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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - How could Nintendo implement a Switch Pro?

BlackBeauty said:
Why are people saying Xavier is “too big”?

Tegra X1 was too big. They shrunk it for mobile use.

They will shrink Xavier.

And there’s no point in upgrading to X2 when Xavier is available is way better.

Xavier is specifically designed for deep machine learning, so most of it's power would get lost in a gaming scenario unless you work very long to get the power out of the machine, similar to the Cell in the PS3. This would make porting games potentially a nightmare to realize as the power is there in theory, but unlocking it would need druidic knowledge of it's inner workings.



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If Switch gets an upgrade, then what it needs is

1) A longer battery life
2) A bigger harddrive
3) a better processor that prevents framerate drops

It doesn't need better graphics. All of this focus on graphics is kind of a red herring.



I’d be in favour of incremental hardware updates on the Switch that offers a performance enhancement with a higher tier version of new software. Perhaps some bell and whistle non-core features. I don’t like the idea of calling it “The Switch Pro” though, that’s tacky. Call it something like the Switch S or the Switch 2. Then for the 3rd gen hardware, assuming it is out around the 4-5 year mark, allow software devs to begin dropping support for Switch 1 if they wish to do so, and then when gen 4 comes allow them to drop gen 2... note this probably won’t happen in most cases because they would be losing market share; but some higher fidelity games will require it.



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Pemalite said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

 Add to this a TDP of 30W, and you can see why Xavier won't make it into a future Switch console.

Shrink it to 10/7nm and allot of that TDP would be greatly reduced. - At the moment it is being fabricated on a "12nm" process. (Albeit, more like a refined 14/16nm process which in turn is based on 20nm planar... But I digress.)

Bofferbrauer2 said:

 While it still uses LPDDR4, Xavier has a 256bit connection instead of the usual 64bit (dual channel), meaning it has a 4 times higher bandwith than what you would normally expect with LPDDR4. It reaches 137Gbit/s, on par with low power GPUs (for instance, an Radeon RX 560 with 16CU only has 112Gbit/s).

It could have a 512-bit LPDDR4 connection with 274GB/s of bandwidth. It is still not enough for 8k.

I am probably the last person on these forums you need to explain bandwidth, bus widths, clock rate and so on. :P

Bofferbrauer2 said:

The GPU is rated at 1.3TFlops, roughly the same as the OG Xbox ONE (1.31, the S is clocked higher and thus a bit faster at 1.4TFlops)


Yeah. Using flop numbers in meaningless.
It's common knowledge that nVidia GPU's, be it Maxwell, Pascal or Volta is simply more efficient than the Archaic Graphics Core Next architecture in the Xbox One.
Nor are the bandwidth numbers even directly comparable either. (I.E. Delta Colour Compression.)

A shrink would save power, no doubt about that. But 30W is about 10 times what the Switch is consuming, one shrink alone wouldn't cut it. It would need a 5nm process at least to get it to consume less enough to not drain the battery too fast. Add to this that Nintendo is very conservative in that regard (They want proven hardware and nodes, hence why their hardware tends to be older already at releaser than Playstation or Microsoft's internal Hardware.

Where did I ever say it could play 8K games? It can be happy to run major games in FHD even after the upgrade. I just wanted to point out that, while it's still LPDDR4, the bandwith is closer to entry level GPUs than what we have normally with CPU and hence can support a bigger GPU part without getting bottlenecked so early as LPDDR4 may have implied to other readers here.

I know directly comparing Flops is meaningless, but it can give a rough direction as to how powerful the GPU part is



I'm leaning enhanced dock, myself. It would be possible for the raw mathematical data to be sent from the console itself and translated in a secondary GPU in the dock to output in 4K without needing to patch games. Problem would be the unchanged textures, though. They would be hideous.



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Don't get me wrong either, I think an enhanced dock option is a great idea too - particularly for those who play a lot in docked mode.

I would personally prefer an update to the handheld unit. I usually only play in docked mode 1-2 days a week, while playing in handheld every day. But I don't think this is a situation where the only options are an updated device OR a powered dock - I think both can be done each Switch generation.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Medisti said:
I'm leaning enhanced dock, myself. It would be possible for the raw mathematical data to be sent from the console itself and translated in a secondary GPU in the dock to output in 4K without needing to patch games. Problem would be the unchanged textures, though. They would be hideous.

Your basically talking about an upscaler in this scenario. It is pointless to upscale bad textures as you said.

Any upgrade the switch gets would be pointless.

The dock solution needs to be designed from the ground up with the next system to actually make it worth while. a small boost is a waste of money. It needs to be a big boost like a xbox one to xbox one x kind of boost.



 

 

JEMC said:
I don't think they'll launch a Switch Pro. Devs already have to work with two configurations for their games, and adding a third one will only make the optimization more complicated.

I doubt that. If the games are already made with scalability in mind (Switch undocked/docked, XBO S/X, PS4 Slim/Pro, dynamic resolutions and dynamic effects), adding a third or fourth configuration should be very easy, especially if the additional version is more performant than the base version.



Cerebralbore101 said:
They'd be better off, promptly launching the Switch's successor March 03rd of 2022. Same concept, better hardware, and backwards compatible with Switch. But Nintendo won't do that. They have a bad habit of dropping nearly all support for their current console, waiting a year, and then launching a successor. Wii was nearly unsupported for all of 2012, before they launched the Wii U. The Wii U barely got anything from summer 2016 to spring 2017, when the Switch launched.

I don't think working with Nvidia Tegra was the right decision if they're NOT making it backward compatible; updated compatibility is kind of the point of the Tegra.

I agree that Nintendo is leaving a lot of money on the table by not supporting established bases leading up to new hardware. It would be WAY more financially beneficial if they continued supporting older hardware for at least 3 years after the launch of next-generation hardware and would establish a lot of consumer confidence in upgrading hardware down the road; it would also mean that there's no huge rush to get the killer app out - with Switch, Nintendo NEEDED to get their killer app at launch because their entire fanbase was waiting for the next console - it was make or break. BUT, if that fanbase isn't waiting, and there is instead a multi-year window for them to update, that's a much healthier way to shift between generations; and that's why mobile and PC manufacturers are so successful - you get an iPhone 5S for example, you don't HAVE to upgrade to iPhone 6 the moment it releases or lose all future software support; you're basically getting all new software for 3 years after the iPhone 6 launches, and you can upgrade when you want - and it probably won't be iPhone 6, but 7 or 8.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

I'm getting flashbacks of people clamouring for a HD Wii with HD Zelda and AAA 3rd party support.

Mario Party has already given us an idea of how portable 4K can be done with Switch.



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