Forums - Microsoft Discussion - 360 can be the rpg console of 2008

naznatips said:
Riachu said:

That is not entirely true. JRPGs have been mainstream since FF7. You just think they are niche because a lot of them don't sell well. Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Tales, Star Ocean, Shin Megami Tensei are popular RPG series. The reason why many don't sell is because they are derivative and people don't have a reason to hype them. For example, The Last Remnant is hyped because of the large scale battles and White Knight Chronicles is hyped because of it's innovative battle system and beautiful visuals. On the other hand, Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey don't do anything new but were hyped because they were being developed by Mistwalker in which the creator of Final Fantasy is the president of. The character designs were done by Akira Toriyama(Blue Dragon) and Takehiko Inoue(Lost odyssey) who are famous mangaka in Japan. The composer for both of them was Nobuo Uematsu who was a Final Fantasy mainstray.

 


You are misinformed. Dragon Quest sells under a million worldwide outside of Japan. Tales has only ever had 1 game break 1 million units sold worldwide. Shin Megami Tensei has never broke 1 million units sold worldwide. Even in Japan RPGs are by and large low budget and low sales productions. This was true last generation and it's true this generation as well. I know my RPG history hehe. I've played JRPGs practically relgiously since the SNES.

The JRPG market has been shrinking at an easily trackable rate since FFVII, and this generation could represent as much as a 50% drop in sales for the genre as a whole. JRPGs are niche, even in Japan, other than a few main series. Budget constraints are forcing the majority of new RPG development on the DS and Wii.


 If that is true, why are JRPGs decreasing in popularity then?



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naznatips said:
Riachu said:

That is not entirely true. JRPGs have been mainstream since FF7. You just think they are niche because a lot of them don't sell well. Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Tales, Star Ocean, Shin Megami Tensei are popular RPG series. The reason why many don't sell is because they are derivative and people don't have a reason to hype them. For example, The Last Remnant is hyped because of the large scale battles and White Knight Chronicles is hyped because of it's innovative battle system and beautiful visuals. On the other hand, Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey don't do anything new but were hyped because they were being developed by Mistwalker in which the creator of Final Fantasy is the president of. The character designs were done by Akira Toriyama(Blue Dragon) and Takehiko Inoue(Lost odyssey) who are famous mangaka in Japan. The composer for both of them was Nobuo Uematsu who was a Final Fantasy mainstray.

 


You are misinformed. Dragon Quest sells under a million worldwide outside of Japan. Tales has only ever had 1 game break 1 million units sold worldwide. Shin Megami Tensei has never broke 1 million units sold worldwide. Even in Japan RPGs are by and large low budget and low sales productions. This was true last generation and it's true this generation as well. I know my RPG history hehe. I've played JRPGs practically relgiously since the SNES.

The JRPG market has been shrinking at an easily trackable rate since FFVII, and this generation could represent as much as a 50% drop in sales for the genre as a whole. JRPGs are niche, even in Japan, other than a few main series. Budget constraints are forcing the majority of new RPG development on the DS and Wii.

Actually, Tales of Destiny outsold Tales of Symphonia... 


 



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ClaudeLv250 said:

 

Actually, Tales of Destiny outsold Tales of Symphonia...


In Japan.  ToS was the first Tales game to experience much success outside of its local territory.   However, that's really just more support for my point that JRPG sales are in a steady decline.  



naznatips said:

Dragon Quest sells under a million worldwide outside of Japan. Shin Megami Tensei has never broke 1 million units sold worldwide.

The JRPG market has been shrinking at an easily trackable rate since FFVII, and this generation could represent as much as a 50% drop in sales for the genre as a whole. JRPGs are niche, even in Japan, other than a few main series.


You are a terrible, horrible person for reminding me of such hateful news. I don't mean that, but I do hate this. I'd love for my PS3 to provide me with the same amount of JRPG goodness as my PS2. Sadly, I'm nt so confident that'll be the case.

Also, are you sure DQ8 didn't sell 1m+ in EUR+US?



naznatips said:
ClaudeLv250 said:

 

Actually, Tales of Destiny outsold Tales of Symphonia...


In Japan. ToS was the first Tales game to experience much success outside of its local territory. However, that's really just more support for my point that JRPG sales are in a steady decline.


 This makes no sense If JRPG sales are falling, why isn't the same thing happening to WRPGs?



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naznatips said:
ClaudeLv250 said:

 

Actually, Tales of Destiny outsold Tales of Symphonia...


In Japan. ToS was the first Tales game to experience much success outside of its local territory. However, that's really just more support for my point that JRPG sales are in a steady decline.

Worldwide. Destiny did 1,139,000 LTD. So it wasn't the only smash hit in that series.


 



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Riachu said:
naznatips said:
ClaudeLv250 said:

 

Actually, Tales of Destiny outsold Tales of Symphonia...


In Japan. ToS was the first Tales game to experience much success outside of its local territory. However, that's really just more support for my point that JRPG sales are in a steady decline.


This makes no sense If JRPG sales are falling, why isn't the same thing happening to WRPGs?


Because Western RPGs and Japanese RPGs are barely even related... hence the reason I've been insistent on separating them.  I'm not some JRPG hater people.  I'm sure I'm among the biggest JRPG fans on this site, but I appreciate facts.

Also, thanks Claude, that's interesting.  I'll keep that in mind, but my statement holds true.  ToS sold almost as much as Tales of Destiny, but unlike Tales of Destiny 80% of its sales were made outside the Japanese market, whereas 80% of Tales of Destiny's sales were made in the Japanese market.  



Cause JRPGs are usually turn based and WRPGS are usually like Oblivion and Morrowind.

In fact, when people say JRPG they usually don't mean an RPG made in japan... they mean a turn based or semi turn based RPG.

It's kinda silly that WRPGs and JRPGS are even under the same category just because of stat games.  It would be like having Sports games and Space invaders in the same category because your main objective is to score points. 



Newsflash! WRPGs ARE the traditional RPGs. It doesn't get more traditional than Ultima, Wizardy, Baldur's Gate, Might and Magic, etc. Ultima and Wizardry were doing turn based combat before any JRPG. Dragon Warrior was directly influenced by such games.

Kasz216, how can WRPGs usually be like Oblivion when there is a whole history of games before that? I would say they are usually not like Oblivion or Morrowind.

Plus WRPGs usually adhere closer to pen and paper RPGs which were around before the video games.



ArtznCraphs said:
Newsflash! WRPGs ARE the traditional RPGs. It doesn't get more traditional than Ultima, Wizardy, Baldur's Gate, Might and Magic, etc. Ultima and Wizardry were doing turn based combat before any JRPG. Dragon Warrior was directly influenced by such games.

Kasz216, how can WRPGs usually be like Oblivion when there is a whole history of games before that? I would say they are usually not like Oblivion or Morrowind.

Plus WRPGs usually adhere closer to pen and paper RPGs which were around before the video games.


Because before they were called JRPS and WRGS they were called RPGS and ARPGS.

This new JRPG and WRPG bs just started up when games like Morrowind became popular and generally are used to replace the old RPG and ARPG tags.

Also the best Ultima game in my book is really more of an SRPG.   Ultima Exodus.