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Forums - Politics Discussion - Why is there evil in the world, if God is all-powerful and good?

Because it is a mythos that needs a devil to necessitate a savior. And being a mythos, it isn't real.



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JWeinCom said:
VGPolyglot said:
Well, who determined that God is all-powerful? Where did the person get that information?

Especially because in the bible (old testament at least) he's really not portrayed as omniscient or omnipotent.

Now when Abram was ninety-nine years old, the LORD appeared to Abram and said to him, "I am God Almighty; Walk before Me, and be blameless.

Genesis 17:1



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CosmicSex said:
Because it is a mythos that needs a devil to necessitate a savior. And being a mythos, it isn't real.

By far the most likely answer in this thread



Soriku said:
Psychotic said:

Jeez, can we all stop with this cr*p? Religion is coming down in all civilized countries, we can all stop bashing them now, okay?

Besides, when they're gone, something else will take their place as the movement to suppress freedom and justice. My bet's on "progressivism".

 

"Progressivism" or anything else is not going to be as restricting or rabid or brainwashy or violent as religion.

 


This modern "progressivism" may not grow as physically violent, but it's well on its way to being just as manipulative and restricting. 



1. Perception - Having lived abroad and having witnessed evil, living back in Ireland again now, peoples perception is so warped. Poverty and crime in Ireland is a joke compared to what I've seen. People think they have it hard here, where they really live in the top 1% of the world. Therefore, without some evil or in my case a higher level of evil, how can we appreciate the good? How can I be so passionate about the beauty in Ireland? Because I have seen whats it's like in many other, much more evil places.

 

2. Free will - Speaks for itself. Communism and facism have proven that controlling how people fell or are, creates a disaster. What is evil to? An affair? An evil video game? Maybe without these things, the person would never learn or never vent themselves.



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I don't get how free will can be an argument. First of all, an almighty and all-knowing being can make lifeforms that have free will and at the same time are forever happy. No problem whatsoever. Because said being is all-knowing and almighty, it will always know what will happen next, free will or not.

Secondly, an almighty and all-knowing being could also create lifeforms with free will that will never even think about doing anything bad whatsoever. Seriously, when we're talking about all-powerful, there is no limit. This so-called God from various religions can break each and every rule of physics. It can travel faster than light, back and forth in time and really has no reason to not make the world absolutely perfect. It could even make a rock that is so heavy that even itself can't lift it. Yes, that's paradox, but no problem for an almighty being, right? So even the slightest imperfection is by all means a sign that God is not perfect at all. If it exists. Which I doubt.

My honest opinion: The possible existence of an almighty God is just as terrifying as the existence of a God without absolute power. So not only do I not believe in any God. I also seriously hope that there is none.



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OdinHades said:
JWeinCom said:

Especially because in the bible (old testament at least) he's really not portrayed as omniscient or omnipotent.

Now when Abram was ninety-nine years old, the LORD appeared to Abram and said to him, "I am God Almighty; Walk before Me, and be blameless.

Genesis 17:1

“And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.”

—Judges 1:19

26 The Lord said, “If I find fifty righteous people in the city of Sodom, I will spare the whole place for their sake. 

27 Then Abraham spoke up again: “Now that I have been so bold as to speak to the Lord, though I am nothing but dust and ashes,  28 what if the number of the righteous is five less than fifty? Will you destroy the whole city for lack of five people?”

“If I find forty-five there,” he said, “I will not destroy it.”

29 Once again he spoke to him, “What if only forty are found there?”

He said, “For the sake of forty, I will not do it.”

30 Then he said, “May the Lord not be angry,  but let me speak. What if only thirty can be found there?”

He answered, “I will not do it if I find thirty there.”

31 Abraham said, “Now that I have been so bold as to speak to the Lord, what if only twenty can be found there?”

He said, “For the sake of twenty, I will not destroy it.”

32 Then he said, “May the Lord not be angry, but let me speak just once more. What if only ten can be found there?”

He answered, “For the sake of ten, I will not destroy it.”

33 When the Lord had finished speaking with Abraham, he left, and Abraham returned home.

Genesis 18:16

 

 

 

So, god cannot drive away iron chariots.  So he's not omnipotent.  Abraham is able to haggle with him, which seems to defy omniscience.  Shouldn't he have already known that he would spare it for 10?  And shouldn't he already know exactly how many righteous people are in Sodom?

There are other places in the bible too, but those are the most obvious.  The idea of an omnipotent god is more of a christian invention.



JWeinCom said:

 

So, is that proof that God lied when he was talking to Abram which would make God itself a sinner? =P

Just sayin'



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OdinHades said:
JWeinCom said:

 

So, is that proof that God lied when he was talking to Abram which would make God itself a sinner? =P

Just sayin'

Or it could just mean that almighty doesn't translate all that well.



OdinHades said:
I don't get how free will can be an argument. First of all, an almighty and all-knowing being can make lifeforms that have free will and at the same time are forever happy. No problem whatsoever. Because said being is all-knowing and almighty, it will always know what will happen next, free will or not.

Secondly, an almighty and all-knowing being could also create lifeforms with free will that will never even think about doing anything bad whatsoever. Seriously, when we're talking about all-powerful, there is no limit. This so-called God from various religions can break each and every rule of physics. It can travel faster than light, back and forth in time and really has no reason to not make the world absolutely perfect. It could even make a rock that is so heavy that even itself can't lift it. Yes, that's paradox, but no problem for an almighty being, right? So even the slightest imperfection is by all means a sign that God is not perfect at all. If it exists. Which I doubt.

My honest opinion: The possible existence of an almighty God is just as terrifying as the existence of a God without absolute power. So not only do I not believe in any God. I also seriously hope that there is none.

You first point is covered in that if he made them that way then there will be no free will. Free will means there is always a chance that someone may decide to rebel.

The second is basic the same as the first. But the phyisic argument is a little narrow sighted. Phyisic as we know it is imposed on us by the rules of matter. If there is a god who created the universe then he is not bound by physics because he is not bound to this universe.

It kind of a weak but here is an article on the Multiverse theory, I tried to find the article a month or so ago when some found some evidence of a this being possible.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse

 

And as to my expanded explination I found two articles with pretty much what I said with the scripture references. One is short than the other so I will post links to both. There was more but there is links to them in both articles.

The shorter of the two - Why does God allow Evil and Suffering

 http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2011331

The a longer one - Why does God allow suffering?

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102005141