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Forums - Sony Discussion - PlayStation Nation | an HBO original

Otter said:

For those who are happy with it, great for you. For those who are not, feel free to voice your annoyances since its literally the only way companies ever budge on anything. And there's very obvious reason for discontent here

1. Why is it 80% of publishers can offer free upgrades and PC games do not charge for scalable graphic settings or even post launch upgrades but Playstation studios is so broke & struggling they need to charge $10 just so you can play the DLC you've already bought on their new platform?

2. Lets also acknowledge that this is even inconsistent from Sonys side as Miles Morales did not charge $10 to upgrade to the PS5 version. Why did they need to implement it here if Miles did not? And Miles had ray tracing and like 4 different performance modes. The value of this upgrade is also really questionable right now since the PS4 version already plays at 60fps/1440p on PS5. So for now it seems like we're paying for controller functions and maybe a resolution boost.

3. I'm not even against games increasing in price but if you need to do so, don't do it for cross-gen titles which are clearly built on PS4's foundation, or games like Returnal which clearly have a much smaller budget than most AAA titles we've seen last gen. One quick look at the Ghost trailer and its clear its just a PS4 game unlike the likes of  Ratchet or Horizon 2

4. Even though I said I'm okay with inflation of video game prices, its an already very expensive hobby and in the UK PS5 games are £70 which is almost equivalent to $100. New games used to easily be found for £39.99, PS4 games already saw inflated prices and this jump is to £70 is too much for probably the smallest generational leap we've seen. I'm also all for supporting the industry but with digital giving publishers a bigger cut of profits and many companies like Sony thriving more than they ever in software revenue, I really don't have empathy for the inflation argument for reasons to charge Playstation 5 owners a surplus for this kind of cross gen content

5. I will never really have time for people defending basic corporate greed. Again, I'm all for companies succeeding but when they're making more money than EVER, I will definitely stand on the side of consumers who are uncomfortable with the price hike. Especially when other companies are demonstrating that the price hike (especially the kind we're seeing in the UK) is simply not necessary. Pay it if you like and enjoy your games, but also get used to people making a fuss on forums etc when company X charges you for things that many others are offering for free.

It seems you have some severe misunderstandings concerning how...the world works. How the economy works.

1 - They do that because they want to, not because they need to. I write short stories for a living, and I know my work is a luxury item for those who can afford it. I can AFFORD to only charge 50 bucks per story...but I charge 100+ per story because I know people will pay it (So much so I'm dozens of stories behind on my owed commissions), and because why wouldn't I value my time? If Sony feels people are willing to pay 70 for PS5 games and they sell well, BAM! That's how the economy works. Most people with actual jobs and who are actually part of the economy understand that game prices can and will go up. That's just how it is, and most people don't care that much. It's only the entitled subgroups that bitch the loudest. 

2 - Again, they chose to or not to. That was a decision they made based on the circumstances. You're not entitled to control how a company prices their games or their content. you don't just get to say 'LOOK! THEY DID IT ONCE NOW THEY GOTTA DO IT FOREVER!' Again, that's just not how time works. As things change, so do their decisions. Maybe Sucker Punch put a LOT of effort into Iki island? Maybe there was a lot more work involved in the upscaling than it seems? Or maybe they're just trying it to see what they can do? Vote with your wallet, but stop bitching about it and whining about a natural progression of prices in a free market.

3 - They're luxury items, not essentials. This isn't the US pharmaceutical companies jacking up the price of insulin or a company forming a monopoly over, I dunno, bread. Games are not something you are entitled to. They're a hobby. They're no more important to your survival than a dildo collection. So again, you don't get to decide what companies decide what is and isn't worth it. Nobody WANTS to pay more, but holy shit it's insane just how far people will go to justify 'bawwww, I am entitled to this luxury item at the same price regardless of budgets or inflation or what the seller deems a reasonable price!'

4 - I don't get you. You even acknowledge that it's a luxury/hobby, and that this really isn't a big deal, you're just whining because you think in a free market that setting a precedent somehow excludes them from updating their decisions and policies as time goes on.

5 - It's not 'corporate greed', it's literally the free market in action concerning a luxury item. While the games industry is filled with corporations, the reality is that games are art even if they exist in this weird art/product overlap. If companies want to charge 200 for a game, then it's up to the market to vote with their wallets. If they charge more and they get it, then it's not greed, it's just how things go. I personally hate apple/iPhone and think they're horrendously overpriced...but I'd never be dumb or entitled enough to say that Apple is not able to charge those prices or that they don't deserve it. If they charge it and still sell out with record numbers every year, then that's what their product is worth. You may not value it the same, but it's your job to adjust to the market based on where the majority go, not throw a fit because you don't particularly agree with the price point chosen by the company and the market on the whole. 

If you don't like prices going up...then don't buy it. Simple as that. wait for a price reduction, buy used, borrow it from a friend, or just don't play the game. You're not going to starve or go cold or end up on the streets because you didn't wanna pay 10 bucks more for the Ps5 version of a game. 

This is just entitlement masquerading as a revolution. Get with the times, learn a bit about the economy, and stop acting like companies are wrong for charging a price they feel is fair. And...if it turns out that the market collectively rejects the $70 price point, then they'll change it or die trying. If that happens, though, I guarantee you'll see more gatcha game mechanics in future games. If paying 10 bucks extra means I don't have to buy microtransactions to make up the difference on first party games, I'm all in. I'd rather pay 10 extra than turn my games into 'service models'.

And if you already have Ghost of Tsushima...then play it. It still looks wonderful and plays amazingly well. I honestly always felt it to be super weird that so many companies WERE giving away the upgrade free of charge. super grateful for it, but that doesn't mean we're entitled to it all the time. 

This attitude is exactly why so many people hate gamers and think we're all petty children. 



My Console Library:

PS5, Switch, XSX

PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1, WiiU, Wii, GCN, N64 SNES, XBO, 360

3DS, DS, GBA, Vita, PSP, Android

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Runa216 said:
Otter 

. -snip

This attitude is exactly why so many people hate gamers and think we're all petty children. 

I'm sorry all of this is classic corporate boot licking, responding to every point with the benign stance of they're a corporation they can do what they want is extremely redundant. Reminds me of the PS3/Vita psn store debackle and some of the responses we saw there before sony done a 180. I personally didn't care about the store closures but I'm also happy to let those who do, voice their concerns. Corperations can do as they want and I will still complain on topics that irk me, I'm forever happy to be the reason people hate gamers ^_^ 

Last edited by Otter - on 02 July 2021

Runa216 said:
Otter said:

Except FFVIIR is another game that lets you upgrade to the PS5 version for free ;)

except if you want to get the expansion (Yuffie's stuff) you gotta pay extra. If you don't like the PS5 conversion fee, don't pay it. THAT is the only way companies will learn. 

I personally think it's worth it and thus will be happily buying in again. I got the game twice on PS4 already, soooo...what's 40 CAD?

I don't think anyone is complaining about paying for DLC. There is no PS5 conversation price, you get the PS5 game for free. You are only charged $20 for the extra DLC content if you choose to buy it.

This is just one of many games in a huge list where the publisher does not charge gamers to convert their PS4 game into a PS5 game. I love this new consumer friendly precedent! And it just reminded me to check out the free PS5 Doom Eternal upgrade with raytraycing 

Last edited by Otter - on 02 July 2021

twintail said:
Otter said:

I don't think anyone is complaining about paying for DLC. There is no PS5 conversation price, you get the PS5 game for free. You are only charged $20 for the extra DLC content if you choose to buy it.

This is just one of many games in a huge list where the publisher does not charge gamers to convert their PS4 game into a PS5 game. I love this new consumer friendly precedent! And it just reminded me to check out the free PS5 Doom Eternal upgrade with raytraycing 

free is always best. 

But I fail to see the issue with Sony deciding to charge. They clearly feel their investment should be recouped.

I think its safe to say this logic applies to all business decisions or anything a company charges for, but It doesn't really move the needle with how we feel about them or how we should feel.

Industry standards and consumer expectations evolve, and this is just one of those situations and people will be vocal about it: similar to how charging for online without any additional perks became a sour topic for xbox. No one here is calling Sony evil, just many others publishers are changing expectations and sony will naturally be judged against this. A bit removed but it reminds me of the first time I was charged for tap water at a pub in the UK. Like yeah they're free to do that and recoup the cost of their water bill, but when you're the only pub doing that its not a good look lol

Last edited by Otter - on 02 July 2021

BraLoD said:

Just confirm Bluepoint already, Sony!

I think if they've been working on the bloodborne remaster/remake, it may come alongside that news.



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twintail said:
Otter said:

I don't think anyone is complaining about paying for DLC. There is no PS5 conversation price, you get the PS5 game for free. You are only charged $20 for the extra DLC content if you choose to buy it.

This is just one of many games in a huge list where the publisher does not charge gamers to convert their PS4 game into a PS5 game. I love this new consumer friendly precedent! And it just reminded me to check out the free PS5 Doom Eternal upgrade with raytraycing 

free is always best. 

But I fail to see the issue with Sony deciding to charge. They clearly feel their investment should be recouped.

It's actually quite upsetting to me how...aggressive some people can be with this. Like, of course I love that so many of the game upgrades are free. I would prefer to not pay more but I'm not so blind to the reality of economics to get upset about a natural progression of video game prices. 

"You're just a corporate boot licker..." Like bro, you serious? I don't begrudge a company who feels the work they do is worth more than they were charging and I have a firm grasp on the concept of inflation. I don't WANT prices to go up but I'm not dumb enough to think it's not going to happen or to throw a fit when it does. There is absolutely nothing unbecoming or outlandish about companies charging more for their latest games. Just because some companies, in an effort to convince people to convert to the new consoles, chose to give away those upgrades for free doesn't mean we're entitled to it. 

If I invite you to my place for some homemade Lasagne, you don't get to come back tomorrow and demand more lasagna! 



My Console Library:

PS5, Switch, XSX

PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1, WiiU, Wii, GCN, N64 SNES, XBO, 360

3DS, DS, GBA, Vita, PSP, Android

Runa216 said:

It's actually quite upsetting to me how...aggressive some people can be with this. Like, of course I love that so many of the game upgrades are free. I would prefer to not pay more but I'm not so blind to the reality of economics to get upset about a natural progression of video game prices. 

"You're just a corporate boot licker..." Like bro, you serious? I don't begrudge a company who feels the work they do is worth more than they were charging and I have a firm grasp on the concept of inflation. I don't WANT prices to go up but I'm not dumb enough to think it's not going to happen or to throw a fit when it does. There is absolutely nothing unbecoming or outlandish about companies charging more for their latest games. Just because some companies, in an effort to convince people to convert to the new consoles, chose to give away those upgrades for free doesn't mean we're entitled to it. 

If I invite you to my place for some homemade Lasagne, you don't get to come back tomorrow and demand more lasagna! 

So I'm definitely leaving the topic after this point but I wanted to clarify a huge difference in how we approach this discourse. 

The conversation was not about you being happy with the conversion fee, no one has aggressively challenged you on that, quoted you on that or insisted you need to begrudge Sony or change your stance, or that you're dumb for having your stance. In fact several times, I said its great people are happy to pay whilst also stating it's completely understandable others find it off-putting in the context of the cross gen nature of the game, the overwhelming industry response to upgrades of a similar nature  etc etc, all of which of course takes into account the economy/inflation which every other company is also subject to. Sony doesn't exist in an economic bubble.

It's you however who is insistent that there is no room for people to have their own feelings based on how others in the industry have set expectations, based on how sony has operated in the past etc. This toe-the-line narrative, where no one can verbally criticize a company on pricing because its a free market is what I was referring to as corporate bootlicking. Vote with your wallets sure, but also we're on a forum so can we all express our annoyances in words too? No one is oppressing the mega-corporation sony for you to get so defensive. 


"It's only the entitled subgroups that bitch the loudest"
"Vote with your wallet, but stop bitching about it and whining about a natural progression of prices in a free market."
"I'd never be dumb or entitled enough to say that Apple is not able to charge those prices or that they don't deserve it."
"Get with the times, learn a bit about the economy, and stop acting like companies are wrong for charging a price they feel is fair. "


But I'm the one being agressive. Yikes!

Lastly on your Lasagna analogy, it would be more fitting if we compare it to a transaction with a corporation. If I went to McDonalds and they gave me one free sauce with my fries, my next visit I also expect one free sauce with my fries (unless they made it clear it was a promotional deal). Equally, if every restaurant gives free salt & pepper, and then suddenly I eat at one that charges me 50p, forgive me for feeling a way about it. But that truly is my last on the matter, I didn't expect it to be such a controversial stance lol

Last edited by Otter - on 03 July 2021



CloudxTifa said:

Yasss! fingers crossed

Really hoping to get release dates for Stray/ Little Devil Inside/Tokyo Ghost and finally a reveal for Ragnarok. 



Runa216 said:
twintail said:

free is always best. 

But I fail to see the issue with Sony deciding to charge. They clearly feel their investment should be recouped.

It's actually quite upsetting to me how...aggressive some people can be with this. Like, of course I love that so many of the game upgrades are free. I would prefer to not pay more but I'm not so blind to the reality of economics to get upset about a natural progression of video game prices. 

"You're just a corporate boot licker..." Like bro, you serious? I don't begrudge a company who feels the work they do is worth more than they were charging and I have a firm grasp on the concept of inflation. I don't WANT prices to go up but I'm not dumb enough to think it's not going to happen or to throw a fit when it does. There is absolutely nothing unbecoming or outlandish about companies charging more for their latest games. Just because some companies, in an effort to convince people to convert to the new consoles, chose to give away those upgrades for free doesn't mean we're entitled to it. 

If I invite you to my place for some homemade Lasagne, you don't get to come back tomorrow and demand more lasagna! 

I would say I'm more bothered by the fact that most games are kinda hard priced table... Why almost all regular physical games were releasing for 60 USD in USA? For me some of those games could have been 10 or 100 because that was that much difference in value in both my eye and cost to make the product. But for some reason most games have the same MSRP at launch.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."