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Forums - Politics Discussion - ObamaCare just got worse! Will it ever end?

Glad I live in germany. The system in the US is completely broken. They tried to fix that, because the moment you were sick and needed insurance, you wouldn't get any or would have to pay a ton of money you don't have. In germany everyone that works pays taxes for health insurance and other stuff. That's why nearly everyone has a health insurance and not really additional costs.



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the-pi-guy said:
bonzobanana said:
The UK national health service certainly needs reform and that reform is really scaling it back to an affordable level as we aren't as rich as we were. It has a solid foundation though and is much loved by the population. Knowing loved ones and yourself have access to health care is a pretty good feeling I have to say and reading this thread has made me appreciate it more.

Even with pets you sometimes hesitate to take them to the vet because of the expense or are faced with monthly insurance payments. Sometimes you come across vets clearly motivated by money more than helping the animal and you have to find a competent vet who doesn't charge huge prices. That pretty much sounds like america's human healthcare system on a small scale. That's as much private healthcare I want to deal with. I have used the NHS throughout my life both accidents and illnesses and it has improved the quality of my life.

And the US spends like twice as much.  Actually more than twice as much per person.  

But neither the UK or USA can afford their current rate of spending and have created crippling debts for future generations.

http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/debtclock/unitedstates

Currently the US is servicing this debt at the rate of 1/2 trillion a year with 61k of debt on every head.  

Living within your means seems to be a thing of the past.



Obamacare: Where big government and big insurance screw over the common person. Its been a ticking timebomb since it started, and the worst allegations about what would happen, are happening.

Sadly, all the good reforms that could have been done have been passed on the wayside while Obama will refuse to sign any Republican-backed legislation.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

outlawauron said:
pokoko said:

Did or did not the Republican party fix the health care system when they were in power?

Yes? Maybe my times are off, but I can think of 3-4 major Republican congressman that put together plans only to get shut down. Obama vetoed legislation that would have repealed Obamacare and replaced it. There was no one shining solution, but to say that Republican just sat on their hands is dishonest.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2016/06/22/republicans-have-a-plan-to-replace-obamacare-and-its-costs-are-unclear/

This post from the Times says that Republicans have really done nothing to bring an actual replacement of Obamacare instead they have brought a lot of repeal to which was never going to get through the President.  Lets be honest first, Republican have never voted or even wanted a government healthcare that covered all Americans because it was not in the best interest of Insurance carriers.  People forget that it was Insurance carriers and healthcare advocates that were fine with getting paided at the expense of US Citizens and who lobbied against the ACA not for it.

Now these insurance companies are raising rates while they also tripple their CEO salary and claim they are not making money.  The key is that they are not making hand over fist type of money on us so of course they want to raise rates and hope the ACA gets taken down.

As for the new Republican plan, there are some good and bad but the thing is, if they would come to a bipartisan table and hash out some of this stuff the ACA probably could be made stronger for all Americans without.  Just opening the plan up for every state to compete would drastically improve the ACA in my opinion.  The problem is that the ACA came from Obama and no matter what, Republicans do not want anything or helping anything from Obama.

I will go so far to say that if America was being attack by any eneny and Obama needed the Republican Congress to save us all, they would rather we burn then let Obama save America.



Machiavellian said:
outlawauron said:

Yes? Maybe my times are off, but I can think of 3-4 major Republican congressman that put together plans only to get shut down. Obama vetoed legislation that would have repealed Obamacare and replaced it. There was no one shining solution, but to say that Republican just sat on their hands is dishonest.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2016/06/22/republicans-have-a-plan-to-replace-obamacare-and-its-costs-are-unclear/

This post from the Times says that Republicans have really done nothing to bring an actual replacement of Obamacare instead they have brought a lot of repeal to which was never going to get through the President.  Lets be honest first, Republican have never voted or even wanted a government healthcare that covered all Americans because it was not in the best interest of Insurance carriers.  People forget that it was Insurance carriers and healthcare advocates that were fine with getting paided at the expense of US Citizens and who lobbied against the ACA not for it.

Now these insurance companies are raising rates while they also tripple their CEO salary and claim they are not making money.  The key is that they are not making hand over fist type of money on us so of course they want to raise rates and hope the ACA gets taken down.

As for the new Republican plan, there are some good and bad but the thing is, if they would come to a bipartisan table and hash out some of this stuff the ACA probably could be made stronger for all Americans without.  Just opening the plan up for every state to compete would drastically improve the ACA in my opinion.  The problem is that the ACA came from Obama and no matter what, Republicans do not want anything or helping anything from Obama.

I will go so far to say that if America was being attack by any eneny and Obama needed the Republican Congress to save us all, they would rather we burn then let Obama save America.

That is the Washington Post, not the times and that is not the first new health care bill introduced by Republicans, just the first to make it to Obama. 

But the insurance companies have benefitted far more from ACA than any person using their new insurance. That was supposed to be the case until the government didn't help out nearly as much as promised. Now that insurance companies know how much assistance they'll actually receive, up go the rates. I think many have already said that it's intentional sabotage to get a single payer system from Democratic leadership. That's their end goal imo.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

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outlawauron said:
Machiavellian said:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2016/06/22/republicans-have-a-plan-to-replace-obamacare-and-its-costs-are-unclear/

This post from the Times says that Republicans have really done nothing to bring an actual replacement of Obamacare instead they have brought a lot of repeal to which was never going to get through the President.  Lets be honest first, Republican have never voted or even wanted a government healthcare that covered all Americans because it was not in the best interest of Insurance carriers.  People forget that it was Insurance carriers and healthcare advocates that were fine with getting paided at the expense of US Citizens and who lobbied against the ACA not for it.

Now these insurance companies are raising rates while they also tripple their CEO salary and claim they are not making money.  The key is that they are not making hand over fist type of money on us so of course they want to raise rates and hope the ACA gets taken down.

As for the new Republican plan, there are some good and bad but the thing is, if they would come to a bipartisan table and hash out some of this stuff the ACA probably could be made stronger for all Americans without.  Just opening the plan up for every state to compete would drastically improve the ACA in my opinion.  The problem is that the ACA came from Obama and no matter what, Republicans do not want anything or helping anything from Obama.

I will go so far to say that if America was being attack by any eneny and Obama needed the Republican Congress to save us all, they would rather we burn then let Obama save America.

That is the Washington Post, not the times and that is not the first new health care bill introduced by Republicans, just the first to make it to Obama. 

But the insurance companies have benefitted far more from ACA than any person using their new insurance. That was supposed to be the case until the government didn't help out nearly as much as promised. Now that insurance companies know how much assistance they'll actually receive, up go the rates. I think many have already said that it's intentional sabotage to get a single payer system from Democratic leadership. That's their end goal imo.

How exactly have the insurance companies benefited from the ACA when they say they are not making money and leaving the marketplace..  It really cannot work both ways.  Do not forget the government is not just made of up the federal but also the states and how many of those Republican states have tried to underfund the ACA.  Instead of giving it a chance to succeed they have done did everything they could to make it not work.  Not because it is a bad plan but because it was put into place by a president they have tried to undermine since he came into Office.

In the original ACA, the single payer was in their but of course getting that through congress was never going to happen for the first pass.



Machiavellian said:
outlawauron said:

That is the Washington Post, not the times and that is not the first new health care bill introduced by Republicans, just the first to make it to Obama. 

But the insurance companies have benefitted far more from ACA than any person using their new insurance. That was supposed to be the case until the government didn't help out nearly as much as promised. Now that insurance companies know how much assistance they'll actually receive, up go the rates. I think many have already said that it's intentional sabotage to get a single payer system from Democratic leadership. That's their end goal imo.

How exactly have the insurance companies benefited from the ACA when they say they are not making money and leaving the marketplace..  It really cannot work both ways.  Do not forget the government is not just made of up the federal but also the states and how many of those Republican states have tried to underfund the ACA.  Instead of giving it a chance to succeed they have done did everything they could to make it not work.  Not because it is a bad plan but because it was put into place by a president they have tried to undermine since he came into Office.

In the original ACA, the single payer was in their but of course getting that through congress was never going to happen for the first pass.

Big companies benefitted with ACA because they were promised assistance with the government (which has largley fallen through) and were millions of new customers. As far as undercutting or trying to replace ACA, I think you're being disingenious if you believe that Obama is the only reason it was opposed. It was an unpopular bill at the time and even more unpopular as time passes.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

outlawauron said:
Machiavellian said:

How exactly have the insurance companies benefited from the ACA when they say they are not making money and leaving the marketplace..  It really cannot work both ways.  Do not forget the government is not just made of up the federal but also the states and how many of those Republican states have tried to underfund the ACA.  Instead of giving it a chance to succeed they have done did everything they could to make it not work.  Not because it is a bad plan but because it was put into place by a president they have tried to undermine since he came into Office.

In the original ACA, the single payer was in their but of course getting that through congress was never going to happen for the first pass.

Big companies benefitted with ACA because they were promised assistance with the government (which has largley fallen through) and were millions of new customers. As far as undercutting or trying to replace ACA, I think you're being disingenious if you believe that Obama is the only reason it was opposed. It was an unpopular bill at the time and even more unpopular as time passes.

I think you're being disingenious if you think otherwise. Republicans ashamed Chris Christy because he hugged and praised Obama after federal assistance on Hurricane Sandy. Party over nation.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/20/us/politics/after-embrace-of-obama-chris-christie-woos-a-wary-gop.html



outlawauron said:
Machiavellian said:

How exactly have the insurance companies benefited from the ACA when they say they are not making money and leaving the marketplace..  It really cannot work both ways.  Do not forget the government is not just made of up the federal but also the states and how many of those Republican states have tried to underfund the ACA.  Instead of giving it a chance to succeed they have done did everything they could to make it not work.  Not because it is a bad plan but because it was put into place by a president they have tried to undermine since he came into Office.

In the original ACA, the single payer was in their but of course getting that through congress was never going to happen for the first pass.

Big companies benefitted with ACA because they were promised assistance with the government (which has largley fallen through) and were millions of new customers. As far as undercutting or trying to replace ACA, I think you're being disingenious if you believe that Obama is the only reason it was opposed. It was an unpopular bill at the time and even more unpopular as time passes.

No I am not being disingenuous.  Obama being the main and primary reason the ACA has received a lot of flak and resistance from Republicans is based on how they have tried to first make him a one term president and when losing that have tried to make him a bad president by doing nothing.  There are countless examples where Republicans have introduced bills and where they have then reverse their vote because Obama approved it.  If it made Obama look good no matter how many Americans it helped, Republicans would vote against it.

As for the ACA, a good deal of the ACA is actually from Republicans including the Mit Romey plan he tried to introduce during his run for the presidency.  The ACA is actually a Republican ideal not Democrat.  Hell, most of the Republicans during the time the Bill was introduced were supported and passed the Bill.  The part of the bill that require all Americans to have insurance is a Republican suggesting to fund the bill.  The only real, issue that Republican did not like about the bill that passed from the senate revision is on funding abortion.



Adopting a great universal health care system that is in Europe and is the envy of the world is what Obamacare should have tried to implement. Having millions of poor people with no health cover is what keeps the powerless at the bottom end of American society.