In all fairness , there are way more “white” movies than black movies.
Then again, there are way more black movies than Asian movies. How about American Native movies? Latino movies?
In all fairness , there are way more “white” movies than black movies.
Then again, there are way more black movies than Asian movies. How about American Native movies? Latino movies?
sugenis said:
I don't fully think you understand what disproportionately being represented means. A population that makes up the majority; are going to be the ones most represented, that's just logic, that's math. Being overrepresented is when a population that makes up about 13% of the population dominates entire mediums. That's when it's disproportionate. Anyway on the subject of Us, the movie is not about race at all. Did people even watch it? |
That's fun, because I'm not sure you know what disproportionately means. If whites make up 61% of the population but make up 86% of the leading roles in film than they are disproportionately represented. Now that doesn't sound like a big difference if but from the minority perspective that's the difference between having 39% of the roles if it were proportionate to 14%, a massive drop.
Here's a report on the proportion of leads by race compared to the general population:
https://socialsciences.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/UCLA-Hollywood-Diversity-Report-2018-2-27-18.pdf
...
Hiku said:
I see who you are referring to then. Because it's impossible for anyone to debate the circumstances surrounding a statement like "black people posting hatred against white people (and being applauded)", if we don't know what you're referring to. Maybe no one would agree with that statement. Or there were circumstances worth noting, or misinterpretations were made. Regarding your last paragraph. I want to see if I understand what you're saying. (I'll ignore the "even if it's racist" part unless you specify a case that was, so I can actually comment on it.) |
Hiku I would say you captured most of the revelant point.
On the "even if it's racist" (not claiming Jordan is) I was talking that there could/have been situations where the choice was racist but since it was against white people it was just ignored. But since from what you are saying I understand you would be against racism no matter the source or target we don't have to dwelve much on it.
And also you are right on today landscape in USA someone saying he wants to make a serie of movies based on Han dynasty and thus would only hire asian people (let's ignore that we accept that anyone from asia play any role even if someone that have intimacy with this ethinicities can easily differentiate Japanese, Korean, Chinese, among others) no one would bat an eye and that is totally cool for me, but if someone said he will only cast white people because he wants to do movies based only on experiences of white people or even because the setting is historically on an all white place he would get criticism for not being diverse.
Again, I'm 100% pro creators being free to chose what they want and being criticized on the merits of the result being bad when that happens (would open a caveat for imbecile changes of cast on adaptations that only purpose is shoe horned diversity, still normally those works end up being bad anyway), what I'm against in here is that this same freedom of choice isn't fully embraced depending on who/what is the target.
duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363
Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994
Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."
Torillian said:
That's fun, because I'm not sure you know what disproportionately means. If whites make up 61% of the population but make up 86% of the leading roles in film than they are disproportionately represented. Now that doesn't sound like a big difference if but from the minority perspective that's the difference between having 39% of the roles if it were proportionate to 14%, a massive drop. Here's a report on the proportion of leads by race compared to the general population: https://socialsciences.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/UCLA-Hollywood-Diversity-Report-2018-2-27-18.pdf |
I'm sure you know this since you have special tags...but honestly it's a futile quest to try to instill logic or reason into the minds of white males who are convinced they are being repressed. Few delusions are grander than that of the privileged convinced they're the victims here.
wow gotta say these threads really continue to show me how disconnected from reality ppl in this community are about racial dynamics.
AngryLittleAlchemist said: It really just sounds like white leads are not suited for the roles he's trying to create, I'm pretty sure Get Out and US are about the experience of black people, at least thematically. |
I didn't get that sense from any of his interviews regarding "Us".
“It’s important to me that we can tell black stories without it being about race,” Peele says. “I realized I had never seen a horror movie of this kind, where there’s an African-American family at the center that just is. After you get over the initial realization that you’re watching a black family in a horror film, you’re just watching a movie. You’re just watching people. I feel like it proves a very valid and different point than Get Out, which is, not everything is about race."
DonFerrari said:
You either didn't understood me, or ignored several replies. I want him to have as much freedom and cast whoever he wants. My point is if it was a white guy saying he will only cast white leads there would have been an outcry from media, while on this case they will applaud this behavior. |
This is exactly why you do not get the point. In an industry where the default is a white male lead, where the default is white male directors, where the purse strings for big budget movies are controlled by old white men. You are trying to pretend that everything is equal and thus the context of his statement should be considered equally if a White male made the same statement. Context is king in understanding a person view point and the statements they say. In your original OP, you only took out the part that supported your own interpretation of what Peel stated ignoring everything else because it did not fit your argument.
You want to paint a picture that everything is equal so every statement can be weighted with the same scale but its not. This is the problem with your stance. Things are not equal. POC are not represented on the same scale as white people and definitely as lead roles. Trying to make a black and white case on this point seems foolish when the playing field isn't level.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_black_films_of_the_2010s
I personally don't have an issue with Jordan's comments, let him make what he wants. I just hope that there's no shitstorm when a white director says the same thing about a white lead.
Torillian said:
That's fun, because I'm not sure you know what disproportionately means. If whites make up 61% of the population but make up 86% of the leading roles in film than they are disproportionately represented. Now that doesn't sound like a big difference if but from the minority perspective that's the difference between having 39% of the roles if it were proportionate to 14%, a massive drop. Here's a report on the proportion of leads by race compared to the general population: https://socialsciences.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/UCLA-Hollywood-Diversity-Report-2018-2-27-18.pdf |
I'm doubtful of any statistics that just use 'minority' or 'poc' and 'white' without defining anything. Primarily, because many Hispanics consider themselves white and will declare themselves that way on the census and other forms. However, there's no way that report is correct in declaring white as 61% of the population unless they do not include any Hispanic population. Even worse, that report doesn't include any hard data in its appendix or even source the demographics data for its claims. They just declare 'these are the true and factual numbers' with no citation. Even if they gathered the data themselves it needs a detailed methodology in the appendix.
It's clearly an article piece instead of an actual sociology paper, regardless of its writers.
Machiavellian said:
This is exactly why you do not get the point. In an industry where the default is a white male lead, where the default is white male directors, where the purse strings for big budget movies are controlled by old white men. You are trying to pretend that everything is equal and thus the context of his statement should be considered equally if a White male made the same statement. Context is king in understanding a person view point and the statements they say. In your original OP, you only took out the part that supported your own interpretation of what Peel stated ignoring everything else because it did not fit your argument. You want to paint a picture that everything is equal so every statement can be weighted with the same scale but its not. This is the problem with your stance. Things are not equal. POC are not represented on the same scale as white people and definitely as lead roles. Trying to make a black and white case on this point seems foolish when the playing field isn't level. |
You'll beat the same point trying to say same thing is or isn't racism 'depending on the context' when it isn't.
So if you want to call one racism, you have to call the other.
duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363
Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994
Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."