a lot of people are already being cycled out, Idk whether that is people leaving of their own accord or the staff being shaken up but people ARE being replaced one way or another already.

Just going to take a while for the new guys to take over and fix this mess, Lol.

My point is that there is a number of issues that need tackling, some which aren't going to be fixed just cause Bonnie is canned, not that I'm disagreeing that she should be canned, but, if she goes and Frankie somehow remains (which is a possibility) then you still have the man responsible for Halo 5/Infinite's messy development leading the next development.

Who should replace Bonnie too? Definitely not Joe Imho, Joe has never led a studio and his expertise isn't business, I want him to remain in development, having a creative input, managing the actual development teams, u'know, Frankie's job, Lol.

If the issue is an inadequate number of staff, then that's something that Bonnie should be constantly fighting for, no? She's in charge of the business. And why does this contractor thing only seem to come up as it concerns 343? Nobody ever says anything about contractors when it comes to The Coalition, Turn 10, Playground, or whoever. 

Maybe 343 does need more staff, but sometimes it seems to me like we're making endless excuses for this studio (and the people who run it) that we don't for anybody else. The fact of the matter is, they've had more than enough time to become the caretakers of the Halo franchise we deserve. But time and time again, they manage to come up woefully short in one aspect or another. If Phil, Booty, and whoever else is responsible for overseeing Xbox studios don't take some serious steps to address whatever the fuck is happening up there at 343, then I'm honestly going to lose a lot of faith in Xbox as a whole. This is your most important franchise. Halo and Xbox have been one and the same since the first console launch. You can't keep letting it get dragged through the mud like this.



Metal Hellsinger is a nice add.