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Forums - Gaming - As a Nintendo fanboy,PS4 grafix blew my mind

DieAppleDie said:


Simple
I see bigger jump current gen to PS4 grafix than Wii to PS360 grafix
Killzone demo, if was realtime PS4 performance, blew my mind, is better than anything ive never seen on my i7 2600 8GB RAM 2GB grafix card PC


As a Nintendo fan, you literally haven't even seen the surface scratched of what Wii U could do graphically. So I wouldn't be jumping the gun AS hard as you seem ot be right now, over a demo that, by the way, regardless of what anyone is trying to say, WON'T look quite like that when the game actually comes out. If you care that much about graphics, might I suggest that Wii U will certainly provide you with some gorgeous games, given time.



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SubiyaCryolite said:
darkknightkryta said:
theprof00 said:
pezus said:
SubiyaCryolite said:
Sorry, couldn't resist

Uh, what. That is PC. Not "current gen". 

Not to mention running on a 1500$ computer.

Not to mention it doesn't even look anywhere near that when you play it on said $1500 computer.


Yes it does :)

But... it doesn't :P.  Though it was hard for me to get right in his face for where I am in the game.



ethomaz said:
FACTs

- The PS4 to Wii U graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to Wii.
- The PS4 to PS3 graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to PS2.
-


FACT: Those points you stated are completely wrong. Its ridiculous how bad your memory and factuality actually are.

 

Do you even have an HD TV? Or did that pass you by? Mabe you should refresh your memory and look at PS2 to PS3 screens.



Nem said:
ethomaz said:
FACTs

- The PS4 to Wii U graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to Wii.
- The PS4 to PS3 graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to PS2.
-


FACT: Those points you stated are completely wrong. Its ridiculous how bad your memory and factuality actually are.

 

Do you even have an HD TV? Or did that pass you by? Mabe you should refresh your memory and look at PS2 to PS3 screens.


Coming from someone who sees X as anywhere near the same league as Killzone Shadow Fall, that sure doesn't mean much.

A PS4 launch game like Killzone Shadow Fall, compared to PS3 games, have much farther draw distance, countless more animated assets on screen, reflection aplenty, crazy amount of polygons on screen, better and more dynamic lighting/shadowing, much better textures all around, all of that running at a constant 30fps at full 1080p resolution with proper AA. The PS3 struggled to run Killzone 2 at a constant 30fps at a native 1080i resolution (540p). 

So yeah, I'd say the leap is just as big as it was from PS2 to PS3. But since the graphics on the PS3 are already at a quality that is more than reasonable, you probably don't see the leap as much as when we went from PS2 to PS3.




Hynad said:
Nem said:
ethomaz said:
FACTs

- The PS4 to Wii U graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to Wii.
- The PS4 to PS3 graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to PS2.
-


FACT: Those points you stated are completely wrong. Its ridiculous how bad your memory and factuality actually are.

 

Do you even have an HD TV? Or did that pass you by? Mabe you should refresh your memory and look at PS2 to PS3 screens.


Coming from someone who sees X as enywhere in the same league as Killzone Shadow Fall, that sure doesn't mean much.

A PS4 launch game like Killzone Shadow Fall, compared to PS3 games, have much farther draw distance, reflection aplenty, crazy amount of polygons on screen, better and more dynamic lighting/shadowing, much better textures all around, all of that running at a constant 30fps at full 1080p resolution with proper AA. The PS3 struggled to run Killzone 2 at a constant 30fps at a native 1080i resolution (540p). 

So yeah, I'd say the leap is just as big as it was from PS2 to PS3. But since the graphics on the PS3 are already at a quality that is more than reasonable, you probably don't see the leap as much as when we went from PS2 to PS3.



What i think or dont think is irrelevant. You are stating as fact something that clearly isnt.

Though its funny how now it isnt "bigger than" but "comparable". Keep going and you will get there.

Factor in HD while at it and factor character detail, expressions, number of objects in screen at once. The PS2 was the weakest system of its gen and the PS3 is the strongest of its gen. The physics and animations you can pull on the PS4 and PS3 are comparable. Just because the textures have more detail and the lightning is better and it pulls a stable 60fps, doesnt make it in any way comparable to actually beeing able to perform HD graphics, physics and animations never before possible, aswell as huge living breathing worlds.

Try comparing GTA3 > GTA4/5 > Watchdogs. You cant say the leap from GTA4/5 to watch dogs max settings is anywhere near comparable to what we got from GTA3 and spin-offs to GTA4 and 5. And thus watchdogs also runs on current gen. Because the graphics engine is so similar. The only thing the new consoles add are raw power, not new tools that couldnt be used in this gen.



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Nem said:
Hynad said:
Nem said:
ethomaz said:
FACTs

- The PS4 to Wii U graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to Wii.
- The PS4 to PS3 graphical leap is bigger than PS3 to PS2.
-


FACT: Those points you stated are completely wrong. Its ridiculous how bad your memory and factuality actually are.

 

Do you even have an HD TV? Or did that pass you by? Mabe you should refresh your memory and look at PS2 to PS3 screens.


Coming from someone who sees X as enywhere in the same league as Killzone Shadow Fall, that sure doesn't mean much.

A PS4 launch game like Killzone Shadow Fall, compared to PS3 games, have much farther draw distance, reflection aplenty, crazy amount of polygons on screen, better and more dynamic lighting/shadowing, much better textures all around, all of that running at a constant 30fps at full 1080p resolution with proper AA. The PS3 struggled to run Killzone 2 at a constant 30fps at a native 1080i resolution (540p). 

So yeah, I'd say the leap is just as big as it was from PS2 to PS3. But since the graphics on the PS3 are already at a quality that is more than reasonable, you probably don't see the leap as much as when we went from PS2 to PS3.



What i think or dont think is irrelevant. You are stating as fact something that clearly isnt.

Though its funny how now it isnt "bigger than" but "comparable". Keep going and you will get there.

Factor in HD while at it and factor character detail, expressions, number of objects in screen at once. The PS2 was the weakest system of its gen and the PS3 is the strongest of its gen. The physics and animations you can pull on the PS4 and PS3 are comparable. Just because the textures have more detail and the lightning is better and it pulls a stable 60fps, doesnt make it in any way comparable to actually beeing able to perform HD graphics, physics and animations never before possible, aswell as huge living breathing worlds.

Try comparing GTA3 > GTA4/5 > Watchdogs. You cant say the leap from GTA4/5 to watch dogs max settings is anywhere near comparable to what we got from GTA3 and spin-offs to GTA4 and 5. And thus watchdogs also runs on current gen. Because the graphics engine is so similar. The only thing the new consoles add are raw power, not new tools that couldnt be used in this gen.

Yeah, funny how I wasn't the one who said the leap is much bigger. It is as big as it was between PS2 and PS3. Ethomaz is the one saying it is much bigger. And the judge is still out on that one.

Now, you seem to think that once it's HD, there's no meaningful differentiations that are valuable in any way. You couldn't be more wrong. 

Standard 480p resolution is 720x480. That means the console draws 345 600 pixels. While 16:9 ratio 480p is 854x480, meaning it renders a total of 409 920 pixels. 720p, the usual targeted resolution for the HD twins (although most games run at below this resolution) has a total of 921 600 pixels. While 1080p renders 2 073 600 pixels. More than twice the amount of the 720p resolution.

As you can see, the leap for each resolutions are roughly the same. 

That's only the resolution. Now, you mentioned tools and raw power... Obviously, even if the consoles didn't allow for new "tools" that couldn't be used during the PS3 gen, you still see that since the PS4 can handle a resolution leap as big as the one from 480p to 720p (PS2 to PS3) with the added amount of details that comes with it, the leap in power is most likely similar based on that alone. But since the PS4 does indeed allow the use of "tools" not possible on the PS3 since it has access to complete DX11 equivalent features set natively, your argument is rendered completely moot.

Finally, as I explained, you don't see the difference as much because the PS3's graphics are already awesome as they are. That doesn't mean the leap isn't there.
Developers this gen made a really awesome job with art design to work around the limitations of the hardware. When you watch the intro sequence of Killzone Shadow Fall, you see right away how big of a leap the PS4 brings, with all the detail you seen in the city below, the reflexion everywhere, the amount of particle effects, among plenty other things, but also of course, the fact that it doesn't struggle to stay locked at 30fps in full 1080p resolution. Twice the resolution the games on the current console run. It takes a huge amount of power to draw a game at that resolution, with that many assets and effects and to run the intricate physics and A.I. at a smooth vsynced frame rate...

Oh well, you mentioned Watch Dog... to compare with GTA... GTA on PS3 ran at a below HD resolution of 640p (720p on 360) and struggled to maintain its frame rate at 30fps (on either consoles)... Who knows how well Watch Dog will run on the PS4? And at what resolution? I suggest you use games we have actual info to base our comparisons on, rather than using games with mostly unknowns like you did which only suggests you are grasping at straws.

Also, based on your flawed logic, the PS2 gen and the XBox 360 didn't have a big leap in power between each other, since Jackson's KING KONG was available for both those console gens... It used the same engine, so these consoles' powers aren't significantly different. Right? -__-



Hynad said:
 

Yeah, funny how I wasn't the one who said the leap is much bigger. It is as big as it was between PS2 and PS3. Ethomaz is the one saying it is much bigger. And the judge is still out on that one.

Now, you seem to think that once it's HD, there's no meaningful differentiations that are valuable in any way. You couldn't be more wrong. 

Standard 480p resolution is 720x480. That means the console draws 345 600 pixels. While 16:9 ratio 480p is 854x480, meaning it renders a total of 409 920 pixels. 720p, the usual targeted resolution for the HD twins (although most games run at below this resolution) has a total of 921 600 pixels. While 1080p renders 2 073 600 pixels. More than twice the amount of the 720p resolution.

As you can see, the leap for each resolutions are roughly the same. 

That's only the resolution. Now, you mentioned tools and raw power... Obviously, even if the consoles didn't allow for new "tools" that couldn't be used during the PS3 gen, you still see that since the PS4 can handle a resolution leap as big as the one from 480p to 720p (PS2 to PS3) with the added amount of details that comes with it, the leap in power is most likely similar based on that alone. But since the PS4 does indeed allow the use of "tools" not possible on the PS3 since it has access to complete DX11 equivalent features set natively, your argument is rendered completely moot.

Finally, as I explained, you don't see the difference as much because the PS3's graphics are already awesome as they are. That doesn't mean the leap isn't there.
Developers this gen made a really awesome job with art design to work around the limitations of the hardware. When you watch the intro sequence of Killzone Shadow Fall, you see right away how big of a leap this gen brings, with all the detail you seen in the city below, the reflexion everywhere, the amount of particle effects, among plenty other things, but also of course, the fact that it doesn't struggle to stay locked at 30fps in full 1080p resolution. Twice the resolution the games on the current console run. It takes a huge amount of power to draw a game at that resolution, with that many assets and effects and to run the intricate physics and A.I. at a smooth vsynced frame rate...

Oh well, you mentioned Watch Dog... to compare with GTA... GTA on PS3 ran at a below HD resolution of 640p (720p on 360) and struggled to maintain its frame rate at 30fps (on either consoles)... Who knows how well Watch Dog will run on the PS4? And at what resolution? I suggest you use games we have actual info to base our comparisons on, rather than using games with mostly unknowns like you did that only suggest you are grasping at straws.

EDIT: Also, based on your flawed logic, the PS2 gen and the XBox 360 didn't have a big leap in power between each other, since Jackson's KING KONG was available for both those consoles... It used the same engine, so these consoles' powers aren't significantly different. Right? -__-


You just keep proving my point for me. The improvement the new gen brings is more stable resolution and fps. Its only raw power. That is exactly the point. Theres no new technology, there is only more powerful versions of the current tools. Instead of say 40 pixels you can do 80 pixels aka better textures. There is no clearly visible improvement like much better character models and animations. Yes, the models may be improved in texture resolution, but there is no distinguishable difference unless you grab a magnifying glass of look really closely at the TV. Now compare this to say the improvement on God of War's Kratos model from God of war 1/2 to God of war 3 and Ascension. That is a dramatic visible improvement. And its not the kind you need to look really closely at your TV to be able to tell.

Its a smaller improvement comparitively. There really is no case to the opposite. The proof is right in front of our eyes, literally speaking. The improvement of console specs has hit diminishing returns due to human limitations.



Everyone talks about graphics but how about ai and physics? Physics is what needs to be most improved from last gen to this gen. Battlefield started this with realtime destruction and I can only hope this gets better. Knack looks to be the leap for physics imo. Also so far resistance is the only game to have water that was dynamic and would have displacement depending on how something hits the water. For ex: A grenade would displace the water more than a bullet. That's what I want from next gen.



Nem said:

You just keep proving my point for me. The improvement the new gen brings is more stable resolution and fps. Its only raw power. That is exactly the point. Theres no new technology, there is only more powerful versions of the current tools. Instead of say 40 pixels you can do 80 pixels aka better textures. There is no clearly visible improvement like much better character models and animations. Yes, the models may be improved in texture resolution, but there is no distinguishable difference unless you grab a magnifying glass of look really closely at the TV. Now compare this to say the improvement on God of War's Kratos model from God of war 1/2 to God of war 3 and Ascension. That is a dramatic visible improvement. And its not the kind you need to look really closely at your TV to be able to tell.

Its a smaller improvement comparitively. There really is no case to the opposite. The proof is right in front of our eyes, literally speaking. The improvement of console specs has hit diminishing returns due to human limitations.

You need glasses if you really believe the bullshit you typed here. 



Nem said:

You just keep proving my point for me. The improvement the new gen brings is more stable resolution and fps. Its only raw power. That is exactly the point. Theres no new technology, there is only more powerful versions of the current tools. Instead of say 40 pixels you can do 80 pixels aka better textures. There is no clearly visible improvement like much better character models and animations. Yes, the models may be improved in texture resolution, but there is no distinguishable difference unless you grab a magnifying glass of look really closely at the TV. Now compare this to say the improvement on God of War's Kratos model from God of war 1/2 to God of war 3 and Ascension. That is a dramatic visible improvement. And its not the kind you need to look really closely at your TV to be able to tell.

Its a smaller improvement comparitively. There really is no case to the opposite. The proof is right in front of our eyes, literally speaking. The improvement of console specs has hit diminishing returns due to human limitations.

I don't prove your point. You're being in denial. ¬_¬

You stated that the graphical leap isn't as big as between the other generations. I illustrated that it is. What your eyes think is beautiful or not doesn't change that. The leap in power between the PS3 and the PS4 is still roughly the same as it was between the PS2 and PS3. I don't need a magnifying glass to see how much of a leap there is between the 2 gens. 

You mention character models in God of War 3. What you fail to realise is that Kratos and the bosses that are fought in constained areas were the only character models that had this amount of polygons and texture quality. On the PS4, with its power leap over the PS3, all character models and assets in the games can potentially have the same amount of polygons and detail as one another. The landscape will see the same kind of leap as well, where pop-ins will be much less noticeable than current gen, coupled with a much farther horizon point with details going much further than what you see on the PS3 and 360. All of which will come with much improved physics and lighting effects. Where games on the PS3 could have, for example, only 2-3 light source affecting the assets dynamically, the PS4 will manage a whole lot more than that. Unlike most of what you see on the current gen, where most lighting is pre-baked, the PS4 will render it dynamically on the fly... That's just examples.

But why am I arguing with you... You think X is comparable to Killzone Shadow Fall, and your eyes probably can't even see the foliage that's behind me on my avatar picture...