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Forums - Politics Discussion - Where do you stand in the Kuril Islands dispute?

VGPolyglot said:
DonFerrari said:
I stand in Brazil.

But on your consideration of Japan being able to become a potency despite having the island, you can look on the other side that Japan have very small land and sea for them while Russia have plethora of land so on your equality demands shouldn't Japan receive the land to be less unequal?

That's a very misleading way of describing equality, especially since internationalist socialism is anti-nationalist.

So shouldn't your position be that the island belong to neither of the countries and they form their own government or communist society?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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CaptainExplosion said:
VGPolyglot said:

You still haven not provided evidence and I know that you won't, so there is either 3 possibilities here:

1. You have deluded yourself into thinking it's true

2. You know it's not true but you're lying

3. You are joking

Why you insist on this despite not being able to come up with anything is beyond me, unless you believe that by insisting in it it is going to make it true. All I asked for was a source, if it was so obvious there'd be a wealth of information for you to choose from.

Fine, you want evidence he's a monster? Here.

Or how about here?

Or how he made gleeful comments on state media in response to the people he poisoned?

My argument wasn't that he was not a dictator, of course he is. But you didn't provide any sources of giving nukes to North Korea.



DonFerrari said:
VGPolyglot said:

That's a very misleading way of describing equality, especially since internationalist socialism is anti-nationalist.

So shouldn't your position be that the island belong to neither of the countries and they form their own government or communist society?

Well, ideally yes, but that doesn't change the current situation, and the current situation is that Russia controls the islands.



CaptainExplosion said:
VGPolyglot said:

My argument wasn't that he was not a dictator, of course he is. But you didn't provide any sources of giving nukes to North Korea.

He'd still do it anyway, because likeminded dictators help each other. It happened in World War II, in the USSR days, and it's happening today.

So, I see that you're just going to refuse to concede that you have no evidence and that you just made that up.



VGPolyglot said:
DonFerrari said:

So shouldn't your position be that the island belong to neither of the countries and they form their own government or communist society?

Well, ideally yes, but that doesn't change the current situation, and the current situation is that Russia controls the islands.

Yes they control the islands, but that wasn't your question.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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mutantsushi said:
Farsala said:
Shikotan and Habomai should definitely be Japanese as agreed upon. Russia just uses it as a buffer for negotiations. 

OK, but the relevant fact is that Japan is the party that refused to implement that agreement (peace treaty).
I agree it is plausible model of future agreement, but Japan has not seriously tried to re-establish that never-signed agreement.
Japan has not stated it is willing to recognize Russian territory and establish full peace in exchange for Shikotan and Habomai group.
They periodically enter "negotiations" but even basic acknowledgement of previously agreed deals doesn't seem to happen. (publicly)
Essentially, Japan has sabotaged that kind of deal over and over. If Russia is still open to it, that is as generous as one can imagine.
And Russia doesn't seem desperate for this deal, like I wrote, they want solid peace treaty, not Japan still de facto military allied against it.

Really, this thead has been taken over by off-topic troll, and the wall of text with links I bothered to dig up are ignored. Lovely.

EDIT: Mostly I just don't understand why anybody choosing to be interested in this topic would NOT want to engage with detailed facts like I linked. If somebody isn't really interested in the topic at all, obviously that is their personal choice. But if you are interested, what are you doing if not engaging with historic details? I guess we some people who seem to push emotional tangent based on propaganda they buy into, but that was really just one poster.

If you are talking about real peace, then Japan is the country that haven't made any war, invasion or killing since the WW2.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

HomokHarcos said:
CaptainExplosion said:

Never, but they were constantly ready to do so, because they just hate the Western way of life for no reason. Don't forget their fanatical aggression towards other countries, which Putin is also bringing back.

Trump's the one that threatened to totally destroy a country (North Kore). I don't remember Putin saying something like that.

You mean after Kim had said about destroying Japan, SK and or USA?

Also Satan 2 claims made by Putin is as invencible mean to nuke USA... funny how both countries complain of others having nukes while making more of theirs.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Let Russia have it , they need more space to live, and they have been suffered on having small country.



HollyGamer said:
Let Russia have it , they need more space to live, and they have been suffered on having small country.

Apparently Japan having a good economical situation makes the need for space zero, while the immense underpopulated landmass of Russia will become rich with the islands.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Kemono said:
Well, these islands don't have big value. For both sides this thing is something about jingo patriotism. As a Russian, I prefer sell it a high rate to Japan and forget about this story.
PS: sorry for my poor grammar.

I don't understand, can you elaborate? Is Kaliningrad remaining a part of Russia about jingo patriotism?
The US "owns" Saipan/Marianas, ceded by Japan after WWII, after Germany ceded them to Japan after WWI. What is difference?
Should Poland give up territory to Germany, since that was also result of WWII victors changing borders against fascist aggressors?

The US government simply happened to want to prevent Japan making peace with the other major Ally country against Axis.
Which would seem to be the normal outcome of that war, the fascist aggressor making peace with countries who defeated them.
I believe even the US originally considered that the normal outcome, they just sabotaged it once policy shifted post-WWII. 
So where is jingoism? Do you expect Russian speaking residents of islands to learn Japanese, or would you just kick them out?

What do you think of earlier 2+2 deal which Japan agreed to until changing it's stance at behest of US? Hard to get insight to secret diplomatic negotiations, but even if Japan apparently hasn't been seriously negotiating towards full peace treaty to Russia's liking, I have to say that if they did, the 2+2 deal would probably be accepted by Russian government, after all once it's been proposed it's hard to put genie back in bottle (although Japanese government rarely mentions this episode following US pressure to abandon it in Cold War). Like I wrote, the EEZ factor which isn't immediately apparent when comparing island land area, is enough for Japan to save face, without impacting most of Russian population. Although Shikotan does have small fishing town whose population would need to be respected.

DonFerrari said: 
But on your consideration of Japan being able to become a potency despite having the island, you can look on the other side that Japan have very small land and sea for them while Russia have plethora of land so on your equality demands shouldn't Japan receive the land to be less unequal?

Sounds like lebensraum to me. Rural Japan is in fact increasingly underpopulated, the phenomen of ghost towns and abandoned buildings is huge. The government wants to persuade residents to abandon towns for larger ones to reduce cost of providing services. Isolated Russian islands in the far north are hardly a pragmatic resolution to their real problems if towns in temperate climates with roads to other Japanese cities/towns are dying off. 

Last edited by mutantsushi - on 05 April 2018