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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Star Fox Zero adds invincible mode for beginners, internet reacts

 

Does this actually bother anyone here?

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curl-6 said:
archer9234 said:

No. The eqivalent would be if the show just told you the plot, and resolution, in one minute. And the episode is over. The conflict has to be removed. To be the same as invincible. This isn't a easy mode, or a trial mode. This is conflict remove mode.

And what's wrong with that if you're not forced to use it? To use the TV analogy, this is like giving you the option to see an episode recap to catch up with the series. You can still just watch it normally. Nothing is being taken away from you. It is optional.

Also, as has been said already, I don't know why people are acting like this is a new thing. Back when I was a kid in 90s, it was Game Genie, cheat codes, using God Mode in Doom, or Big Daddys in Age of Empires, etc. Nothing has changed really, this sort of thing has been around forever.

It's not optional, when the person just picked it. Once you CHOOSE Invincible mode. You are now in abridge mode. It's like a book. Some people just read the end. Because they just want to know the ending that bad. When Harry Potter Book 7 came out. Most of the people just read the end. To find out Snape died. Before they read any other page. This is basically that. Wouldn't it be better, if a person got stuck in the level. To just press start and hit skip. There's no point in even playing the game. With 0 challange. Because, the person may learn "the patterns" in this mode. But damage and when to dodge will not be taught. You are invincible. You won't know what ship is stronger. Or know if you dodged correctly.

And you're admitting it's a cheat mode. Were we had to use other means to do it. A device which you spent extra money on. This also use to be earned in games. So it was fine. Or you had to find the name cheat in a mag. More money. These things deterred/challenged you. The game is just giving it away. It be like allowing a FPS game to disable your health. Or your ammo. And leave it on unlimited. It's gonna tempt too many people to just do that. Then the game becomes pointless.

Volterra_90 said:
Wright said:

I do think Dark Souls specifically has the perfect learning progression. The first time I played it seemed like impossible challenges to overcome. Nowadays I wouldn't even call the game hard anymore, as I've learned that patience and a bit of skill can trump practically anything in there. I'm pretty sure your friends, with a little bit of time and energy, would be also able to accomplish it.

I saw a video about Dark Souls with invincibility on and it seems like the most boring thing in the world, to be honest. Probably why I'm not so fond of adding that thing to any videogame. Just make "easy" easy, and there shouldn't be any problem.

 But in Star Fox: Zero it could be useful for "noobs" to learn how to use the motion controls, boost, barrel rolls and all of that. Especially how to learn motion controls, since a lot of people don't use them normally for aiming. 

So we went from "Wii's motion controls will make it easier for casuals, to play games." To now: "People need to be taught motion controls. They're hard to understand."



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archer9234 said

So we went from "Wii's motion controls will make it easier for casuals, to play games." To now: "People need to be taught motion controls. They're hard to understand."

Wii motion controls are nothing like Star Fox: Zero controls. You have to learn how to move your ship and aim with the gyroscope controls at the same time. Also, for the all-range mode you have to learn how to use the cockpit view in the gamepad. Tell me about one single game which use this double-screen controls. This is way more complex than just hit a ball in Wii Tennis. 



archer9234 said:

It's not optional, when the person just picked it. Once you CHOOSE Invincible mode. You are now in abridge mode. It's like a book. Some people just read the end. Because they just want to know the ending that bad. When Harry Potter Book 7 came out. Most of the people just read the end. To find out Snape died. Before they read any other page. This is basically that. Wouldn't it be better, if a person got stuck in the level. To just press start and hit skip. There's no point in even playing the game. With 0 challange. Because, the person may learn "the patterns" in this mode. But damage and when to dodge will not be taught. You are invincible. You won't know what ship is stronger. Or know if you dodged correctly.

And you're admitting it's a cheat mode. Were we had to use other means to do it. A device which you spent extra money on. This also use to be earned in games. So it was fine. Or you had to find the name cheat in a mag. More money. These things deterred/challenged you. The game is just giving it away. It be like allowing a FPS game to disable your health. Or your ammo. And leave it on unlimited. It's gonna tempt too many people to just do that. Then the game becomes pointless.

 

Dude are you half asleep or something? You understand a person has to choose to play the mode but say it's not optional.



Wyrdness said:
archer9234 said:

It's not optional, when the person just picked it. Once you CHOOSE Invincible mode. You are now in abridge mode. It's like a book. Some people just read the end. Because they just want to know the ending that bad. When Harry Potter Book 7 came out. Most of the people just read the end. To find out Snape died. Before they read any other page. This is basically that. Wouldn't it be better, if a person got stuck in the level. To just press start and hit skip. There's no point in even playing the game. With 0 challange. Because, the person may learn "the patterns" in this mode. But damage and when to dodge will not be taught. You are invincible. You won't know what ship is stronger. Or know if you dodged correctly.

And you're admitting it's a cheat mode. Were we had to use other means to do it. A device which you spent extra money on. This also use to be earned in games. So it was fine. Or you had to find the name cheat in a mag. More money. These things deterred/challenged you. The game is just giving it away. It be like allowing a FPS game to disable your health. Or your ammo. And leave it on unlimited. It's gonna tempt too many people to just do that. Then the game becomes pointless.

 

Dude are you half asleep or something? You understand a person has to choose to play the mode but say it's not optional.

I should of been more clear. I was typing this at 5am. There is no option to have it easier. But not have it in god mode. That's the problem. This isn't training mode. This isn't trial mode. This is the full game, 0 damage. You're gonna tell me if I enable cheats, in any other game. And gave it to someone, for the first time. That would be totally fine that they can't die. Because they're just praticing. Praticing all the way through the game.

Let's add in invicible mode to Pikmin 3. Let's add this to Bayonetta. How about Smash? It's training right. Intill they say every unlock or saving is disabled, in this mode. This is just legal god mode. Everyone is saying this mode is great for kids. Most aren't gonna go play the game with damage. Once they use this. And then they'll bitch the game is over in 1 hour. And are bored. Wasting that $60. I remember myself as a kid. You think I would of gone back and played OOT's water temple, normally. If I had the option to disable the need for iron boots, and blue tunic, no way. The puzzle aspect of the temple is what makes it hard. Not the enenmies. So having a difficulty setting there is not an option. But if OOT had invincible mode. That be disabling all the limitations to the iron boots and tunics.

Volterra_90 said:
archer9234 said

So we went from "Wii's motion controls will make it easier for casuals, to play games." To now: "People need to be taught motion controls. They're hard to understand."

Wii motion controls are nothing like Star Fox: Zero controls. You have to learn how to move your ship and aim with the gyroscope controls at the same time. The Nunchuck is your movement controls. The remote was the aimer. The Nunchuck was the controller. The gamepad just has them locked together. I don't see the real difference.

Also, for the all-range mode you have to learn how to use the cockpit view in the gamepad. Tell me about one single game which use this double-screen controls. This is way more complex than just hit a ball in Wii Tennis. Splatoon does this. You aim with the pad. You really don't need to look at your tv, in all range mode. Tee gamepad shows you the important camera view. This isn't special.



archer9234 said:
Volterra_90 said:

Wii motion controls are nothing like Star Fox: Zero controls. You have to learn how to move your ship and aim with the gyroscope controls at the same time. The Nunchuck is your movement controls. The remote was the aimer. The Nunchuck was the controller. The gamepad just has them locked together. I don't see the real difference.

Also, for the all-range mode you have to learn how to use the cockpit view in the gamepad. Tell me about one single game which use this double-screen controls. This is way more complex than just hit a ball in Wii Tennis. Splatoon does this. You aim with the pad. You really don't need to look at your tv, in all range mode. This isn't special.

I think it's very different to aim with the gamepad that aim with the Wiimote. With the Wiimote you aim to the screen, with the Gamepad you use the gyroscopic controls, which actually feels very different. 

And, yeah, I'll give you that, I totally forgot about Splatoon. Though it's fair to say that the motion controls were optional in Splatoon, and not everyone has got used to them. The fact is that new people will try mandatory gyroscope controls for the first time. And for those people who are not hardcore gamers and who struggle to play games, I think it's a nice option to get used to these controls. They have the option to play normal mode later if they want. If they just want to see the game while shooting things, hey, that's their choice. Nobody is forcing them to use that mode.



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Volterra_90 said:
archer9234 said:

I think it's very different to aim with the gamepad that aim with the Wiimote. With the Wiimote you aim to the screen, with the Gamepad you use the gyroscopic controls, which actually feels very different. 

You could easily setup the Wii to mimic the gamepad. Just have the sensor bar level to your lap. And then you'd basically offset your aim to where you use the gamepad. Then just tape the nuchuck and remote together, with a spacer. That's the gamepad in a nutshell. I've done this. My bed is lower then my TV. So I usually aimed up. I went and lowered the sensor bar. I just aimed ahead of me. And never at the screen. Works fine.



archer9234 said:

You could easily setup the Wii to mimic the gamepad. Just have the sensor bar level to your lap. And then you'd basically offset your aim to where you use the gamepad. Then just tape the nuchuck and remote together, with a spacer. That's the gamepad in a nutshell. I've done this. My bed is lower then my TV. So I usually aimed up. I went and lowered the sensor bar. I just aimed ahead of me. And never at the screen. Works fine.

Lol, I didn't think about it. But the point is that... I don't really know a lot of people who did this (in fact, you're the first that I know :P). So my point remains the same. People used the Wiimote to aim at the screen, and the Gamepad only with gyroscopic controls, and not all the people use the gyroscope. Being invincible give people who's new to this control scheme to get used to them without having to worry about killing everything at the same time. They'll have the choice to change if they want. 



archer9234 said:
Wyrdness said:

Dude are you half asleep or something? You understand a person has to choose to play the mode but say it's not optional.

I should of been more clear. I was typing this at 5am. There is no option to have it easier. But not have it in god mode. That's the problem. This isn't training mode. This isn't trial mode. This is the full game, 0 damage. You're gonna tell me if I enable cheats, in any other game. And gave it to someone, for the first time. That would be totally fine that they can't die. Because they're just praticing. Praticing all the way through the game.

Let's add in invicible mode to Pikmin 3. Let's add this to Bayonetta. How about Smash? It's training right. Intill they say every unlock or saving is disabled, in this mode. This is just legal god mode. Everyone is saying this mode is great for kids. Most aren't gonna go play the game with damage. Once they use this. And then they'll bitch the game is over in 1 hour. And are bored. Wasting that $60. I remember myself as a kid. You think I would of gone back and played OOT's water temple, normally. If I had the option to disable the need for iron boots, and blue tunic, no way. The puzzle aspect of the temple is what makes it hard. Not the enenmies. So having a difficulty setting there is not an option. But if OOT had invincible mode. That be disabling all the limitations to the iron boots and tunics.


It is an option because here's the twist a player has to choose it themselves. Nothing you've said here changes that or can change it, the's an ultra hard moe in the game as well for players I don't see you commenting on that, if someone else chooses to play this mode why does that upset you? All you're doing here is throwing around flawed analogies that don't debunk the main point.

What's ironic is you mention Bayonetta and forget the original had an ultra easy mode when released which someone could literally play the game with one hand, the was even a trailer for it.



archer9234 said:
curl-6 said:

And what's wrong with that if you're not forced to use it? To use the TV analogy, this is like giving you the option to see an episode recap to catch up with the series. You can still just watch it normally. Nothing is being taken away from you. It is optional.

Also, as has been said already, I don't know why people are acting like this is a new thing. Back when I was a kid in 90s, it was Game Genie, cheat codes, using God Mode in Doom, or Big Daddys in Age of Empires, etc. Nothing has changed really, this sort of thing has been around forever.

It's not optional, when the person just picked it. Once you CHOOSE Invincible mode. You are now in abridge mode. It's like a book. Some people just read the end. Because they just want to know the ending that bad. When Harry Potter Book 7 came out. Most of the people just read the end. To find out Snape died. Before they read any other page. This is basically that. Wouldn't it be better, if a person got stuck in the level. To just press start and hit skip. There's no point in even playing the game. With 0 challange. Because, the person may learn "the patterns" in this mode. But damage and when to dodge will not be taught. You are invincible. You won't know what ship is stronger. Or know if you dodged correctly.

And you're admitting it's a cheat mode. Were we had to use other means to do it. A device which you spent extra money on. This also use to be earned in games. So it was fine. Or you had to find the name cheat in a mag. More money. These things deterred/challenged you. The game is just giving it away. It be like allowing a FPS game to disable your health. Or your ammo. And leave it on unlimited. It's gonna tempt too many people to just do that. Then the game becomes pointless.

The fact that you have to choose it makes it by definition optional.

If you don't like it, don't use it, simple. Why should other people have to play it your way? No offense, but who appointed you the dictator of how other people are allowed to have fun?



Jim throws in his 2 cents: