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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Wii U GPU Die Image! Chipworks is AWESOME!

Kaizar said:

Hey since you guys know so much about tech, then can you help me with this:

Now the GameCube has over 20 million Polygons

The Wii probably has somewhere from 50 to 100 million polygons

The 3DS GPU spec says it can do 15.3 million Polygons and the PS Vita GPU spec is said to do up to 35 million polygons in any one game

But both Handhelds have more better looking graphics then the Wii, and easily at that.

How is that possible?

I mean they look more detail and everything.

Is it the triangles are what?

 

This might help:

Rodea the Sky Soldier is made from the ground up for both the Wii version & 3DS version since 2010 I believe, and the Wii version went gold on June or July 2011, but the 3DS version is still in development.

And my comparisons besides the YouTube video in my signature are: "Pilotwings Resort VS. Wii Sports Resort" and "Monster Hunter 3 on 3DS vs. on Wii" and I guess also "Mario & Sonic 2012 olympics 3DS version VS. Wii version.


Because of the smaller screen size and newer architecture and shader capabilities. Also Vita has 133 million. The 35 million figure does not exist. Unless you are only counting 1 of the 4 cores.



Before the PS3 everyone was nice to me :(

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is this one of those... if you stare long enough you would see a bunny?



 

Chark said:
Kaizar said:

Hey since you guys know so much about tech, then can you help me with this:

Now the GameCube has over 20 million Polygons

The Wii probably has somewhere from 50 to 100 million polygons

The 3DS GPU spec says it can do 15.3 million Polygons and the PS Vita GPU spec is said to do up to 35 million polygons in any one game

But both Handhelds have more better looking graphics then the Wii, and easily at that.

How is that possible?

I mean they look more detail and everything.

Is it the triangles are what?

 

This might help:

Rodea the Sky Soldier is made from the ground up for both the Wii version & 3DS version since 2010 I believe, and the Wii version went gold on June or July 2011, but the 3DS version is still in development.

And my comparisons besides the YouTube video in my signature are: "Pilotwings Resort VS. Wii Sports Resort" and "Monster Hunter 3 on 3DS vs. on Wii" and I guess also "Mario & Sonic 2012 olympics 3DS version VS. Wii version.


Because of the smaller screen size and newer architecture and shader capabilities. Also Vita has 133 million. The 35 million figure does not exist. Unless you are only counting 1 of the 4 cores.


The 133 million is the rumor NGP Specs, and the PS Vita is not the NGP, nor does it have 1080p screen nor 1080p graphics like the NGP was said to be like at the time.

Plus that wouldn't add up because then it would be 140 million instead of 133 million which shows that 1 of these 2 hundred million comes from a wrong source for everyone about the Vita.

And either way it still wouldn't matter because it is still does not explain the 3DS, so I would still need a lot more details for an answer either way.

Plus the shader cores & triangles are where the 3DS outdoes the PS Vita by a gigantic margin, but we have seen the difference between the 2 Handhelds graphics and the 3DS does not look better nor miles better then the Vita.........so your answer wouldn't add up, because then the 3DS would be looking way better in graphics then Vita if your answer was the case.

So clearly theres something else most likely.

Heres a video on this link page:

http://nintendo3dsblog.com/lots-of-footage-from-the-3ds-version-of-sonic-all-stars-racing-transformed/

The person recording it has a bad camera when it comes to his or her cameras Frame rate as mention in the video.

Plus YouTube only streams 2D videos in 30 fps, but YouTube does stream their 3D videos in 120 refresh rate (60 fps per video stream)



Kaizar said:

Hey since you guys know so much about tech, then can you help me with this:

Now the GameCube has over 20 million Polygons

The Wii probably has somewhere from 50 to 100 million polygons

The 3DS GPU spec says it can do 15.3 million Polygons and the PS Vita GPU spec is said to do up to 35 million polygons in any one game

But both Handhelds have more better looking graphics then the Wii, and easily at that.

How is that possible?

I mean they look more detail and everything.

Is it the triangles or what?

3DS - PICA2000:

  • 400 MPixels/s @100 MHz
  • 1600 MPixels/s @400 MHz
  • 40 MTriangles/s @100 MHz
  • 160 MTriangles/s @400 MHz

VITA - SGX543MP4+ (4 cores):

  • 1000 MPixels/s @200 MHz per core
  • 35 MTriangles/s @200 MHz per core


Kaizar said:

Hey since you guys know so much about tech, then can you help me with this:

Now the GameCube has over 20 million Polygons

The Wii probably has somewhere from 50 to 100 million polygons

The 3DS GPU spec says it can do 15.3 million Polygons and the PS Vita GPU spec is said to do up to 35 million polygons in any one game

But both Handhelds have more better looking graphics then the Wii, and easily at that.

How is that possible?

I mean they look more detail and everything.

Is it the triangles or what?

 

This might help:

Rodea the Sky Soldier is made from the ground up for both the Wii version & 3DS version since 2010 I believe, and the Wii version went gold on June or July 2011, but the 3DS version is still in development.

And my comparisons besides the YouTube video in my signature are: "Pilotwings Resort VS. Wii Sports Resort" and "Monster Hunter 3 on 3DS vs. on Wii" and I guess also "Mario & Sonic 2012 olympics 3DS version VS. Wii version.

polygon count isn't that important in these - texture size, which is determined mostly by vram size and bandwith, and shader effects per pixel are way more important for good looking graphics

with tesselation polygons play a larger role again as polys dynamically are added the nearer you get to an object (it can be blown up to absurd amounts of polys), but none of the platforms you mentioned uses that



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Surprise surprise.

Nintendo have always relied on their own graphics technologies instead of other companies' engines, and of course their hardware is custom built for their way of doing things.

It's as some disgruntled 3rd parties say: Nintendo consoles are built for Nintendo games.

Nobody's made a game on Wii that looked better than Mario Galaxy, and chance is Nintendo will make the best looking Wii U games themselves, even with other studios having much more experience with "HD" asset creation.



Killy_Vorkosigan said:
So Basically, Ninty has modified the core hardware in such a way they are the only one able to code correctly a game. Again and again, their system is not open at all and it such a pain in the ass to some devs that they don't want to bother to reinvent the wheel (aka, relearn to program).

All in all, lazy devs again... If I remember correctly Factor 5, when they were working on Rogue Squadron games had a lot of suport from Ninty. Probably adaptation to the hardware.


Well you cant really expect the entire industry to change, just for Nintendo. They should adapt a bit, but it seems that they are just to stubborn. Lets wait and see if it all playes out as they expect.



Vote the Mayor for Mayor!

Podings said:
Surprise surprise.

Nintendo have always relied on their own graphics technologies instead of other companies' engines, and of course their hardware is custom built for their way of doing things.

It's as some disgruntled 3rd parties say: Nintendo consoles are built for Nintendo games.

Nobody's made a game on Wii that looked better than Mario Galaxy, and chance is Nintendo will make the best looking Wii U games themselves, even with other studios having much more experience with "HD" asset creation.


Are you calling Miyamoto a liar?

"The other point is that many of our third-party software developers have been dedicated to technologies like shaders. As Wii U is designed to bring out their real strengths, there have recently been more cases where we develop something with their help," said Miyamoto. "It has been more convenient for us to work together with them because they have been able to more smoothly utilize their know-how for development for Wii U."

http://www.videogamer.com/news/nintendo_in-house_has_almost_reached_the_next-stage_of_wii_u_development.html

He seems to think the GPU was designed to bring out the strengths of studios used to using shaders, and that their internal teams have been learning from third parties how to properly utalize the Wii U.



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oni-link said:
_crazy_man_ said:
DaRev said:
I can't believe I read all those comments - interesting read though.

Anyways, so will anyone be able tell the performance of the WiiU GPU just by looking it, or are we wasting our time? I would have thought that it would be like open heart surgery in that you just get a WiiU, cut it open and see what makes it tick. Can't someone simply hook it up to a machine or something and run some test?

Just by looking at it even experts can't get a proper read of its real time performance.  It's just that customized and hard to relate it to other known hardware to get a good guess.  More time is needed, I mean this hasn't even been known for 2 days yet, and we only know about 1/2 of what is on the die.  And the CPU die pic is on its way as well.

On the hooking it up to test its capabilities......

The best indicator for that would probably to have a Wii U dev kit, that or the tech to be able to read such things is expensive or not readily available.

Hence, the reason why the Wii U would still be able to hold it's own against the PS4/720 when it comes out.  When everything is said and done it'll be about the games and how those games are suited to the system.  This won't be another Wii vs PS360 gap I am sure of that.(I'm getting the 720 as my second system of choice after my Wii U)  One thing for sure is that this coming E3 will be telling as we will see what dedicated Wii U games could do against the much hyped PS4/720.

OK, thanks for both responses. I'm just glad it's not looking like Wii vs PS360 alover again.



Nintendo Network ID: DaRevren

I love My Wii U, and the potential it brings to gaming.

Lafiel said:
Kaizar said:

Hey since you guys know so much about tech, then can you help me with this:

Now the GameCube has over 20 million Polygons

The Wii probably has somewhere from 50 to 100 million polygons

The 3DS GPU spec says it can do 15.3 million Polygons and the PS Vita GPU spec is said to do up to 35 million polygons in any one game

But both Handhelds have more better looking graphics then the Wii, and easily at that.

How is that possible?

I mean they look more detail and everything.

Is it the triangles or what?

 

This might help:

Rodea the Sky Soldier is made from the ground up for both the Wii version & 3DS version since 2010 I believe, and the Wii version went gold on June or July 2011, but the 3DS version is still in development.

And my comparisons besides the YouTube video in my signature are: "Pilotwings Resort VS. Wii Sports Resort" and "Monster Hunter 3 on 3DS vs. on Wii" and I guess also "Mario & Sonic 2012 olympics 3DS version VS. Wii version.

polygon count isn't that important in these - texture size, which is determined mostly by vram size and bandwith, and shader effects per pixel are way more important for good looking graphics

with tesselation polygons play a larger role again as polys dynamically are added the nearer you get to an object (it can be blown up to absurd amounts of polys), but none of the platforms you mentioned uses that


Thanks, I'm starting to understand now, plus the 3DS has at least around 50 shader cores, so it makes sense now I guess.