From my experience, the main reason for people's belief in a Creator stems from the belief that a Creator is necessary since the universe must come from something. I personally don't agree with the reasoning, but I can at least understand where the belief comes from. What I don't understand is why some people believe in the characteristics below. Many of them just seem like unjustified assumptions to me.

Let's assume a Creator does exist; can someone please explain the reasoning behind the following beliefs?

1. The Creator is all-powerful - I sort of understand this. If something created everything, then it seems likely that it must have unlimited power. I think this is flawed thinking. If universe was created by a creator, that doesn't mean the Creator has the ability to create anything. Everything that exists could merely be the extent of the Creator's power. The Creator "only" created the universe. Maybe He lacks the ability to create anything else. We wouldn't be able to find out.

2. The Creator is all-knowing - I don't understand this at all. Just because a being started something doesn't mean they would forever know everything about their creation. It's possible that the Creator let his creation flourish without constant, absolute surveillance.

3. The Creator is all-loving - Again, I don't understand this belief at all. Why must a Creator love his Creation?

4. The Creator is everywhere - Just because He created everything, does that mean he has to be everywhere?

5. There's only one Creator - What's the logic behind believing in one Creator rather than multiple Creators?

6. The Creator has a plan for humanity -

7. Many more that I can't think of...

If you don't believe in some of these then just disregard them.

I'm not very interested in Biblical or religious sources of support, but you're free to use them I guess. I'm more interested in reasoning independent of religion, similar to the argument that a Creator is necessary for the existence for the universe. I may not agree with the reasoning but at least the logic of the reasoning can be argued, unlike religious principle being held as irrefutable truth.

The reason I ask this is because the existence of a Creator seems to be the most popular Creationist debate, but I don’t think it should be. The mere existence of a Creator has little implications on reality or how we should behave. What really matters is the characteristics of that Creator. Characteristics like the Creator having a plan, the Creator being all-loving, having a moral code, etc. are what have implications on reality and how we should behave.

Not only are these characteristics more important, but they also seem much less believable between the mere existence of a Creator imo; I don't see how anyone could label them as anything other than assumptions. Unfortunately people never get to debate these characteristics because they can never agree on a Creator's existence to begin with.

Well that's what this thread is for. Assuming a Creator does exist, what is the reasoning for the above characteristics? Faith? Assumptions? Logic? None at all?

"I'm not very interested in Biblical or religious sources of support-"


Well, whether you are interested or not, the answer is in the Bible. The characteristics that you bring up matches the Bible's description of the Creator. If we are talking about people who just believe in "a god", but who does not identify themselves with a specific religion, then the answer is still the Bible - as long as the characteristics are the same.

So, to answer you final question: There is no reasoning. People just follow the old traditions.

I believe in Christianity because I was raised in a Christian household, I agree with almost off moral choices that involve my religion, and when I pray to my "Creator" I feel something that is unexplainable. You are free to do as you please but you sound so worried in your OP. As if you're mad that others believe in something that you think is unbelievable.

All your questions can be answer with the following statement. God is beyond our understanding and exists beyond our perception.

I'm hoping to hear from Creationists who don't tend to use the Bible as their sole reasoning in debates. For example, many Creationists support their arguments using intelligent design or moral absolutism, which are based on some form of logic and not on religion. Many of these Creationists also believe in the characteristics I mentioned. So if they can argue for a Creator's existence without using the Bible, hopefully they can do the same for those characteristics.

If not, then hopefully they can at least acknowledge that their belief in those characteristics are less supported than their belief in a Creator (since the former is dependent completely on religion, while the latter is not). If they concede that their belief in those characteristics are unsupported, then they also concede that the existence of a Creator doesn't really matter.

But trust me, there will be a few people with arguments for at least some of them.

Because they use God to fill holes in their lives. They desperately want to know that there is a God that loves them, that there is something nice after death, that there is meaning to what they're doing.

The technical details just aren't important parts of that need.

I'm approaching these as theoretical discussions, my responses in bold italic above. Went with details on only the ones I could discuss without using biblical references.

main reason for peoples believe in a creator is surely not that someone is needed to create the universe(start the show)-this is not the real reason,this is just an excuse.
Main reason people believe in a creator is fear.Fear from the unknown.And fear from the end of the own ego.
As long as there is a creator there is still a chance to continue,to keep on living in another place,dimension,paradise.
Only few people really cared about how the universe was created,or why.
Few more really care about meaning of life.
But most are afraid to die,because they know this will happen anyway.
That's why "man created god"(that's the reason why god is supposed to have all the characteristisc powerhungry man wishes to have)-a god who will keep you alife after the reapers job is done.

1)noone can be all power full.impossible
Can god create a being that is more powerful than he is?
He can=he is not all powerfull,because he has less than 50% of all power to be able to create a more powerfull being
he can't=he is not allpowerfull because he does not have the power to create such a being

another problem:god allpowerfull(100%)=no devil possible(0% power)

more important is:if god is allpowerfull(100%)=0 %power for his creation=human being has no own will=not responsible for own mistakes=no possibility to change
2)all knowing=no need to create something.as you know everything you simply don't need the universe.
3)of course a creator can be all loving,but there is no need or proof that he/she is so.
4)you are right as long as you don't think that:
all is one and one is all.
5)one creator? pretty logical.
When you start to search the ultimate point of beginning you will realize that something must have been the 1st.
There must be the first living cell(starting point)
just like there was the 1st man on the moon or the mt everest.
Someone must have been the first,no matter how many gods or creators.

6)plan for humanity?
1st there was an evolution of the species(physical)-has happened

awareness maybe the next step:evolution of mind.has also happened(empathy,spirituality,living in harmony with nature and all that stuff)
but right now wrong direction(consume,greed,control,wasting time answering stupid questions in the internet instead of being usefull)

A all knowing all powerful entity would never create anything, because it has no limits.

What is the point of creating something when you already know you can do it and how it will turn out.

God certainly isn't all powerful, I challenged him to a duel once and beat him handily.