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Forums - Politics Discussion - Obama's Continued War on Human Rights

Insidb said:

lol in the future people are going to look back on the people of the past ( our current era ) who claim the constitution rights they have  currently are outdated and so we should give them up

they'll look back and curse those people because of consequences that are going to be brought about

 

i cannot actually believe that people are saying that their rights are outdated and so they should give them up while acknowledging that those who rule over them as a result only gain more and more power correspondingly

 

it truly is sad but it is by design one way to enslave a people is to convince them that they don't need or deserve their rights and that they are irresponsible and so someone has to take the responsiblity they can't handle themselves

lol in the future people are going to look back and say, "people worshipped this illegal document as immutable and fought over its original prescriptions AFTER they AMENDED it and universally accepted that it can be AMENDED."

The 2nd AMENDMENT is one of the 10 AMENDMENTS, which inherently means that people realized that the Consititution is a legal document that is inherently fallible and must evolve to accomodate the wisdom of the modern age of understanding. Anyone who sits back and believes that any one people fully understood the proper way to universally govern any human populace 230 years ago is being patently absurb. Slavery was legal, women could no vote, homosexuality was a crime: these are all hallmarks of what most Americans view to be barbaric traits of Middle Eastern, predominantly Islamic nations. If people want to cling to the delineations of a bygone era, they are free to relocate to the nations that adhere to them with uncompromising adamance. The next time someone introduces that line of thinking, go tell a black person they to pick some cotton, a woman that she doesn't understand what she wants from her government, or a gay person that they made the wrong "choice" and see how well they take it.

The constitution was meant to evolve and be amended; intractability only serves to stagnate a nation.


Ten Amendments? HMM. I COULD HAVE SWORN THERE WERE A FEW MORE.

I assume you meant the Bill of Rights, the first ten Amendments. Pretty cool name, huh? That means they are our rights that the government may not take away. Period. Ever. NO. What you're saying is tantamount to claiming the government is allowed to do away with everyone's right to a speedy trial by a jury of their peers, or to say they have to testify against themselves.

So no. Just no.



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sully1311 said:
Uuuhh, guns and America.

Right!?!



NobleTeam360 said:
Luck said:
What about my right to wear a loaded rocket launcher on my shoulder ? I wont feel free unless I can do so.

What country gives you that right? or was this a poor attempt at being sarcastic?


It's not poor sarcasm. It's good sarcasm. Made me laugh a little. 



mornelithe said:
sc94597 said:
It doesn't matter really what he's trying to do.. There is a high demand for personal gun ownership in the U.S. There is a high supply of guns in the U.S. There is a large political movement for personal gun ownership in the U.S. Obama is constrained here.

Yeah, it's amusing to see people framing this as The Supreme Leader Obama vs the poor, down-trodden gun industry.  I like guns, have a couple in the house, doesn't mean I can't be concerned about the number of guns in circulation in the US, or the number of deaths per year to gun violence.  Personally, I don't have the answer, but, we at least have to be open to talking about it.   There's a dangerously large number of knee-jerk reactionaries in the US...not exactly the group of people I'd want being armed to the teeth.

I agree. Thank you.



Azuren said:

Ten Amendments? HMM. I COULD HAVE SWORN THERE WERE A FEW MORE.

I assume you meant the Bill of Rights, the first ten Amendments. Pretty cool name, huh? That means they are our rights that the government may not take away. Period. Ever. NO. What you're saying is tantamount to claiming the government is allowed to do away with everyone's right to a speedy trial by a jury of their peers, or to say they have to testify against themselves.

So no. Just no.

There are no special stipulations around the Bill of Rights.  They can be repealed in the same way as the 18th.  Besides amending the constitution, there is also considerable leeway given to the supreme court in how they interpret it.  Despite the fourth amendment, the court still found DUI checkpoints to be constitutional due to the state's interest and their opinion on the degree of intrusion.  Despite the first amendment, falsely yelling fire in a crowded theater is not protected.  Despite the second amendment, there are still various restrictions on bearing arms.  Another future court might be of the majority opinion that it only applies to state militias.

Now that doesn't mean any of them will be repealed, especially any time soon.  However this idea that they can't be "taken away. Period. Ever" is not accurate.



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iamserious said:
NobleTeam360 said:

What country gives you that right? or was this a poor attempt at being sarcastic?


It's not poor sarcasm. It's good sarcasm. Made me laugh a little. 

Thanks for your opinion. 



Ok, I thought I was done here, but this title change to "human rights" instead of "gun rights" is just outright FACEPALM

Just to be sure I read through the human rights bill http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ and nope, there is absolutely no right to M855 ammunition anywhere in there, nor the right to bear firearms for that matter, although with mental gymnastics some of you might want to spin Article 3 "Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person." in that direction.

But there are several articles the US gov has ignored even before the Obama administration, undoubtetly with full consent of mister SocialistSlayer, like for example A5,6,9,10,11. And I don't doubt the OP would like them to go against a few more of them, like A22,25.1 .



Lafiel said:

Ok, I thought I was done here, but this title change to "human rights" instead of "gun rights" is just outright FACEPALM

Just to be sure I read through the human rights bill http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ and nope, there is absolutely no right to M855 ammunition anywhere in there, nor the right to bear firearms for that matter, although with mental gymnastics some of you might want to spin Article 3 "Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person." in that direction.

But there are several articles the US gov has ignored even before the Obama administration, undoubtetly with full consent of mister SocialistSlayer, like for example A5,6,9,10,11. And I don't doubt the OP would like them to go against a few more of them, like A22,25.1 .


Yeah I just noticed that change. It's insane. It's amazing how many people die a year from gun violence in the US, and yet they seem to think that carrying around something made for military warfare is not just a good idea, but your right as a person. Well personally I don't want my next stroll in the park to end up being a real-life version of TimeCrisis, but that's just me...



cfin2987@gmail.com said:
Nettles said:


Yes.Because Charlie Hebdo never happened.


More people than the Charlie hebdo incident get killed in Chicago many standard nights. And that was terrorism. Not a standard shooting caused by the abundance of guns in a country. 

 

And the argument for more guns, being impartial about this, let's throw this out there. Yes because 9/11 never happened. You're implying that a society without guns has incidents like Charlie hebdo. Yet a society that claims that more guns will fix the issue has larger scale terrorist attacks to deal with. Then there are the dozens of school shootings etc. they happen with or without gun control. But in reality, they are more common in the US.

There are over 300 million guns in the US, bit late trying to ban them.The guy i quoted said people in Europe aren't afraid of random crazy lunatics, yet the people who committed the Charlie Hebdo attacks were just that yes? Now freedom of speech is threatened over there because all the media outlets are afraid to post anything criticizing certain religions.

I realise that most gun violence/murders etc is in Chicago, Detroit etc where there is a big problem with black gangs.Don't worry, when the economy collapses those places will eventually be livable once more, the gang bangers will wipe themselves out pretty quick because they don't produce anything only are parasitic.Sad but true.

Go back and look at history, i think you will find the biggest mass murderers were governments who banned private ownership of weapons.Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot.



ps4tw said:
Lafiel said:

Ok, I thought I was done here, but this title change to "human rights" instead of "gun rights" is just outright FACEPALM

Just to be sure I read through the human rights bill http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ and nope, there is absolutely no right to M855 ammunition anywhere in there, nor the right to bear firearms for that matter, although with mental gymnastics some of you might want to spin Article 3 "Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person." in that direction.

But there are several articles the US gov has ignored even before the Obama administration, undoubtetly with full consent of mister SocialistSlayer, like for example A5,6,9,10,11. And I don't doubt the OP would like them to go against a few more of them, like A22,25.1 .


Yeah I just noticed that change. It's insane. It's amazing how many people die a year from gun violence in the US, and yet they seem to think that carrying around something made for military warfare is not just a good idea, but your right as a person. Well personally I don't want my next stroll in the park to end up being a real-life version of TimeCrisis, but that's just me...

How many die to gun violence compared to motor vehicle accidents?

Are you afraid of driving a car or crossing the road too?

Gun violence is way down in the past 30 years, go look at the numbers.