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Forums - Movies & TV - Hollywood anti catholic bullshit needs to stop

epicurean said:
ArchangelMadzz said:

Millions of people have died for their different beliefs. They can't all have been correct and true.

True, though those were all centuries after the events they "believe", if there was an observable event at all. Christians believe an actual guy was the Son of God, who they physically knew around 30 AD. He died, yet they continued to believe and die for the guy who claimed he was immortal. Why would they do that?

And again. People still die for prophets who existed a very long time ago. Muhammed is a real guy that existed. 

Also the scriptures about Jesus weren't written until long after he died by people who never met him which calls a lot of those events into question. Ever played chinese whispers?



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

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SpokenTruth said:
epicurean said:

True, though those were all centuries after the events they "believe", if there was an observable event at all. Christians believe an actual guy was the Son of God, who they physically knew around 30 AD. He died, yet they continued to believe and die for the guy who claimed he was immortal. Why would they do that?

They didn't claim he was immortal under about 300 years after he died.  Council of Nicea.  They voted on his divinity.  Scripture that called him holy was kelp, scripture that didn't was tossed.

No, no, no, no, no. 

Sorry.

There is nothing factually true about that statement though.  Paul's letters claiming divinity were written, like, a decade after Christ died and that claimed divinity. And they referenced creeds (that are still used today) that talked about his divinity. This "theory" that was spread by the Dan Brown novel (movie) is not based in fact.

(Sorry to go on a rant. But anyone - scientists and archaeologists included - who look at the facts of this do not agree with it).



Owner of PS4 Pro, Xbox One, Switch, PS Vita, and 3DS

SpokenTruth said:
irstupid said:

Not atheist, and not trying to answer your question. Just bringing up more questions I never can understand in regards to science.

Always thought there was a rule in science that you can't create something from nothing. So how did the big bang? or was everything all compacted into one tiny ball and exploded? What was outside that ball before it exploded? Nothing? What is nothing? Another universe? Where did that initial ball of energy/matter/ect come from. How does everything in the universe, stars, planets, matter, ect all fit into a tiny spec/ball/whatever the big bang was before the bang.

The universe is supposedly infinite, yet expanding. How can something that is infinite be expanding. What is just past the part that is expanding? Again, another universe? Nothing? How can something just be infinite. How can something never end, but in the same sense, how can something end. What would be at the end of a universe if it could end.

These "big" questions that science is always answering always seem like they have contradictions in themselves, or more questions pop up than questions get answered.

I need to clarify a few things for you.  Our common understanding of the big bang is actually horribly explained.  We try to simplify the concept and yet we create false ideas of it when we do.

Most people think of this tiny point which contained everything in the universe.  This is only partially correct.  Everything in our "observable" universe was contained in a single point....let me back up first.  Are you familiar with the difference between the known or observable universe and the entire universe?  It really helps to understand the Big Bang if you grasp that part well first.  If needed, we can start a new thread.

I'm just talking in broad terms, not trying to get into the finer details. All finer details does is make people confused and your arguing over semantics versus the general idea.

Whether all the stuff in the universe was packed into a pin prick size or if it was all some giant gas giant the size of the milky way before is exploded/expanded/whatever is besides the point.

The questions are:

1. Where did all that stuff originally come from? Was that matter/energy/ect always there. How can something always be there? Shouldn't there have to be a beginning at some point. How can something have always been? If it was created, how was something created from nothing?

2. What was outside that ball of shit? Nothing? As someone posted to me earlier, no time, no space, no nothing. How can something be nothing. If I was to somehow step outside that ball, I step into nothing? How can time not exist?

3. If the universe is ever expanding, how can it be infinite. Something infinite is infinite. you can't +1 infinity. This isn't elementary school comebacks. So if I were to travel faster than the universe is expanding, what would I run into when I get past it? Again the concept of nothing, no time/space/ect makes less sense than any magical god of any religion.

4. If there is somehow a no time/no space place, then nothing is infinite. I've heard our universe will end at some point, so then nothing inside our universe is infite. Time will end, and as with the big bang, time began at some point. If there is a place of nothing outside our universe, then our universe is not infinite.



Human beings tend to think backward in regards to their position in the universe. We like the idea of grand plans because we are pattern based thinkers, from the way we hunted, to farmed, to built societies using standardized aspects to form culture (language, calendars, currency, etc.) The concept of randomness bothers us because it speaks to possible future randomness and how our entire existence could be snuffed out in an extinction event the way it did multiple times before on our planet. Fossil record show the dinosaurs dominated the planet for millions and millions of years. Homo sapiens in our modern form is roughly two hundred thousand years old, and of that only past ten thousand saw us have complexity to build religions and consider abstract concepts. We know this is something within our minds given how mythology sprouts in cultures all over the globe. We have curious minds seeking resolution so we devise answers based on our best understanding. Magic or deities are quick explanations of mysteries such as stars or seasons our ancestors dealt with. Ask a child and they can give you fantastic, yet incorrect, explanations of how the world works. We are not as inclined to be content with "I don't know?"

Human beings also exploit one another through power structures. Power in and of itself brings the temptation of corruption and abuse. Cults or religions are no exception to this as evidenced in the past and today. In the modern era since the enlightenment we regularly challenge thinking and criticize power structures. How many monarchs still reside today with actual power? Christianity split and fractured having dozens of sects with the Catholic branch being the most powerful and far reaching. Making a work going after Methodists would come across more as a general critique on religion or Christianity, while Catholicism is more specific. Hollywood is a western product that criticizes what it knows and Christianity ruled the west, and still does to certain extent. Hinduism, Sikh, Buddhists, and others don't get this treatment due to demographics and familiarity. I would state Indian artists critical of their society would raise issues about religions and power structures there in the same fashion.



irstupid said: 

3. If the universe is ever expanding, how can it be infinite. Something infinite is infinite. you can't +1 infinity. This isn't elementary school comebacks. So if I were to travel faster than the universe is expanding, what would I run into when I get past it? Again the concept of nothing, no time/space/ect makes less sense than any magical god of any religion.

Infinity is a very curious concept in how we define it. Below is a mathematical thought experiment of how infinity can grow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uj3_KqkI9Zo



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irstupid said:
SpokenTruth said:

I need to clarify a few things for you.  Our common understanding of the big bang is actually horribly explained.  We try to simplify the concept and yet we create false ideas of it when we do.

Most people think of this tiny point which contained everything in the universe.  This is only partially correct.  Everything in our "observable" universe was contained in a single point....let me back up first.  Are you familiar with the difference between the known or observable universe and the entire universe?  It really helps to understand the Big Bang if you grasp that part well first.  If needed, we can start a new thread.

I'm just talking in broad terms, not trying to get into the finer details. All finer details does is make people confused and your arguing over semantics versus the general idea.

Whether all the stuff in the universe was packed into a pin prick size or if it was all some giant gas giant the size of the milky way before is exploded/expanded/whatever is besides the point.

The questions are:

1. Where did all that stuff originally come from? Was that matter/energy/ect always there. How can something always be there? Shouldn't there have to be a beginning at some point. How can something have always been? If it was created, how was something created from nothing?

2. What was outside that ball of shit? Nothing? As someone posted to me earlier, no time, no space, no nothing. How can something be nothing. If I was to somehow step outside that ball, I step into nothing? How can time not exist?

3. If the universe is ever expanding, how can it be infinite. Something infinite is infinite. you can't +1 infinity. This isn't elementary school comebacks. So if I were to travel faster than the universe is expanding, what would I run into when I get past it? Again the concept of nothing, no time/space/ect makes less sense than any magical god of any religion.

4. If there is somehow a no time/no space place, then nothing is infinite. I've heard our universe will end at some point, so then nothing inside our universe is infite. Time will end, and as with the big bang, time began at some point. If there is a place of nothing outside our universe, then our universe is not infinite.

 

1 answer this and you get a nobel prize :)

 

2. Space and time are created by the Big Bang.  They have been expanding ever since (mathematically - it doesn’t expand “into something”)

 

3. Nothing is known to be beyond the edge.  See 2.  Mathematically points become further apart, but it’s not an explosion like you see in a movie with a shock wave.  There isn’t a beyond so to speak.

 

 

4  depdnding on the content of matter vs the violence of the explosion, everything may collapse again (Big Crunch).  Good news is that you can say either as no one is going to live long enough to prove it...



WolfpackN64 said:
Aeolus451 said:
They did alot of fucked up stuff in the past like the crusades. They held back the human civilization by a few hundred years by killing philosophers and inventors for a long time. Currently, they have a pedo problem but instead of reporting anything to the police, they tried to cover it up by moving the priests around. If they catch some flak for it then oh well.

You do know the church was one of the prime inventors in the middle ages. What philosophers did they kill?

It wasn't. It held back the advancement of science and of humans. If someone's ideas threatened the church or their view of the universe, they would kill them. It's widely known. You have google, use it.



Aeolus451 said:
WolfpackN64 said:

You do know the church was one of the prime inventors in the middle ages. What philosophers did they kill?

It wasn't. It held back the advancement of science and of humans. If someone's ideas threatened the church or their view of the universe, they would kill them. It's widely known. You have google, use it.

I prefer DuckDuckGo.



epicurean said: What actions do you feel "The Church" is trying to control?

A big one would be sexual health/behaviour, which extends into family structures.



SpokenTruth said:
epicurean said:

No, no, no, no, no. 

Sorry.

There is nothing factually true about that statement though.  Paul's letters claiming divinity were written, like, a decade after Christ died and that claimed divinity. And they referenced creeds (that are still used today) that talked about his divinity. This "theory" that was spread by the Dan Brown novel (movie) is not based in fact.

(Sorry to go on a rant. But anyone - scientists and archaeologists included - who look at the facts of this do not agree with it).

I just wanted to see how fast someone jumped on that.   The only thing I do believe in that is that we simply don't know.  The only evidence the theologists have are the scriptures they kept that tout divinity.  My question is simply why were there previously accepted scripture which did not tout his divinity? The apocrypha and gnostic texts certainly make one wonder. Who decided a scripture author was recording the word of God?

I guess I took the bait. :)

But good question and something I've tried to read up on, but need to read more on. I could give a semi-coherent answer, but one that would probably be picked apart (and rightfully so), so I'll just admit it's a good question for now. :)

(If you really want to dive into it I can try and explain, but I don't know enough, or can't explain it well enough, to convince anyone)



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