| Jay520 said: From my experience, the main reason for people's belief in a Creator stems from the belief that a Creator is necessary since the universe must come from something. I personally don't agree with the reasoning, but I can at least understand where the belief comes from. What I don't understand is why some people believe in the characteristics below. Many of them just seem like unjustified assumptions to me. Let's assume a Creator does exist; can someone please explain the reasoning behind the following beliefs? 1. The Creator is all-powerful - I sort of understand this. If something created everything, then it seems likely that it must have unlimited power. I think this is flawed thinking. If universe was created by a creator, that doesn't mean the Creator has the ability to create anything. Everything that exists could merely be the extent of the Creator's power. The Creator "only" created the universe. Maybe He lacks the ability to create anything else. We wouldn't be able to find out. If he created the universe, he would have to be at least as powerful as what he created (equal to the force of the big bang). This would mean that by the measures we can define (as we are constrained to this universe) he would be 'all powerful', or containing at least the level of 'power' that is exhibeted by the universe we are constrained to. 2. The Creator is all-knowing - I don't understand this at all. Just because a being started something doesn't mean they would forever know everything about their creation. It's possible that the Creator let his creation flourish without constant, absolute surveillance. All Knowing may not mean knowing every single tiny thing that goes on, but may refer to 'containing all knowledge' as we could define knowledge. If he created the Universe, he would in theory know everything about what he designed (in the same way an architect would know the intricate workings of a buiding he designed). 3. The Creator is all-loving - Again, I don't understand this belief at all. Why must a Creator love his Creation? He is also described as a father, so if this is an accurate comparison I'd assume he loves us because of that association. 4. The Creator is everywhere - Just because He created everything, does that mean he has to be everywhere? Think about it in the context of a two-dimensional being describing a three-dimensional being as being 'everywhere'. The being from the outside dimension could in theory see much more of the three dimensional world than the being trapped in the 2d world as he would have a different perspective. The three-dimensional being could 'be' or 'interact' with multiple places in the two-dimensional world and appear to be 'everywhere' or 'anywhere' he chooses at any time. If the creator is by definition outside time and space as we know it, he could theoretically interact with the dimensions we are constrained to in a similar way. 5. There's only one Creator - What's the logic behind believing in one Creator rather than multiple Creators? This one would go to biblical explanations, so I won't go there. 6. The Creator has a plan for humanity - As far as humanity as a whole, I believe there is a plan to redeem us as a species from our fallen state in the end, as well as an opportunity for individual redemption if we choose it now. I don't think there's a specific roadmap for each individual's life. 7. Many more that I can't think of... If you don't believe in some of these then just disregard them. I'm not very interested in Biblical or religious sources of support, but you're free to use them I guess. I'm more interested in reasoning independent of religion, similar to the argument that a Creator is necessary for the existence for the universe. I may not agree with the reasoning but at least the logic of the reasoning can be argued, unlike religious principle being held as irrefutable truth. The reason I ask this is because the existence of a Creator seems to be the most popular Creationist debate, but I don’t think it should be. The mere existence of a Creator has little implications on reality or how we should behave. What really matters is the characteristics of that Creator. Characteristics like the Creator having a plan, the Creator being all-loving, having a moral code, etc. are what have implications on reality and how we should behave. Not only are these characteristics more important, but they also seem much less believable between the mere existence of a Creator imo; I don't see how anyone could label them as anything other than assumptions. Unfortunately people never get to debate these characteristics because they can never agree on a Creator's existence to begin with. Well that's what this thread is for. Assuming a Creator does exist, what is the reasoning for the above characteristics? Faith? Assumptions? Logic? None at all? |
I'm approaching these as theoretical discussions, my responses in bold italic above. Went with details on only the ones I could discuss without using biblical references.
