I 100% disagree with you about Mario. It's not a saga built off off multiple different franchases and games. Mario and later Super Mario have always been 2D/3D Platformers.

Mario Golf, Kart, Party, Tennis, Baseball, Strikers, etc are all spinoffs of the main series. While Mario, and other characters appear in these games, they are not a part of the main series mario games. You don't buy Mario Party expecting a Mario Platformer, just like you don't buy MGR expecting a Stealth Action MGS game.

Yoshi was introduced in Super Mario World 2 and has since developed a series of its own.

Donkey Kong was given his own series by Rare, with Donkey Kong Country and that franchise, while a part of the Mario World, is not a Mario main series saga. Mario is never present in the Donkey Kong franchise. Donkey Kong prior to Donkey Kong Country was a Mario franchise, as Mario back then was not a platformer, but an arcade series. (okay, let's ignore poor Donkey ;(

Paper Mario is a franchise Nintendo created after Square Enix made Super MArio RPG. It's not a main series Mario game, but a spinoff franchise, set in an alternate paper world (much like Metal Gear Ac!d).

Luigi's Mansion is a canon to Mario games because Boo is the villian, and Mario is captured.

Bowser is a main series Mario villian because he was introduced as one in Super Mario Bros, and Donkey Kong has not appeared in a Super Mario game in a long, long time, so he could very well still be a villain (or just an unstable monkey).

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As for your point about MGR, this is where we simply disagree. Metal Gear is no longer a saga or franchise on it's own, it became Metal Gear Solid when it shifted to 3D. We no longer see Metal Gear games, but Metal Gear Solid games now continue the story and plot of Metal Gear. This is analogous to how Super Mario Bros. took over for Mario Bros. Metal Gear Rising is not a replacement for Metal Gear Solid, nor is it an evolution of the franchise. It's a canon, a side story of Metal Gear Solid using MGS characters.

:P

But here's where you contradict yourself, using the Mario example. You say Mario (And later Super Mario)  is a 2D/3D platformer, and the rest is merely spin-offs.  Okay. Yet you say that Luigi's Mansion (A 3D adventure game about a plumber who goes capturing ghosts with a vacuum cleaner) with is canon, because there's characters from Super Mario in it. What? You are saying basically what I was saying about Metal Gear Rising. Metal Gear Rising is not Metal Gear Solid, as Luigi's Mansion is not Super Mario, yet if both are canon, both are part of the same saga!

Metal Gear Rising is not a replacement for Metal Gear Solid, nor a side story using MGS characters. Its a new series that carries on the story finished in Metal Gear Solid. Finished. Metal Gear Solid story in the Metal Gear universe is over. The fact that there's two Metal Gear Solid coming is because they're both prequels. A prequel that can only serve to explain unresolved things in a finished story. Metal Gear Rising keeps the plot of Metal Gear and while being a different genre and style of Metal Gear Solid, is an integral part of Metal Gear. It's a canon, but not a side story.

Actually I bought Mario Party because it was Mario  - not because it was "Party" genre, the same goes for Mario Kart and Mario Sports games - if it didnt have Mario I would of looked at it like any other sports/racing game.

In the case of Yoshi (which the creators mentioned Yoshi's Island was a prequel but no mention of Yoshi's Story which would put it in a alternate timeline but that is debatable I guess) I can understand however Donkey Kong Country was a separate series completely - you are confusing it with the original Donkey Kong like many others although I do agree they all take place in the same universe.

However what differs greatly from the Nintendo example is that Metal Gear Rising has "Metal Gear" in it simply because the Metal Gears do play a role in the game like in Metal Gear, Metal Gear Solid and in Metal Gear Rising. If the game didnt have anything to do with the other games, then they should of called it Raiden Revengenance Rising or w/e lol.

Incase you dont know what metal gear is : http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/Metal_Gear_%28weapon%29

What does it have to do with the Rising game (DO NOT READ IF YOU DONT WANT TO SPOIL A PART IN THE GAME) ? : http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/Metal_Gear_EXCELSUS

Mario may not been present in the DKC Series except for the little easter egg appearance he appeared in the end of DKC2 but Metal Gears still play a storyline role in Metal Gear Rising (again implying if you dont have prior experience to the series you probably wont know what the hell that is)

Also the Donkey Kong that appeared in "DONKEY KONG" arcade game is different from the Donkey Kong in DKC incase you didnt know.

The original DK: http://www.mariowiki.com/Cranky_Kong#Background

The New/Current DK: http://www.mariowiki.com/Donkey_Kong

As for your last part - doesnt matter, Metal Gear = Metal Gear Solid, same series - they just went with a nickname added to it cause of the transition to 3D, the main character from Metal Gear is Solid Snake, the main character from Metal Gear Solid is Solid Snake - the only difference to Rising is the main character is Raiden instead of Solid Snake because every game from now on unless they mess up the storyline will be a prequel (hence why Ground Zeroes takes place after Peace Walker which takes place before Metal Gear Solid).

If they do make a Metal Gear Solid 5 or a 6 - those will be prequels unless somehow they clone Snake who is originally a clone of Big Boss/Naked Snake. Metal Gear Rising if it does get a sequel will more than likely be a secondary replacement or a replacement sequel wise to the Metal Gear series.

MGR is canon to Metal Gear Solid, but not part of the main franchise/saga.

There, fixed. =P

I am not twisting your words. Metal Gear Solid is over. If Metal Gear Solid 5 were to be a sequel, then I'll eat my own words and praise you in my signature. But until a sequel to Metal Gear Solid 4 arrives, and it creates incongruences with Metal Gear Rising; then, and only then, you can say Metal Gear Rising is not part of the saga, but a side story.

Until that moment, Metal Gear Rising is part of the saga, because it carries on the story of the Metal Gear saga, and is built upon the closure of Metal Gear Solid 4.  There's Metal Gear Rising 2 planned already by the words of Kojima. If you played the game, you'll realize why it is canon, and why it is part of the saga.

Metal Gear Rising AND Metal Gear Solid are part of the Metal Gear Solid Series.

Crisis Core is part of the Final Fantasy VII Sub series which is part of the Final Fantasy series. universe

Mario Kart is part of the Mario Universe/collection/whatever you want to call it series. Anything else along with it are sub series.

DKC is a different series, didnt say it wasnt.

I never said Metal Gear Rising is a Metal Gear Solid game....I've been saying its a METAL GEAR game lol. They both are Metal Gear games, Metal Gear Ac!d is part of the series as well but like you (and what I said earlier) are non-canon.

We are pretty much agreeing on the same thing, you just dont realize it lol.

So...we've been aruging over nothing since we actually agree with each other....oh well it was enjoyable plus I got to learn more about the series that I have yet to play.....XD

Some people love great stories ;p

I should try it out soon! Maybe after I finish Cave Story+ and/or Darksiders next.