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Forums - Politics Discussion - You can't believe trump won?

 

Trump 2020

Hell yes! 20 25.32%
 
Lets wait and see! 3 3.80%
 
Fuck no! 50 63.29%
 
Indifferent/comments/Hilary's dusty pussy... 6 7.59%
 
Total:79
Nymeria said:
Hit him on policy over and over, that is how to beat him in 2020. Ignore the daily nonsense of stuff he says on Twitter. Fight for something, rather than "not as bad as Trump".

Trump sounded good to many who felt lost in the statue quo, but running a campaign and promising things is very different from governing. He is beatable, especially in various states in the midwest he barely won to overcome popular deficit with an electoral victory.

Democrats need to be shouting over and over a bold policy position such as "Medicare for All" up and down ballots. People still don't know what the left stands for and these tantrums about "The Internet Freaking Out" over some juvenile celebrity or petty social aspect is not the way forward.

2016 was a harsh lesson not to take people for granted or feel entitled to office, you have to earn votes.

2 things will work.

1. Do not put him against another supremely flawed candidate like Clinton. 

2. More voters.  We simply need the numbers in the right places. 



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

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SpokenTruth said:
Nymeria said:
Hit him on policy over and over, that is how to beat him in 2020. Ignore the daily nonsense of stuff he says on Twitter. Fight for something, rather than "not as bad as Trump".

Trump sounded good to many who felt lost in the statue quo, but running a campaign and promising things is very different from governing. He is beatable, especially in various states in the midwest he barely won to overcome popular deficit with an electoral victory.

Democrats need to be shouting over and over a bold policy position such as "Medicare for All" up and down ballots. People still don't know what the left stands for and these tantrums about "The Internet Freaking Out" over some juvenile celebrity or petty social aspect is not the way forward.

2016 was a harsh lesson not to take people for granted or feel entitled to office, you have to earn votes.

2 things will work.

1. Do not put him against another supremely flawed candidate like Clinton. 

2. More voters.  We simply need the numbers in the right places. 

Number 2 requires motivation. People under 40 lean left and don't vote, people over 60 lean right and do vote. We have a whole generation now that if they showed up like their parents/grandparents could shake this country in a way haven't seen since the new deal.  The issue I see among my peers is apathy and disillusionment.  "They're all the same" or "Both sides are corrupt" is the mantra of large swathes of non voters.  You need someone who speaks to them and feel genuine.

The Democrats could win in 2020 simply due to Republican fatigue, but could be right back to present situation in 2024.  I really think there is a chance here to make a mark in ways haven't seen since the 1960s left shift or 1980s right shift in politics.



Hiku said:

Oh I believe it. That video you posted is a good example of how white supremacists gain favor from the general public. They're lead to believe that white people are more victimized than minorities. Take this specific portion of the video for example: "Even though there are far more whites who are killed by the police every year."



First of all, what that chart shows is not "far more" whites than the minorities. It's just about even, or slightly less. But even if you want to only compare it to another specific minority like "Black", the video creator deliberately leaves out two very obvious fallacies that he doesn't want you to think about.

1.) There are far more white people in USA than minorities:



I believe that chart counts Hispanics/Latinos as white, myself being a hispanic don't consider myself "white".



I know... my English sucks.

CrowRSchneider said:

I believe that chart counts Hispanics/Latinos as white, myself being a hispanic don't consider myself "white".

Native Americans appear to be the ones referred to as American Indian:

So people from Central/South America should fall under the same category. But either way, my point was that Caucasian white people make up the vast majority of USA.

Last edited by Hiku - on 05 March 2018

Mark my words, Andrew Cuomo will win in 2020, and I say this as a republican.



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Hunting Season is done...

Hiku said:

Oh I believe it. That video you posted is a good example of how white supremacists gain favor from the general public. They're lead to believe that white people are more victimized than minorities. Take this specific portion of the video for example: "Even though there are far more whites who are killed by the police every year."



First of all, what that chart shows is not "far more" whites than the minorities. It's just about even, or slightly less. But even if you want to only compare it to another specific minority like "Black", the video creator deliberately leaves out two very obvious fallacies that he doesn't want you to think about.

1.) There are far more white people in USA than minorities:


and so with an overwhelming majority, there's little surprise that more white people than any other specific group are being killed. However, the main point is:

2.) The police shootings of minorities that have been sensationalized by the media have generally been about cases where the minorities were murdered by the police (like the police officer who was sentenced to 20 years in prison for shooting a black man in the back and then planting a tazer on him https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/07/us/michael-slager-sentence-walter-scott.html ), or cases where that is the suspicion.
The reason many of the white police killings aren't sensationalized is because they're not nearly as often executed while unarmed, with their hands on their head, etc.

These videos won't talk about these things. All they want is to scare people into buying into things like this other gem from the same video author:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSlagnuWSc8

I would like to tell everyone to please don't fall for this nonsense...
Yes, in some cases us white people get the shaft, but we are still far far better off than any minority group. We will be just fine.

But that leads me into my main point here. No, I'm not surprised that Trump won because the average voter isn't very knowledgeable about who or what they vote for, are easily impressionable, especially when the motivation is fear and victimization, and they don't fact check.
Many people who voted for Obama fall into this category as well. They vote for the wrong reasons.
It's easier to win by being dishonest and using fear mongering.

Unarmed blacks are shot by police at the same rate as armed whites: let that sink in.

PwerlvlAmy said:
Voted for him 2016. Will vote for him again in 2020. No regrets.

*ragrets



Insidb said:

Unarmed blacks are shot by police at the same rate as armed whites: let that sink in.

We're not just talking about unarmed people. Because unarmed people can pose a threat as well. If they try to attack the officer, reach for the gun, or hurt someone else, etc.
We're talking about people who for example (on camera) ran away and were shot in the back. A 12 year old child who was holding a toy gun. People who according to forensics were on their knees with their hands on top of their head, etc.
Those were generally the stories that made major headlines, and when the Black Lives Matter movement began.

Last edited by Hiku - on 05 March 2018

Hiku said:
Insidb said:

Unarmed blacks are shot by police at the same rate as armed whites: let that sink in.

We're not just talking about unarmed people. Because unarmed people can pose a threat as well. If they try to attack the officer, reach for the gun, or hurt someone else, etc.
We're talking about people who for example (on camera) ran away and were shot in the back. A 12 year old child who was holding a toy gun. People who according to forensics were on their knees with their hands on top of their head, etc.
Those were generally the stories that made major headlines, and when the Black Lives Matter movement began.

When the disparity between the unarmed and armed is so clearly grotesque and obviously delineated by race, everything else is just contextualizing a very serious policing problem.



SpokenTruth said:
Nymeria said:
Hit him on policy over and over, that is how to beat him in 2020. Ignore the daily nonsense of stuff he says on Twitter. Fight for something, rather than "not as bad as Trump".

Trump sounded good to many who felt lost in the statue quo, but running a campaign and promising things is very different from governing. He is beatable, especially in various states in the midwest he barely won to overcome popular deficit with an electoral victory.

Democrats need to be shouting over and over a bold policy position such as "Medicare for All" up and down ballots. People still don't know what the left stands for and these tantrums about "The Internet Freaking Out" over some juvenile celebrity or petty social aspect is not the way forward.

2016 was a harsh lesson not to take people for granted or feel entitled to office, you have to earn votes.

2 things will work.

1. Do not put him against another supremely flawed candidate like Clinton. 

2. More voters.  We simply need the numbers in the right places. 

That right there. The more people vote, the more the democrats win. As multiple have said this topic, the average voter is just not that smart.