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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Wii U 'Has A Horrible, Slow CPU' Says Metro Last Light Dev

The amount of sales wouldn't have been worth their time anyway.



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I agree with Corey. 4A Games is too small of a studio. They even said that just developing for PS3 was "enough effort as it is". The Wii U supposedly has an Out of Order CPU architecture compared to In-Order of PS3/360 and that would mean a significant effort to recode Metro Last Light specifically for the Wii U. As I said, even with 70 Million Xbox 360 owners, Metro 2033 didn't even sell more than 450,000 copies in 2 years.....ouch!! It's doubtful such a small developer could justify porting Metro Last Light and optimizing for it in such a short time frame before launch early next year.

As a side-note, there is a real explanation why some Wii U games look decent and run better than their PS3/360 versions while others like Mass Effect 3 and Batman AC exhibit frame rate issues and lag.

Here is list of games that are developed by their original developer team for the Wii U port and a list of games that outsourced their Wii U development.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=44453120&postcount=3853

The games that have been outsourced to a 3rd party and not ported by the main developer to the Wii U (Batman AC, Mass Effect 3, etc.) are all the ones that look worse, exhibiting frame rate issues on the Wii U. Why am I not surprised?

Bethesda has had major issues with porting Skyrim to PS3. This isn't new. When the developer puts little time to optimize for the hardware, doesn't have enough resources to do it properly or simply does a shoddy port (GTA IV or Dark Souls to the PC), the end result is poor performance/sub-par graphical characteristics, such as flickering shadows and missing textures.



BlueFalcon said:

I agree with Corey. 4A Games is too small of a studio. They even said that just developing for PS3 was "enough effort as it is". The Wii U supposedly has an Out of Order CPU architecture compared to In-Order of PS3/360 and that would mean a significant effort to recode Metro Last Light specifically for the Wii U. As I said, even with 70 Million Xbox 360 owners, Metro 2033 didn't even sell more than 450,000 copies in 2 years.....ouch!! It's doubtful such a small developer could justify porting Metro Last Light and optimizing for it in such a short time frame before launch early next year.


This is pretty much what I stated, the place were you are wrong is Metro 2033 came out over 2-3 years ago when the 360 had far less than 70 million units sold. Secondly, we cannot know how many digital sales there are as the game is only avalible on live right now.The game stopped being sold in retail stores long ago. And, finally, this is a niche game and the drama on here is more about whether this is a sign the Wii U will get terrible third party support or not. Most people are not even mad about not getting this individual game.

Digital sales would be great to have for all games, but we do not have it.



Well he's not the first to say the WiiU cpu could be a bottleneck.



hm, i don't know what to believe, all this talking for slow CPU and slow RAM, is Nintendo stupid or what?



don't mind my username, that was more than 10 years ago, I'm a different person now, amazing how people change ^_^

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dark_gh0st_b0y said:
hm, i don't know what to believe, all this talking for slow CPU and slow RAM, is Nintendo stupid or what?


given the success nintendo had with wii, which was more or less a gamecube, i wouldn't say they are stupid when wiiu is *not* a powerhorse. it has certain power and has a relatively low launch price so we can't expect very high performance.



BlueFalcon said:

I agree with Corey. 4A Games is too small of a studio. They even said that just developing for PS3 was "enough effort as it is". The Wii U supposedly has an Out of Order CPU architecture compared to In-Order of PS3/360 and that would mean a significant effort to recode Metro Last Light specifically for the Wii U. 


As long as Nintendo supplied good well optimised compilers an OoO CPU shouldn't take much developer effort to take advantage of. In fact it should make devs lives easier as Out of Order Execution basically means that the CPU can execute the next task in the queue if the current task is waiting for data to be fetched from cache or RAM, instead of stalling and doing nothing. 

OoOE basically trades execution performance for a smaller performance hit on complex or less optimized code (games especialy on consoles tend to use little of ether), and systems slower RAM. Code optimized for in order execution should still better optimized period as you will still get fewer cache misses etc which you still don't want on an OoO CPU it's just not as big a deal when it happens. OoO CPU cores are more complex (in terms of hardware) and are inherently slower thanks to the longer pipelines etc that are needed. And some errors when tasks that need to be executed in a certain order aren't do come up, but a good compiler and some code tweaks that most multithreaded code would need anyway should minimise those. 

That is how it was always explained to me anyway, and it has been a while since I really looked into it tho (I did do some quick fact checking while writing this post). And I never got close to programing anything complex enough for me to actually need to think about it ether.



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zarx said:
BlueFalcon said:

I agree with Corey. 4A Games is too small of a studio. They even said that just developing for PS3 was "enough effort as it is". The Wii U supposedly has an Out of Order CPU architecture compared to In-Order of PS3/360 and that would mean a significant effort to recode Metro Last Light specifically for the Wii U. 


As long as Nintendo supplied good well optimised compilers an OoO CPU shouldn't take much developer effort to take advantage of. In fact it should make devs lives easier as Out of Order Execution basically means that the CPU can execute the next task in the queue if the current task is waiting for data to be fetched from cache or RAM, instead of stalling and doing nothing.

OoOE basically trades execution performance for a smaller performance hit on complex or less optimized code (games especialy on consoles tend to use little of ether), and systems slower RAM. Code optimized for in order execution should still better optimized period as you will still get fewer cache misses etc which you still don't want on an OoO CPU it's just not as big a deal when it happens. OoO CPU cores are more complex (in terms of hardware) and are inherently slower thanks to the longer pipelines etc that are needed. And some errors when tasks that need to be executed in a certain order aren't do come up, but a good compiler and some code tweaks that most multithreaded code would need anyway should minimise those.

That is how it was always explained to me anyway, and it has been a while since I really looked into it tho (I did do some quick fact checking while writing this post). And I never got close to programing anything complex enough for me to actually need to think about it ether.

 

i think that ibm mainly offers the compilers and not nintendo ;)  they have more knowledge in compilers and know quite good what their cpu should be used like. the rest is well written.



dark_gh0st_b0y said:
hm, i don't know what to believe, all this talking for slow CPU and slow RAM, is Nintendo stupid or what?

Yup. All these parts slower than the PS3/Xbox360 yet somehow as a whole, it's faster. Witch craft, I say.



chocoloco said:
Mr Khan said:
chocoloco said:
Mr Khan said:

So we have this dev who is barely able to develop on PS3, working for a failing publisher, trying to scapegoat a new console to take light off their incompetence.

Next!

 

Dude, you would not have played this even if it was on the Wii U. It has a big following amongst survival horror and fans of unique shooters and the original is a unique classic. They are a small developer so I do not see why this snubs the Wii U. It is going to be a great sleeper hit for the systems the company has the resources to develop it for. I am so excited.

This snubs the Wii U because... they insulted the Wii U? I didn't insult the game, just them, for being insulting.

As far as I know, they made profit off of Metro 2033. They are hardly incompetant they just are a rare small publisher in Europe making a unique game. What he said about the Wii U may be true; I have not payed attention. Either way they have to use resources smartly and if that means not publishing it on the platform with the smallest base it easily could be a move to keep themselves from failing.

http://www.joystiq.com/2010/05/05/metro-2033-has-been-very-profitable-for-thq-ceo-says/

They certainly did make a decent profit off of it.   It was a pretty big hit in Eastern Europe and Russia.

Getting this game on a console wouldn't be doing this game justice, even know I plan on getting a Wii U I will still be getting this game on PC.  This game is pushing the bar in graphics.