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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Will Paper Mario ever be as good as it used to be?

 

Will it?

Nope its gone down the tubes. Thanks Miyamoto 26 33.77%
 
Yes, It will make a comeb... 31 40.26%
 
I Don't Know. 20 25.97%
 
Total:77

Paper Mario Sticker Star is my fav in the series. You fail dude



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Sticker Star is better than Super Paper Mario. It is pretty funny and the puzzles are enjoyable, if occasionally silly.

It's not as good as the N64 or GC games, but it is still a good entry. Takes a bit of time to get going though.



Yes.

www.spacemag.org - contribute your stuff... satire, comics, ideas, debate, stupidy stupid etc.

Pokemonbrawlvg said:
First off let me say this, I'm a huge Paper Mario fan. Paper Mario 64 is literally my childhood and probably one of the first RPGs I had sat down and enjoyed. I've probably played the game hundred times by now because it's so good.

TTYD is one of my favorite Gamecube games of all time. Best RPG on the Gamecube IMO.

Super Paper Mario is very unique title on the Wii. I actually liked it unlike some people. I thought it mixed the 2D side of the Super Mario Bros. series pretty well. It's not up there with 64 and TTYD, but it's a very good game in its own right.

Now, how about Sticker Star? I freaking love this game. A lot more than Super Paper Mario. The new Sticker works perfectly and the graphics are the best I've seen in the whole series. Yes, it's lacking in some places and the characters and locations are not as memorable. The music, battle system, and graphics are top-notched. But, that doesn't stop it from being a great game. I wish more people would attempt to play this game instead of branding it as a black mark on the series, it's really good.

In all, the series is still fresh and good. I think some fans are dismissing the game simply because it's not like 64 or TTYD, like Super Paper Mario. Let me tell you this, if you go into the game expecting it to be another TTYD, you'll be disappointed. It's not an RPG, like the other games. It's more like an action-puzzle game. Coming from a huge Paper Mario, I say Sticker Star is worthy of the Paper Mario name.

Are you Jim Sterling? Because I am thanking God for you.



Galaki said:
Nintendo, why you no change?
Nintendo, why you change too much?

The obvious solution Nintendo should take is to make a lot of changes and no change at all. That would make everyone happy.

Change the content. (Levels, enemies, story, music, graphics)

Keep the gameplay (genre, controls, mechanics)

Nintendo is a huge fan of changing the second while recycling the first. Not cool.

Fuck "time for a change".



Soleron said:

Change the content. (Levels, enemies, story, music, graphics)

Keep the gameplay (genre, controls, mechanics)

Nintendo is a huge fan of changing the second while recycling the first. Not cool.

Fuck "time for a change".

I can't wait to meet "that guy" who thinks every Kirby game since his original GameBoy debut is crap because they added a gimmicky core gameplay mechanic.

Will Nintendo ever make another REAL Kirby game that is just a 2D platformer, without the power-stealing-beat-em-up gimmick?



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the_dengle said:
Soleron said:

Change the content. (Levels, enemies, story, music, graphics)

Keep the gameplay (genre, controls, mechanics)

Nintendo is a huge fan of changing the second while recycling the first. Not cool.

Fuck "time for a change".

I can't wait to meet "that guy" who thinks every Kirby game since his original GameBoy debut is crap because they added a gimmicky core gameplay mechanic.

Will Nintendo ever make another REAL Kirby game that is just a 2D platformer, without the power-stealing-beat-em-up gimmick?

OK that is Rule 1, above.

Rule 2 is, if you introduce a new gimmicky thing and people LIKE it, but people also like the original, keep both as seperate series. 

So people who like Sticker Star can get more Sticker Star. And it doesn't fuck with my original Paper Mario. Like NSMB vs Galaxy.



Soleron said:
the_dengle said:
Soleron said:

Change the content. (Levels, enemies, story, music, graphics)

Keep the gameplay (genre, controls, mechanics)

Rule 2 is, if you introduce a new gimmicky thing and people LIKE it, but people also like the original, keep both as seperate series. 

So people who like Sticker Star can get more Sticker Star. And it doesn't fuck with my original Paper Mario. Like NSMB vs Galaxy.

Who is "people"? What determines whether "people" do or do not like something? How many "people" does it take liking something to keep it, or disliking something to eschew it -- one? or one million?

Who decides whether or not Sticker Star IS original Paper Mario? Let's go back to your former post. What is changed in Sticker Star? What is kept?

Content: Levels -- changed. Obviously.
Content: Enemies -- new enemies are a rarity in any Mario game.
Content: Story -- Mario games, even of the Paper kind, aren't exactly known for their compelling stories. But what they are known for that fits this category is their excellent writing, especially the witty dialogue. I would say that the clever humor is one of the defining characteristics of the Paper Mario series (and of all Mario RPGs); luckily, Sticker Star has it in spades.
Content: Music -- does it not have original music? Destructoid, at least, praised the game's score heavily.
Content: Graphics -- as with story, there is little leeway here. The paper-themed aesthetic is another defining characteristic of the series, probably the one thing above all else that makes the game stand out in a sea of JRPGs. In terms of visual fidelity, there isn't much more that can be done. The game looks great, and I don't think this is something you want to change?

Gameplay: Genre -- Sticker Star is a JRPG. I don't know what else to say about it.
Gameplay: Controls -- Surely you would accept some new controls in the transition from a GameCube controller to a 3DS? A little touchscreen implementation wouldn't hurt anything, would it? Anyway, you still use the analog stick to move around, the buttons do pretty much the same stuff, right? The controls haven't changed dramatically as they did when Zelda moved to DS?

That just leaves the mechanics, so let's get right into it. What mechanics does Sticker Star share with the first two Paper Mario games, and where does it differ? Well, the hub world of Sticker Star is pretty irrelevant. Imagine going to a fast travel screen every time you leave an area in the first two games, and you've got Sticker Star's hub world. It doesn't actually remove content or mechanics from the game.

Next, the actual overworld; there aren't any random battles, right? You still explore a paper-themed overworld crawling with Mario baddies who will attack you on sight. You solve paper-themed puzzles using the abilities or objects you've attained, engage in some very light platforming, and when you make contact with an enemy you are taken to a separate battle screen, where that enemy can turn out to be multiple enemies.

So, battles. They're still turn-based. You select your next move from a menu, some moves are more powerful than others, but have restrictions placed on how frequently you can use them. Once you have selected your move, you attack. If you correctly trigger the action command, a staple of the series, you can increase the damage you deal or decrease the damage you take (or receive some other benefit).

Like I said, it's a JRPG. It has standard JRPG mechanics. You (or some others) might feel that the partner system is absolutely essential to the Paper Mario series, and any game that does not feature Mario taking turns fighting alongside another character cannot possibly be a "real" Paper Mario game. I disagree. I believe the core elements of Paper Mario are the paper-themed aesthetic, the trademark humor (often also paper-themed), the adventure gameplay elements (again, often paper-themed...notice a trend here?), and JRPG battle system tied together by the implementation of action commands, a mechanic that rewards skillful timing, making the battles more engaging than your typical turn-based affairs.

Sticker Star has all of these things. It is a real Paper Mario game. It does not "fuck with your original Paper Mario." Your N64 cartridge and GameCube disc are right where you left them, un-fucked-with. This is a new game with the same heart that does a few things differently. Maybe you have found that the things removed in the transition were the real reasons you were playing the first two games. If that is the case, I wonder whether there wouldn't be other RPGs out there that would suit your desires much better than any Paper Mario game. If I spit into a room full of JRPGs I guarantee it would hit one that had a party system and that rewarded your victories with experience points. Those things did not set the first two Paper Mario games apart from others in the genre, and that is likely one of the reasons Nintendo doesn't feel bad about cutting them out of some installments.



Why are you people quoting me for? It not even possible.



the_dengle said:
...

Who is "people"? What determines whether "people" do or do not like something? How many "people" does it take liking something to keep it, or disliking something to eschew it -- one? or one million?

Sales, obviously. Sticker Star sold well. Paper Mario sold well. Therefore keep both.

Next, the actual overworld; there aren't any random battles, right? You still explore a paper-themed overworld crawling with Mario baddies who will attack you on sight. You solve paper-themed puzzles using the abilities or objects you've attained, engage in some very light platforming, and when you make contact with an enemy you are taken to a separate battle screen, where that enemy can turn out to be multiple enemies.

NO FUCK NO PAPER PUZZLES ARE NOT THE CORE GAMEPLAY

So, battles. They're still turn-based. You select your next move from a menu, some moves are more powerful than others, but have restrictions placed on how frequently you can use them. Once you have selected your move, you attack. If you correctly trigger the action command, a staple of the series, you can increase the damage you deal or decrease the damage you take (or receive some other benefit).]

No levels, no partners, actually no incentive to battle at all because no exp and no coins. Bosses aren't strategy they are do you have big X sticker.

Like I said, it's a JRPG. It has standard JRPG mechanics. You (or some others) might feel that the partner system is absolutely essential to the Paper Mario series, and any game that does not feature Mario taking turns fighting alongside another character cannot possibly be a "real" Paper Mario game. I disagree. I believe the core elements of Paper Mario are the paper-themed aesthetic, the trademark humor (often also paper-themed), the adventure gameplay elements (again, often paper-themed...notice a trend here?), and JRPG battle system tied together by the implementation of action commands, a mechanic that rewards skillful timing, making the battles more engaging than your typical turn-based affairs.

UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

Sticker Star has all of these things. It is a real Paper Mario game. It does not "fuck with your original Paper Mario." Your N64 cartridge and GameCube disc are right where you left them, un-fucked-with. This is a new game with the same heart that does a few things differently. Maybe you have found that the things removed in the transition were the real reasons you were playing the first two games. If that is the case, I wonder whether there wouldn't be other RPGs out there that would suit your desires much better than any Paper Mario game. If I spit into a room full of JRPGs I guarantee it would hit one that had a party system and that rewarded your victories with experience points. Those things did not set the first two Paper Mario games apart from others in the genre, and that is likely one of the reasons Nintendo doesn't feel bad about cutting them out of some installments.

UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

I could go into great detail about how you're wrong that it keeps stuff from the originals, because it doesn't, but I will not waste my time on someone who will not be persuaded because they happen to like the direction this game went in.

I hope all of your favourite game series get reduced to a bunch of gimmick puzzles you don't care for.



Soleron said:

NO FUCK NO PAPER PUZZLES ARE NOT THE CORE GAMEPLAY

No levels, no partners, actually no incentive to battle at all because no exp and no coins.

I could go into great detail about how you're wrong that it keeps stuff from the originals, because it doesn't, but I will not waste my time on someone who will not be persuaded because they happen to like the direction this game went in.

I hope all of your favourite game series get reduced to a bunch of gimmick puzzles you don't care for.

Guess you didn't actually read a single thing I said. Partners do not set Paper Mario apart from other JRPGs. Neither does gaining exp through battles to grow levels.

I didn't say Paper Puzzles are THE core gameplay. I said that Paper Mario as a series features (often paper-themed) adventure gameplay. Think of the paper-plane segments of TTYD, or the uses of the partners' abilities. Sticker Star uses the Thing Stickers. This is something that has been a part of the series since square 1, and that sets it apart from other JRPGs by actually giving you interesting ways to interact with the overworld -- like discovering that you can progress farther by turning to the side and squeezing through a paper-thin hole in the wall. Come see me again when you have learned the difference between adventure gameplay and puzzles.

I don't really care about Sticker Star. I haven't played it yet. I expect I will eventually, but I doubt I will like it as much as TTYD. It just seems like it's not as good a game in general. But that doesn't mean all of the changes made are evil and make it an illegitimate iteration of the series. It also doesn't make the new things it tried "gimmick puzzles."

You need to read this part again, because you don't seem to get the gist of what I was saying:

I believe the core elements of Paper Mario are the paper-themed aesthetic, the trademark humor (often also paper-themed), the adventure gameplay elements (again, often paper-themed...notice a trend here?), and JRPG battle system tied together by the implementation of action commands, a mechanic that rewards skillful timing, making the battles more engaging than your typical turn-based affairs.