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Forums - Gaming - Scorpio will be the cheapest way to play PS5/Xbox 2 games.

Sure, Scorpio will get XBO/PS4 versions of XB4/PS4 games, but it won't be getting next gen versions of cross gen games. A proper XB4/PS5 should have at minimum an 8 Core/16 Thread CPU, 20+TFLOP GPU, 64GB GDDR6 or HBM, and 1GB/s SSD Storage. XB4/PS5 should be capable of things far beyond PS4/XBO or PS4P/Scoprio can do to earn their name. If XB4 and PS5 are simply 4k/60fps versions of PS4/XBO, then they should just be branded premium version of those consoles. Real next gen is when you either can't run games on the hardware anymore, or their are incredible cut backs needed in graphics, resolution, framerate, number of npcs, draw distance, ect. which totally change the game expereince.

People are going a little far with these PS4P and Scorpio thoughts. In terms of gen to gen improvements, these things are only about 10 - 15% of a typical upgrade. Pro is basicaly PS4.1, and Scoprio is closer to XB1.2. They are mid gen in terms of years, but no where near mid gen in terms of raw performance gains, memory size and bandwidth, storage medium, the list goes on and on.

I think we should just be happy that we are finally getting a choice as fabrication tech matures. Before we only had the choice to upgrade to a smaller more efficient version of the same thing we already had. Now we get that option, or we can choose to do a revision that offers faster loading, higher resolutions, and higher framerates. In my book that is a huge win for console gamers, and I am very happy with both companies for finally making this tech available to us throught the generation.



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10/03/2010 

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Doesn't it still have an X1 grade CPU?

I don't see forward compatiblility working out to well due to this.



sure, and nintendo is the best place to experience new ip's for a grown up audience.



Not sure if serious. Once PS5 comes which I still think will be in 2020 or at the earliest 2019. The games will be built to take advantage of the console. Not only gpu will be more than 2x faster I am sure this time cpu will also get a really big boost. It is easier for new hardware to support old games than the old hardware to play new games because PS5 will be used as the base.

If devs use PS4P, Scorpio as the base specs for 1080P games and PS5 will just be 4K version with 60fps that would be disappointing but I don't think this will happen.



 

HoloDust said:

Well, going by single thread ratings from Passmark and little clock for clock math, I think around 50% better IPC is fair assessment. But even if it's only that much, I really doubt next gen consoles will have such anemic clocks, so with 10nm parts inside as minimum, it's fair to say that we'll be looking at least at some 3x in CPU performance.

But overall, I do think that Scorpio will be able to pull off most nextgen games.

Passmark is synthetic though. :P
I do think Scorpio as a hardware platform will age better than the other consoles, Microsoft has done allot of work to make the CPU do as little work as possible.

In-fact, I would love some of the improvements to make their way over to the PC. It's unlikely though.




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The worst thing about this is that next gen multiplats will be held back by a console 2-3 years older than the PS5, the discrepancy between multiplats on PS5 and Sony's 1st parties is gonna be yuuuge if the baseline is gonna be so low.



Azzanation said:
Captain_Yuri said:

But here's the thing with PCs... The CPUs that the next gen consoles will get will still be far behind even mid level PC hardware. What the next gen consoles will get is a Ryzen Based APU which will be much more powerful than the current jag cpus but not even close to mid pc cpu performance. So the developers won't worry about PC hardware...

As for Scorpio's hardware, all this vram is going into resolution. So while 12gb of ram sounds huge... The problem is where is all this performance going into? And the answer is... 4k... So sure, it has 12Gb of vram but that legit means nothing because majority is just going into resolution which is easily scalable... CPUs on the otherhand are not. Also not to mention that even a 1060 can play games at 4k with xbox one's graphical settings so it's not like its that easy to compare... And yea, the i5 is the standard but it's not like APUs will perform like an i5... And not to mention that by the time these next gen consoles come around, the standard cpu's performance will continue to increase when it comes to PC... 

You do realize that this isn't the first time we have had a new console generation with a big performance boost in cpu/gpu department right? Infact we had many. The reality is that for the most part, it just doesn't matter. PC hardware moves so fast that by the time the new generation of consoles come out, the hardware is already out dated... But thanks to optimization, Consoles manage to punch above their weight where as u would need a more expensive pc to achieve similar results. Idk what dx12/vulkan has to do with anything though...

i5 CPUs are still going to be the average CPU in most PCs next year. If next gen comes out and blows that figure out of the water than awesome, however devs still have to manage to make there games work on older CPUs. XB1 and Scorpio are more like PCs. If something comes out too powerful for there machine, devs will just scale them down to operate on the Scorpio/PC.

If devs just focus on next gen console hardware than your saying PC gamers arent getting any multiplatform games. Because how many PC gamers are going to have next gen hardware specs? Devs will focus on PC just as much as they will focus on new next gen consoles because theres a majority of the market that game on PCs. 

The Scorpio may have a weak CPU compared to next gen consoles (Most likely) it will still be ravelent to play newer games. The API is a very important part of making games. If next gen still use DX12/Vulkan than coding and porting will be very easy for Scorpio. Again look at the Scorpio as a low/mid range PC when those next gen consoles come out. At this stage, the Scorpio is a med/high end PC when you consider the average PC gaming Rig. 

Dont forget PC gaming is growing rapidly every year. Which is leading Developers to want to make there games on PC just as much as consoles. Just about every 3rd party game has a PC release this generation which is alot bigger than last generatrion and that was also a very good year for PC gaming. 

Next gen PC gaming will most likely be even bigger again which will keep devs interested. Which leads us to go back to what i am saying before. Devs will want to port there games across to PCs which will mean they will have to make low end settings to run on older hardware. If there going to focus on the average PC user hardware than Scorpio wont have a problem.

Running the games wouldnt be a problem for Scorpio, Its more up to MS/Xbox if they want to continue support for Scorpio when next gen arrives. I dont believe MS believe in generation leaps anymore. That makes Coding and porting much easier. Remember MS have the UWP eco-system so most next gen games will arrive on Windows 10 PCs and will automatically be a XB1 title.

I don't get what you are trying to say at all... You do realize that Ryzen CPUs doesn't automatically mean more powerful than i5s right? When the next gen consoles come around, what will happen is that the cpus will be much more powerful than current gen consoles but much weaker than i5 cpus... And having the word "i5" doesn't make it universal in performance standards. An i5 7600k is much more powerful than an i5 2500k for example.

What ryzen cpus will do is that it will make it mostly impossible for the jags to keep up but i5s and etc will keep up just fine because the consoles will get the much weaker CPUs that are in APUs...  So Scorpio not being to play next gen games won't have any effect on PCs with i5s or higher cause the next gen console CPUs will be weaker than i5s but much stronger than the jags...

And having a similar API doesn't mean anything if the base line hardware has a significant increase because the developers will be coding for the Specific hardware to take advantage of it. Just because jags and Ryzen are both x86 does not mean they are the same or even close to being the same and APIs won't help. The only way the Scorpio will be able to play Xbox 2 games is if it's not actually called Xbox 2 but instead be called Xbox Scorpio Refresh or something...

And again, you aren't using any actual evidence to prove that it wouldn't be a problem for scorpio. You are just using pc as an excuse but ignoring how console optimization works. I think you are confused some where...



                  

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Conina said:
VAMatt said:

It is pretty much guaranteed that they will support two consoles, if/when they introduce the next gen. As far as I know, that has happened every time anybody has released a new console. Further, nearly all big games in the first year, sometimes the first couple, are released on both. Further still, MS has shown that they're committed to being the lower-priced of the Sony/MS systems this gen (after they ditched the Kinect). Given all of this, I'd say that the OP iscorrect.

Yeah, the 2013 Wii support had been great... or the 2017 Wii U support.

True enough.  Though the biggest Nintendo game of 2017 did launch on Wii U.  



Captain_Yuri said:
Azzanation said:

i5 CPUs are still going to be the average CPU in most PCs next year. If next gen comes out and blows that figure out of the water than awesome, however devs still have to manage to make there games work on older CPUs. XB1 and Scorpio are more like PCs. If something comes out too powerful for there machine, devs will just scale them down to operate on the Scorpio/PC.

If devs just focus on next gen console hardware than your saying PC gamers arent getting any multiplatform games. Because how many PC gamers are going to have next gen hardware specs? Devs will focus on PC just as much as they will focus on new next gen consoles because theres a majority of the market that game on PCs. 

The Scorpio may have a weak CPU compared to next gen consoles (Most likely) it will still be ravelent to play newer games. The API is a very important part of making games. If next gen still use DX12/Vulkan than coding and porting will be very easy for Scorpio. Again look at the Scorpio as a low/mid range PC when those next gen consoles come out. At this stage, the Scorpio is a med/high end PC when you consider the average PC gaming Rig. 

Dont forget PC gaming is growing rapidly every year. Which is leading Developers to want to make there games on PC just as much as consoles. Just about every 3rd party game has a PC release this generation which is alot bigger than last generatrion and that was also a very good year for PC gaming. 

Next gen PC gaming will most likely be even bigger again which will keep devs interested. Which leads us to go back to what i am saying before. Devs will want to port there games across to PCs which will mean they will have to make low end settings to run on older hardware. If there going to focus on the average PC user hardware than Scorpio wont have a problem.

Running the games wouldnt be a problem for Scorpio, Its more up to MS/Xbox if they want to continue support for Scorpio when next gen arrives. I dont believe MS believe in generation leaps anymore. That makes Coding and porting much easier. Remember MS have the UWP eco-system so most next gen games will arrive on Windows 10 PCs and will automatically be a XB1 title.

I don't get what you are trying to say at all... You do realize that Ryzen CPUs doesn't automatically mean more powerful than i5s right? When the next gen consoles come around, what will happen is that the cpus will be much more powerful than current gen consoles but much weaker than i5 cpus... And having the word "i5" doesn't make it universal in performance standards. An i5 7600k is much more powerful than an i5 2500k for example.

What ryzen cpus will do is that it will make it mostly impossible for the jags to keep up but i5s and etc will keep up just fine because the consoles will get the much weaker CPUs that are in APUs...  So Scorpio not being to play next gen games won't have any effect on PCs with i5s or higher cause the next gen console CPUs will be weaker than i5s but much stronger than the jags...

And having a similar API doesn't mean anything if the base line hardware has a significant increase because the developers will be coding for the Specific hardware to take advantage of it. Just because jags and Ryzen are both x86 does not mean they are the same or even close to being the same and APIs won't help. The only way the Scorpio will be able to play Xbox 2 games is if it's not actually called Xbox 2 but instead be called Xbox Scorpio Refresh or something...

And again, you aren't using any actual evidence to prove that it wouldn't be a problem for scorpio. You are just using pc as an excuse but ignoring how console optimization works. I think you are confused some where...

Im far from confused. What your missing out on is next gen games still have to be optimized for low end PCs. Regardless of the prefermormance of next gen consoles, Devs will be still aiming for the middle ground. If your talking 1st party console exclusives than maybe not since they will use next gen hardware at its fullest. 

I am basing this off if next gen arrives in the next couple of years.

If your saying Ryzen isnt going to be as powerful as the low end PC CPUs than you have anwsered the question yourself. I doubt next gen is going to be as big of a jump in preformance compared to 7th gen to 8th gen.



Azzanation said:
Captain_Yuri said:

I don't get what you are trying to say at all... You do realize that Ryzen CPUs doesn't automatically mean more powerful than i5s right? When the next gen consoles come around, what will happen is that the cpus will be much more powerful than current gen consoles but much weaker than i5 cpus... And having the word "i5" doesn't make it universal in performance standards. An i5 7600k is much more powerful than an i5 2500k for example.

What ryzen cpus will do is that it will make it mostly impossible for the jags to keep up but i5s and etc will keep up just fine because the consoles will get the much weaker CPUs that are in APUs...  So Scorpio not being to play next gen games won't have any effect on PCs with i5s or higher cause the next gen console CPUs will be weaker than i5s but much stronger than the jags...

And having a similar API doesn't mean anything if the base line hardware has a significant increase because the developers will be coding for the Specific hardware to take advantage of it. Just because jags and Ryzen are both x86 does not mean they are the same or even close to being the same and APIs won't help. The only way the Scorpio will be able to play Xbox 2 games is if it's not actually called Xbox 2 but instead be called Xbox Scorpio Refresh or something...

And again, you aren't using any actual evidence to prove that it wouldn't be a problem for scorpio. You are just using pc as an excuse but ignoring how console optimization works. I think you are confused some where...

Im far from confused. What your missing out on is next gen games still have to be optimized for low end PCs. Regardless of the prefermormance of next gen consoles, Devs will be still aiming for the middle ground. If your talking 1st party console exclusives than maybe not since they will use next gen hardware at its fullest. 

I am basing this off if next gen arrives in the next couple of years.

If your saying Ryzen isnt going to be as powerful as the low end PC CPUs than you have anwsered the question yourself. I doubt next gen is going to be as big of a jump in preformance compared to 7th gen to 8th gen.

But low end PCs, as far as CPUs go will have similar performance to the cpu of xbox 2/ps5... So that isn't going to matter.

I don't think you realize how weak the jag cpus are... A jump to Ryzen would still be powerful enough to make the jags not be able to keep up even if the Ryzen cpus aren't anywhere near as powerful as i5s because that's exactly how weak jag cpus are... I think you are way overestimating how powerful the jags are...



                  

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