pPeople say that Nintendo doesn't listen to their fans may be mistaken. They have these questionairres that we fill out online when we register our games. I can't remember the specific example but I remember recently where they said a feature was left out of a game because nobody asked for it in the Club Nintendo question thingy.

Failure of 3rd party games on Wii:

Just Dance, Guitar Hero, Rock Band, Rabbids, Lego games, Sonic games, uDraw Studio, Skylanders, Shuan White Snowboarding, several other sports titles such as Madden and Tiger Woods, etc., all did VERY well, on Wii.

Goldeneye for Wii sold over 1.7 million. At least 3 different Call of Duty games sold 1 million+. Red Steel 1 sold over a million. Red Steel 2, while not greatly promoted, sold over half a million. Epic Mickey sold close to 3 million copies. Boom Blox sold over 1 million. de Blob sold close to a million. Monster Hunter Tri sold over 2 million. Star Wars: The Force Unleashed sold close to 2 million, on a similar level to the PS3 version. Ghostbusters actually sold the best out of all versions on the Wii. RE4 and the RE Chronicles games did very well on Wii. No More Heroes 1 sold over half a million copies on Wii, and both versions sold a lot better on Wii than they did on PS3. House of the Dead: Overkill on Wii sold over 800k copies, compared to just over 200k for the "upgraded" version on PS3. Muramasa and MadWorld, both very niche titles, sold over half am million on Wii. Xenoblade Chronicles, with little to no real advertising, sold over 800k. Tatsunoko vs. Capcom, with half the game's roster based on characters largely not recognized in NA, sold half a million copies. The Last Story, also with very little in the way of real promotion, sold over half a million.

I'm not arguing that Wii couldn't/shouldn't have had a lot more third party support. BUT, to claim that third party sales were a "failure" on Wii, is kind of laughable, as there were many successes.

As for you mentioning the sales of Skyward Sword.....what about them? The game sold over 3.6 million copies, better than several other Zelda titles, and sales most developers NOT putting out something named CoD, Halo, Assasin's Creed, etc., would kill for. I get that you're insenuating it sold less than Twilight Princess. Well, that's not too hard to figure out. There was a ton of hype surrounding both TP as a game, and Wii as a system. Considering that it was a LAUNCH title for the Wii, and that the sales of the Wii exploded right out of the gate and didn't slow down for several years, well YEAH, Twilight Princess on Wii was bound to sell very well, which it did. And it deserved it, it's a great game (though the GC version is better). But SS sales were by no means poor, so I don't really get why you're bringing that up.

And lastly, of COURSE EA and Ubisoft were going to be disappointed with their Wii U title sales, given the fact that the system, while it sold really well at launch, hit the brakes around Jan. and has been crawling since. That's due in large part to NO GAMES. Perhaps more people might have cared about Madden on Wii U, if it hadn't been a gimped version without many of the features the other versions shared, because EA couldn't be bothered to spend the time to make it better? As far as attach rates go, Zombi U actually has sold decently, but again, sales for the system itself have been sluggish for months, so no shit it's not going to improve much over that span. BUT, the key difference in the reaction from EA and Ubisoft, is that Ubisoft is still putting out many of their top titles, NOT gimped versions even, on Wii U this fall, while EA cancelled whatever they may have had in the works. If you're wondering who took the proper approach, it was Ubisoft. Once Wii U sales start picking back up, because actual GAMES will be available for the system again, there is a solid chance that those Ubi titles on Wii U could eventually see solid sales.

So, you can say all of that shit you listed "speaks for itself". Except that at least 2/3s of what you said was either incorrect or irellevant to your point.

I never questioned his "fanbood", I just questioned the points he was trying to make. And whether you write your company of choice letters or not does not gage how much of fan you are.

Yet such sales didn't improve third party support on the wii, the current third party support of the wii u speaks for itself. It is not my opinion only but also the ones of publishers like EA. 

Lol so you think skyward sword didn't flop considering it's install base?

When wii u sales pick up the sales of ubisoft games won't improve much, because people who exclusively buy mario games are not interested in assasins creed. 

I really don't need to talk, the wii had a 100 million install base, mario kart sold what 30 million, yet skyward sword coudn't pass the gamecube zelda. People who bought the wii and people who will buy the wii-u when the mario games come out do not care about 3rd party games as shown by software sales of the wii. 

I somewhat agree. The problem here is that not many users are left on a Nintendo console who buy many third party games. Because of the lack of 3rd party support over the generations, people have moved onto other platforms, therefore there i no audience atm.

The only way to get a 3rd party audience back on a Nintendo system is to ensure the kids do not migrate to the other systems. The only way to do that is keep releasing your games and build up the userbase slowly. It will take a generation to achieve but it will happen if they commit to build one.

It's a hopeless cause at this point with third parties. Even the Japanese ones aren't helping Nintendo much on consoles. Sony and MS have that audience and are never going to give it up as it's basically the main thing that drives their console sales.

Even if all else was equal, third parties would still probably prefer Sony/MS because they don't have to compete against other Nintendo games on those platforms and Sony/MS also spend a ton of money primarily marketing to core male gamers that is the audience most major third party games are aimed at -- ie: BioShock, Madden NFL, Grand Theft Auto, Metal Gear Solid, Resident Evil, Call of Duty, Assassin's Creed, etc. etc.

Nintendo needs to rebuild their 2nd party prowess and make more relationships like the Platinum Games one to ensure more content for their platforms.

Honestly if they had even kept Rare, that probably would've been fine, even one extra Rare console game per year makes their console lineup look just that extra bit better that they need ...

2012 - New Super Mario Bros. U, Nintendo Land, Killer Instinct U*

2013 - New Super Luigi U, Pikmin 3, Perfect Dark U*, Super Mario 3D World, Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze

2014 - X, Mario Kart 8, Bayonetta 2, Banjo-Kazooie U*, Fire Emblem x Shin Megami Tensei, Smash Bros. U

Agreed no one will come back hence why they need to shift focus in retaining kids that grow up. They basically need to build their audiences for next gen.

Rare was a mistake, not exactly sure how it all went down, but when MIcrososoft got 51% share it was all over. Did NIntendo even have a chance to buy them first? Personally I would have bought them jsut for the IPs as they are some of the msot iconic on Nintendo platforms. 

your mistake is thinking that they want to be the number 1 device.

Lets look at it form their persepctive.

Say 50-50 go for PS4/Xbox one.

What Nintendo want is to capture as many from each side of the fence to be their number two console. If  30% from both sides want a Nintendo system as their secondary then you sudenly got a higher number than people who want A or B as primary. This is what they need to focus on instead of aiming to be number one.

1. Yes, it was a generalization. It's up to you to call yourself a traditional gamer

2. Of course a lot of Nintendo fans are dedicated gamers. In that sentence, with dedicated gamers, I was referring to the not so heavily Nintendo favoring gamers.

3. When things play out "normaly" Nintendo won't win a generation.

4. Don't try to cherry pick some quotes just to make people look stupid dude. I don't see anything offensive or straight wrong with my post.