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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - You aren't a privileged Nintendo consumer because you own a Wii U

zippy on 24 January 2016
oniyide said:
spurgeonryan said:
Not privileged, but they are not making any friends by their actions against core fans.

The they totally ignored us with the Wii. Went after casuals and even some of their biggest franchise's catered towards them as well. Skyward Sword forced the wiimote on us just to prove to core gamers that it was a good controller.

Then we have the Wii U. Back to core support........then they try to kill it as soon as possible and expect us to play Mario 2D HD NX or some other rehash?
Yes, we are not privileged, but screw them if they do not treat us right.

Sony is treating many right and even you cannot deny that. 30 million PS4 owners don't lie.

I know personally, if they do not support the Wii U till the end, will not be buying the NX anywhere near launch.

im not the biggest Wii fan at all, but this is not even remotely true. Ninty made the games they usually made, what did the Wii miss? Now i guess you can say that the games they made catered more to them, but how? DKC Returns was pretty hardcore, 2 3d Marios, which was mostly bought by core gamers. 

They're are killing it because it is flopping, they are supposed to keep failing to make YOU feel good?

Sony is just a global beast, PS3 proved that as despite the screw ups it still managed to do 80+, its almost not fair to compare.

PS3 was a monumental disaster in terms of financial losses, imagine the outcry if Sony bailed on that after just 3-4 years. Wii U fans are just wanting a full console 5 year cycle with software support. Sony threw their support behind the PS3 despite heavy losses and it payed dividens, with consumer trust that PS4 would be well supported. Some Nintendo fans may be a bit cagey that if NX stumbles out of the blocks who's to say they wont pull the plug prematurely on that too. I think binning something off that hasn't performed to expectations isnt always the right thing to do and sometimes you have to suck it up and show support to earn the trust of the customers.





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Wyrdness on 24 January 2016
zippy said:

PS3 was a monumental disaster in terms of financial losses, imagine the outcry if Sony bailed on that after just 3-4 years. Wii U fans are just wanting a full console 5 year cycle with software support. Sony threw their support behind the PS3 despite heavy losses and it payed dividens, with consumer trust that PS4 would be well supported. Some Nintendo fans may be a bit cagey that if NX stumbles out of the blocks who's to say they wont pull the plug prematurely on that too. I think binning something off that hasn't performed to expectations isnt always the right thing to do and sometimes you have to suck it up and show support to earn the trust of the customers.

Vita says otherwise.



Soundwave on 24 January 2016
Wyrdness said:
Soundwave said:

Yeah Tomodachi did well especially in Japan but it's similar to Animal Crossing in some ways. In NA/Europe it did so-so no where close to what like Brain Training did back in the day.

Animal Crossing and Tomodachi did well, specifically in Japan, but I think these were primarily just selling to the core audience Nintendo always had.

Brain Training 3DS, Nintendogs + cats, Nintendo Land, Wii Fit U, Style Savvy, Game & Wario, Sing Party, Mario & Sonic Olympics, were all sales disappointments some them being full on flops. Wii Sports Club also wasn't a big hit.

Nintendo bet hard on that audience coming back for them, when they didn't, they basically knew they were fucked especially with Wii U. 

The mistake was not that they bet on them the mistake was how they bet on them, 3DS for a start was priced well above what any of that crowd were willing to pay, in UK it was 250 quid where as the DS was 140 at launch, 110 quid difference. Then the was the consumer confusion over the name and thirdly they never fully catered and marketed to them like with the DS and 3DS.

Instead Nintendo focused on the core group thinking that by default the blue ocean would follow when it's actually the other way round like Rol pointed out, the core group are the ones who would follow by default as their favourite IPS will be present. 

Enough with the excuses. 

The 3DS was $169.99 when stuff like Brain Training came out ... still flopped. Nintendogs still underperformed. 

That audience would rather play on their smartphone, some people just don't want to admit it. 

They focused on the core so their main 3DS launch title is Nintendogs and their main Wii U launch titles are Nintendo Land and NSMBU. 

Yeah so hardcore. 

Nintendo got fucked banking heavily on this audience. Nintendogs was supposed to carry the 3DS like an evergreen title and NSMBU + Nintendo Land were supposed to do the same for Wii U. This audience left Nintendo out in the cold. 

Casuals got tired of Nintendo, it's that simple, it was already evident with the Wii's collapsing sales in the back end of its life cycle even despite plenty of casual games coming out for it (Just Dance for example). 

Look at the Wii U's first 12 months release schedule from Nintendo ...

NSMBU, Nintendo Land, Sing Party, Ninja Gaiden 3, The Wonderful 101, Pikmin 3, LEGO City, Game & Wario, Wii Fit U, Super Mario 3D World, Mario & Sonic Winter Olympics, Wii Sports Club

More than half the games are heavily geared towards the casual market ... this is a hardcore game machine? Really? Hardcore gamers were supposed to be impressed with a 8 month old port of a shitty Ninja Gaiden game? 



t3mporary_126 on 24 January 2016
Wyrdness said:
zippy said:

PS3 was a monumental disaster in terms of financial losses, imagine the outcry if Sony bailed on that after just 3-4 years. Wii U fans are just wanting a full console 5 year cycle with software support. Sony threw their support behind the PS3 despite heavy losses and it payed dividens, with consumer trust that PS4 would be well supported. Some Nintendo fans may be a bit cagey that if NX stumbles out of the blocks who's to say they wont pull the plug prematurely on that too. I think binning something off that hasn't performed to expectations isnt always the right thing to do and sometimes you have to suck it up and show support to earn the trust of the customers.

Vita says otherwise.

This is a bad counter point. Most PS fans care about the PS4 more than the PS handheld especially since there are most PS1-4 customers than PSP and Vita. I dare to say most Vita customer that are PS fans won't care if Sony sticks to home consoles and only a tiny minority will even attempt to boycott PS5.

Nintendo on the otherhand has a reputation in both home consoles and handheld. But I do think Wii U fans/owners will jump ship to the NX just like Xbox fans did with the 360 when all their favorite series start releasing in a timely manner. And if Nintendo is feeling generous, they can offer an exclusive Zelda NX bundle to Wii U owners similar to MK8 Wii U bundle where they can buy one more NX game for free. 





zorg1000 on 24 January 2016
oniyide said:
Wyrdness said:

 

A lot of you are missing his point, the casuals and such never walked away in fact many of them are still around on 3DS as Tomodachi Life showed, Nintendo just stopped catering to them this gen just to cater to gamers like yourself as they did during the GC era. Many of them would come back if they started catering to them again, the 3DS retained a few games that catered to them like AC, Tomodachi Life and even big hitters like Pokemon appeals to them but the Wii U practically flushed all games aimed at them down the drain in favour of an approach more geared to the so called core group and it resulted in another GC show.

Think of this if NX is a hybrid platform Pokemon NX alone would bring in possibly more sales then Wii U has in total right now, AC NX could bring in a total of half the amount of sales Wii U has now because these titles have far wider appeal. He's right in that you as a hardcore fan would either get NX in the long run or be replaced by 5 or so other gamers if they had stuck to catering to everyone.

if this is true why isnt 3ds doing DS or even Wii numbers? why did the 3ds version of say, Nintendogs not do anywhere near the numbers of the DS one?

 

Well its hard to argue that Nintendo hasn't actively tried supporting them to the same extent that they did on DS. One thing is we saw a handful of big casual releases in a small time frame.

Nintendogs-August 2005 (also a price cut)

Mario Kart DS-November 2005

Animal Crossing: Wild World-December 2005

Brain Age-April 2006

New Super Mario Bros.-May 2006 (much sleeker/stylish revision)

Big Brain Academy-June 2006

From there things started to snowball with Nintendo & 3rd parties continuing to provide new casual-friendly experiences on a consistent basis over the next few years, Cooking/Gardening Mama, Professor Layton, Guitar Hero, Imagine Series, Style Savvy, Art Academy, Personal Trainer Series, Flash Focus, Rhythm Heaven, WarioWare, Scribblenauts, etc.

3DS has not had nearly the number of casual focused software released for it and Nintendo made mistakes in terms of design, price and marketing which hurt the device.

Another massive point that people forget or ignore is that the majority of R&D for 3DS happened before the mobile gaming market exploded in popularity. It was designed as if they had no mobile competitors since the mobile gaming scene was not nearly as large in 2006-2009 when the device was being designed. That's what is interesting going forward, NX will be the first device built from the ground up after the mobile market became mainstream, I'm really interested in seeing how they adapt.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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Soundwave on 24 January 2016
zorg1000 said:
oniyide said:

if this is true why isnt 3ds doing DS or even Wii numbers? why did the 3ds version of say, Nintendogs not do anywhere near the numbers of the DS one?

 

Well its hard to argue that Nintendo hasn't actively tried supporting them to the same extent that they did on DS. One thing is we saw a handful of big casual releases in a small time frame.

Nintendogs-August 2005 (also a price cut)

Mario Kart DS-November 2005

Animal Crossing: Wild World-December 2005

Brain Age-April 2006

New Super Mario Bros.-May 2006 (much sleeker/stylish revision)

Big Brain Academy-June 2006

From there things started to snowball with Nintendo & 3rd parties continuing to provide new casual-friendly experiences on a consistent basis over the next few years, Cooking/Gardening Mama, Professor Layton, Guitar Hero, Imagine Series, Style Savvy, Art Academy, Personal Trainer Series, Flash Focus, Rhythm Heaven, WarioWare, Scribblenauts, etc.

3DS has not had nearly the number of casual focused software released for it and Nintendo made mistakes in terms of design, price and marketing which hurt the device.

Another massive point that people forget or ignore is that the majority of R&D for 3DS happened before the mobile gaming market exploded in popularity. It was designed as if they had no mobile competitors since the mobile gaming scene was not nearly as large in 2006-2009 when the device was being designed. That's what is interesting going forward, NX will be the first device built from the ground up after the mobile market became mainstream, I'm really interested in seeing how they adapt.

 


3DS didn't have them because those games were putting up dissapointing sales. Nintendogs + cats badly hurt Nintendo because they banked the launch window on it. Brain Training full on flopped. Style Savvy didn't do well. 

Nintendo always did deep product testing with casuals (I remember Iwata would sometimes share surveys they did with this audience) ... they knew I think around 2013 that the mobile market was fucking them hard with casuals and they were done for with that market. 

At that point they started to look into mobile games for themselves (if you can't beat them ...) I believe. 

Again look at the Wii U's first 12 months ...

NSMBU, Nintendo Land, Sing Party, Ninja Gaiden 3, Wonderful 101, Wii Fit U, Wii Sports Club, Wii Party U, Mario & Sonic Winter Olympics, Mario 3D World, Pikmin 3

Like more than half of these are casual games even 3D Mario World was positioned to be easier than the Galaxy games for the Wii-Casual audience to play (more like NSMB). Wii U had terrible sales. 



Wyrdness on 24 January 2016
Soundwave said:

Enough with the excuses. 

The 3DS was $169.99 when stuff like Brain Training came out ... still flopped. Nintendogs still underperformed. 

That audience would rather play on their smartphone, some people just don't want to admit it. 

They focused on the core so their main 3DS launch title is Nintendogs and their main Wii U launch titles are Nintendo Land and NSMBU. 

Yeah so hardcore. 

Nintendo got fucked banking heavily on this audience. Nintendogs was supposed to carry the 3DS like an evergreen title and NSMBU + Nintendo Land were supposed to do the same for Wii U. 

Casuals got tired of Nintendo, it's that simple, it was already evident with the Wii's collapsing sales in the back end of its life cycle even despite plenty of casual games coming out for it (Just Dance for example). 

What excuse those are reasons as to why which you haven't countered with any point, count the number of casual and non gamer specific titles released on both 3DS and Wii U, you won't even come close to what either the DS or Wii would put out in a year instead you're bsing yourself in cherry picking the few slim pickings that Nintendo offered to cater to them.

Casuals never got tired of them Nintendo stopped focusing on them, Wii collapsed because Nintendo pulled the plug on it not because of the audience.





Pavolink on 24 January 2016

The problem is that people that "will lose consumer confidence" are 1,000 people. 1m at most. But the gain could be bigger than that, just like the GC-Wii.

I 100% agree with your post and will add this: if people is expecting Nintendp will care at your "consumer trust", better sit down because it's going to be a long wait.



Proud to be the first cool Nintendo fan ever

Number ONE Zelda fan in the Universe

DKCTF didn't move consoles

Prediction: No Zelda HD for Wii U, quietly moved to the succesor

Predictions for Nintendo NX and Mobile


Wyrdness on 24 January 2016
t3mporary_126 said:

This is a bad counter point. Most PS fans care about the PS4 more than the PS handheld especially since there are most PS1-4 customers than PSP and Vita. I dare to say most Vita customer that are PS fans won't care if Sony sticks to home consoles and only a tiny minority will even attempt to boycott PS5.

Nintendo on the otherhand has a reputation in both home consoles and handheld. But I do think Wii U fans/owners will jump ship to the NX just like Xbox fans did with the 360 when all their favorite series start releasing in a timely manner. And if Nintendo is feeling generous, they can offer an exclusive Zelda NX bundle to Wii U owners similar to MK8 Wii U bundle where they can buy one more NX game for free. 

 

I'm sure most Nintendo fans cared about the consoles more in the early days of the portable market still didn't stop Nintendo managing to build a portable specific userbase.



Soundwave on 24 January 2016
Wyrdness said:
Soundwave said:

Enough with the excuses. 

The 3DS was $169.99 when stuff like Brain Training came out ... still flopped. Nintendogs still underperformed. 

That audience would rather play on their smartphone, some people just don't want to admit it. 

They focused on the core so their main 3DS launch title is Nintendogs and their main Wii U launch titles are Nintendo Land and NSMBU. 

Yeah so hardcore. 

Nintendo got fucked banking heavily on this audience. Nintendogs was supposed to carry the 3DS like an evergreen title and NSMBU + Nintendo Land were supposed to do the same for Wii U. 

Casuals got tired of Nintendo, it's that simple, it was already evident with the Wii's collapsing sales in the back end of its life cycle even despite plenty of casual games coming out for it (Just Dance for example). 

What excuse those are reasons as to why which you haven't countered with any point, count the number of casual and non gamer specific titles released on both 3DS and Wii U, you won't even come close to what either the DS or Wii would put out in a year instead you're bsing yourself in cherry picking the few slim pickings that Nintendo offered to cater to them.

Casuals never got tired of them Nintendo stopped focusing on them, Wii collapsed because Nintendo pulled the plug on it not because of the audience.

 

Actually the Wii U had probably more casual titles in its first year than the Wii even did. Wii had Zelda, Metroid, Mario Galaxy, Paper Mario, Fire Emblem and other more traditional Nintendo IP in year 1, with Wii Sports, Mario Party, Brain Age, and Wario Ware Wii as pure party/casual games.

Wii U had Nintendo Land, NSMBU, Sing Party, Wii Fit U, Game & Wario, Wii Sports Club, Mario & Sonic Olympics, and Wii Party U all within the first 12 months and only Mario 3D World, Pikmin 3, LEGO, and W101 as its "hardcore" new games and even some of those skewed towards a casual slant. 

Why is it so hard for some people to accept that the Wii audience would rather pay $0 instead of $50 to get their gaming fix? Is it really that unbelievable? 

If I gave you free Pepsi for the rest of your life ... would you pay for Coca-Cola? I doubt it, probably only if you were a real hardcore Coca-Cola fanatic. Smartphones just destroyed the value proposition Nintendo was asking for.