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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Has Tomb Raider been wasted?

I do wonder sometimes whether it's actual good news that people come down on, or if it's PR fluffery that people just can't let stand. If companies actually put out hard numbers rather than mincing around and contorting information into all sort of knots that make it hard for people to get a true picture then maybe people would be less inclined to point out the puffery and misdirection that exists in PR.

It also just so happens that the products that are not quite performing as originally intended or expected tend to suffer from the more egregious forms of PR smoke and mirrors, and hence people are more likely to be critical of that PR. Whereas the companies that are doing as well or better than expected feel much more comfortable about putting out spin-free information.

So it's not like Sony is putting out the same level of PR vagueness and it just happens that MS is being picked on more. The fact is MS is being more vague with its PR because it feels it needs to be in order to try to keep the narrative positive, and therefore people are calling out that vagueness.

But it's not like PS4 isn't suffering from some shennanigans in the public arena. Just look at the head of steam that built up with claims and videos of PS4 framerate issues with FO4 which started to give people a negative vibe about FO4 on PS4, and it turns out that PS4 and Xb one both pretty much suffer from the same technical glitchery, and arguably the 0fps moments on Xb one makes it somewhat more glitchy.

In terms of this topic, I think it is a very legit question, and one Xbox / MS fans should be engaging in. Why when RoTR was talked about with such fanfare last year have MS and SE seemed to kind of drop the marketing ball with it, and therefore destined the game to probably not achieve the sort of success it might have if a more concerted effort had been made? It's a damned shame, because I personally would like to see the TR franchise live and prosper and I would not give a single thought to CoD, FO or SWBF burning out and dying. But out of all these franchises TR is looking the most fragile because it has not received the marketing push it deserves. It is probably not hyperbolic to say that the franchise is completely dependant on the PC and PS4 releases next year to be assured of any further AAA games in the franchise being made. And you can almost guarantee that SE will not be doing a timed or permanent exclusivity deal with MS again for this franchise. So with these things in mind I think it is fair for all fans of TR, regardless of platform preference, to say that the SE/CD+MS venture with RoTR is not going to be successful in terms of the health of the franchise. Whether MS or SE made money out of the deal we'll never know. But while we should recognise that a company's only concern is profits so SE may feel like it did OK out of this, as gamers our main concern is the health of franchises we love to play.

Some people said right from the outset that this was likely to be a bad move from a game sales perspective. And it seems like they are going to be right. And regardless of what people might want to believe, all the BM'ing in the world from PS fans isn't going to stop Xbox owners from buying the game. What will stop them buying the game is not being interested in the franchise. And it seems like the Xbox user base is not very interested in the franchise. It is also probably true to say that over all interest in the TR franchise is not enough to get most people who prefer other platforms to buy a Xbox, especially not a timed exclusive. So it appears getting this exclusivity deal on RoTR may have been a miscalculation, as MS may have been hoping for a much bigger hardware gain from the deal than what they are likely to get. I would equate this to Bayonetta 2 with Wii U. I don;t know what Nintendo was really expecting there, but I imagine Nintendo was hoping for a pretty decent influx of genre fans, that appers to have never happened.

It's always a risk, on multiple fronts, exclusivising an existing franchise. Some times it pays off big, other times is really fails to achieve much of anything. I think when things get examined objectively a year or so down the track the conclusion is likely to be that the TR venure was more on the fail side than the success side. Aside from the fact that CD actually made a very good game, worthy of every sale it gets, and more.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

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TheBlackNaruto said:
Chazore said:
Metroid33slayer said:
 

The title is basically saying it is wasted on xbox one, the poster is trying to cloak it under the guise of concern but anyone can see that he is having a dig at the xbox one.

Also to note the user was originally perma banned for targeting Xbox fans and only those fans and having a self admitted hatred for MS and Xbox in general so with an unban it's no surprise to see a thread like this from someone, the traits on this site are all mostly readable from a mile away. If this were multilat we wouldn't be seeing this or in fact we'd be seeing "PS4 sells more than Xbox, why is Xbox bothering, why is it so shit?", because that's mostly what the focus seems to be on this site, whatever good news even if it;s small that comes out for Xbox, it;s more than doubled with negative news to pummel down whatever good it had coming, same goes for PC and at times Nintendo.

Traits are on any and every site. It jus seems like on this site if people have a different opinion on something folks take offense...and feel like they are being targeted and picked on. For instance you for some reason left Sony out of your list like it doesn't get hit with negative news just like Xbox, PC and MS so would I say you are picking sides in this? It happens to all of them Sony, MS, Nin and PC. Then you generalize saying if it were this then this would happen...There have been plenty of games that have sold better on PS4 than XB1 and while a select few may say silly stuff most don't. So let's just say it happens to everyone and move on...your posts makes it seem like you are bother or upset about something that happens to every company and will always happen....no big deal just let it go! Shoot I willr espond and converse with folks debate different points that is what forums are for! Folks need to stop being so sensitive!(not you personallyjust speaking in general lol)

You are absolutely right and it is funny because Sony was the most hated and bashed last generation,even after they made better decisions and improved the PS3.It is not like MS does not deserve all the flack they get,but this thread is not about MS,rather the obvious bad deal that Square has made.There is no argument against the facts and the fact is that this exclusive deal is a bad deal period and it is bad mostly because the game will flop.



Interesting points, I won't address all but totally agree about the PR stuff. They are paid to spin things in a positive way but sometimes too much spin just comes off as either slimy or patronising. I actually loved the times eurogamer referred to ms spinning hw sales numbers as " numberwang". 

 

After playing the first game and not liking the characters and the fact there was no real tombs and too much fighting, I am now curious to see the new game as people in this thread have said they have more or less fixed two of those things.... 

 

Binary are are you a Kiwi or just a FOTC fan?! 



How was it ignored? It has it's own sku. The only thing that was a mess to me was the release date. Although I believe this game will do well on BF. I don't think they wanted to miss out on that. Sure have the confidence that your game can stand against FO4 but be realistic. Not same day man. Release it a week later or buck the trend and release it the next weeks Friday. That would give ppl 10 days to play FO4 and for some pick up another paycheck to buy the game.



TheSting said:
How was it ignored? It has it's own sku. The only thing that was a mess to me was the release date. Although I believe this game will do well on BF. I don't think they wanted to miss out on that. Sure have the confidence that your game can stand against FO4 but be realistic. Not same day man. Release it a week later or buck the trend and release it the next weeks Friday. That would give ppl 10 days to play FO4 and for some pick up another paycheck to buy the game.


At least in Europe it launches on Friday.... Give it a chance to get some more sales. U.K. Should be good to them. 



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Bryank75 said:

Binary are are you a Kiwi or just a FOTC fan?! 

Both.

I actually have a tenuous family connection to Bret McKenzie. My sister-in-law was a professional dancer (and by that I mean ballet and the like), and her Bret's mother was her dance instructer, Dierdre Tarrant. Who is pretty much one of the top  dance instructors in New Zealand. And my nieces both also went to Dierdre's dance studio and they ran into Bret a few times.

The question is, have you seen What We Do in the Shadows?

My other vicarious claim to fame is that my wife taught piano to both of Peter Jackson's kids. Peter never set foot on our house, but Fran had been a few times to drop off and pick up Billy and Katie. 

Yeah, New Zealand is a pretty small place.

To bring it back to the topic, New Zealand would be a great place to film a reboot of the TR movies...or not.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

Bryank75 said:
TheSting said:
How was it ignored? It has it's own sku. The only thing that was a mess to me was the release date. Although I believe this game will do well on BF. I don't think they wanted to miss out on that. Sure have the confidence that your game can stand against FO4 but be realistic. Not same day man. Release it a week later or buck the trend and release it the next weeks Friday. That would give ppl 10 days to play FO4 and for some pick up another paycheck to buy the game.


At least in Europe it launches on Friday.... Give it a chance to get some more sales. U.K. Should be good to them. 


I've actually never heard so much about Fallout and have not played it. I see that it's a big game and probably gotten bigger with each release. I liked the new direction of TR. Hope it sells well on all platforms.



binary solo said:
Bryank75 said:

Binary are are you a Kiwi or just a FOTC fan?! 

Both.

I actually have a tenuous family connection to Bret McKenzie. My sister-in-law was a professional dancer (and by that I mean ballet and the like), and her Bret's mother was her dance instructer, Dierdre Tarrant. Who is pretty much one of the top  dance instructors in New Zealand. And my nieces both also went to Dierdre's dance studio and they ran into Bret a few times.

The question is, have you seen What We Do in the Shadows?

My other vicarious claim to fame is that my wife taught piano to both of Peter Jackson's kids. Peter never set foot on our house, but Fran had been a few times to drop off and pick up Billy and Katie. 

Yeah, New Zealand is a pretty small place.

To bring it back to the topic, New Zealand would be a great place to film a reboot of the TR movies...or not.

 

Ah that is really cool. My son loves the music in the muppets movie that Bret wrote. 

I havnt seen what we do in the shadows, but I must. Agree on the movie location.

i just know a few people from there through tkd. 



TheSting said:
Bryank75 said:


At least in Europe it launches on Friday.... Give it a chance to get some more sales. U.K. Should be good to them. 


I've actually never heard so much about Fallout and have not played it. I see that it's a big game and probably gotten bigger with each release. I liked the new direction of TR. Hope it sells well on all platforms.


They're good games but made their name on PC really along with elder scrolls. They have legs due to content and the huge modding community. 



Chazore said:

You make it sound like everything is equally fair and yet life is never equal or fair so why should this be?, of course it's easy to say "other sites are exactly the same and people take offense and think they re targeted" and call it a day without actually understanding why. Of course Sony gets some negative news but nowhere near as much as the other platforms, in fact a lot of the negative news tends to stem from the opposite sides rather than the side that carries the positive news.

But sure call me some big generalizing hypocrite if that makes you feel like the better man on a horse, I see exactly what I see and I'm not alone on this because I have talks with people from different sites and platforms, sure you can call them the same as you clearly call me but that's not going to change perception or what is actually happening.

"your posts makes it seem like you are bother or upset about something that happens to every company and will always happen", I would appreciate if that were put into proper English because I can't make sense of that.

I'm not really that sensitive but I do dislike seeing bad traits being more commonplace and I do take those traits into account, I mean why should police officers or people in the psychiatric field bother with taking in or observing traits if it's clear that they will get flustered or upset?, it's not like they observe to figure out said person or predict what they are likely to do. People on here love predictions when it comes to sales data, copies sold, rep etc and as for me I predict behavior patterns based on posters traits, doesn't mean I'm magically upset or desperate to down someone, I just prefer keeping an eye on people who have been known to cause trouble and see if they are likely to change, OP claims he has and I'll keep to his word. Just like I'll keep to yours.

Of course this should be continued someone else if you desire to drag it out as it's strafing off into off topic territory.

But that is what I am saying it is not fair in life so why let it bother you. I am sure you were here last Gen when Sony was losing and made all those stupid decisions with the PS3 and they got all the negative news as well even when it was something positive the negative was thrown in.. Heck even now their financial situation gets brought up in arguments that have nothing to do with that. The point being it happens on boths sides. And no I said you ame a generalizing statement and left Sony out as if it doesn't happen to them. Doesn't make me feel like a better man on a horse at all just showing that the actions of a few don't speak for a whole.

I dislike bad traits as well but none of the ones you mentioned were happening so it was just odd to bring them up in this thread. But yeah this is off topic but is also good discussion! But no worries man just don't let the few bad apples spoil the bunch!

OT:

I say we wait and see what the sales look like before making that decision.



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