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Forums - Gaming - DEAR VIDEO GAME JOURNALISTS......

TheBardsSong said:

I think this guy has it all wrong. The problem isn't that the ports aren't 1:1 with the console releases, the problem is they do nothing to make up for the fact they're butchered ports of an existing console game. The most successful handheld "ports" are always unique to the platform, they do something completely original instead of trying to imitate the console experience, directly porting from more capable consoles is always a terrible idea.

Also, I think Call of Duty: Black Ops Declassified's criticism is more than justified. GameSpot did a demo of it and within the first minute they ran into a glitch that prevented them from leaving a doorway. The game also just generally looked incredibly dull and uninspired.


Which Vita port was butchered?



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RolStoppable said:
F0X said:

85. Would be higher if WayForward wasn't such a sellout.

If they were an indie developer and got their game rated on the indie-scale, then I am sure it would have gotten at least a 125.


Probably. Either way they got some nice extra points for managing to make the first game vindicated by history.



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RolStoppable said:
forevercloud3000 said:

..........? Are you serious or are you pulling one of your awkward/backwards humor gags on me? Sound Shapes, regardless of its price has about as much content as a full retail game. I just looked up NSMB2 walkthrough and basically says the game consists of 9 Worlds with about 5-10 levels in each, lets just say 90 playable worlds and collectables. Sound Shapes has 12 Worlds with about 5 levels in each except the last which has about 10. Thats about 65 levels + collectables + the User Generated stuff which makes the possibilities endless. Quality of either is not the issue here, only the way each of them is portrayed by the reviewers.....one is more scrutinized even tho it's better by their admittion.

I admit that I had never watched a gameplay video of Sound Shapes before I had written my previous post, so let me correct myself.

NSMB2 and Sound Shapes aren't close in quality, period.

Sound Shapes looks like a flash game. I didn't even realize the magnitude of the insult in that Eurogamer editorial before. This is just terrible. If someone likes to play Sound Shapes, more power to them. But pretending that you get anything close to a Mario title with this game is sick and wrong.

Sound Shapes was made by an indie developer, right? Because that would explain the score.

Soooooooooo what you are saying right now is NSMB2 is higher in quality simply because SS's aesthetic design? The flash look is entirely on purpose and yes that means it was a lot cheaper to make but doesn't mean it is of less quality. If anything it only shows value.....which is right on the money with it's cheaper price.

For example, Angry Birds is of great Quality and does exactly what a game like that should. Its Value on the other hand dictates it should be priced cheap to free, as no one would bat an eyelash at if for $40 but for $2 its a steal.

You forget that NSMB2 is just another sidescroller in the very long line of 2D sidescrollers in the series. By your logic, LBP Vita and almost any other Vita retail title are 12/10s because their budgets are assuredly larger than NSMB2 and most other games on 3DS.



      

      

      

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forevercloud3000 said:

As for it bbeing Sony's fault for the confusion, I call false. Yes, Sony's advertisments claim "Console like quality on the go", but that doesn't say treat it like it's a console game, because it obviously isn't. There is that "like" in there, does not say it "IS".This could mean many things. I think it refers most with the fact Vita can have almost any input the PS3 could have and then some, as well as the graphics are comparable. Meaning the system doesn't have to sacrifice design quality due to silly handheld limitation like lacking a second analog.

You see names like Uncharted and Assassin's Creed and you immediately deem them as wannabe console games, when both are very fair attempts at the portable design philosophy and retaining the originals charm. Mario/Zelda started on console as well, but it doesn't get lambasted every time it moves to handheld.


Yet they are wannabe console games.  In the end they take a design tailord to an amazing HD experience, condense it, shove it into a hand held, add almost no extra features and a few gimmiks and call it a day.  In fact, its the fact that they had lower standards on a ahand held that got Uncharted:Golden Abyss such a high score in the first place.

 

Mario/Zelda started on home consoles, but ANY move to a handheld is tailor done to that system.  Super mario 3D Land made a 3D mario that would never exist on a home console because of its emphasis on smaller levels and using 3D as an important factor.  Zelda, instead of making bigger and bigger more cinematic games, made mostly 2D Zelda games until the DS came out.  When the DS came, it used the tried and tried art style of the Wind Waker along with once again, smaller more easaliy jump in and jump out temples and just a different expereince from Zelda completely.

The ideas stated in the article are messed up.  When you make a new game for a dedicated handheld, and when you take a game port it and have get crippled in the process, most people would prefer the new game.  If you can't port it properly don't call it a PS3 on the go. 



Fireforgey said:
forevercloud3000 said:

As for it bbeing Sony's fault for the confusion, I call false. Yes, Sony's advertisments claim "Console like quality on the go", but that doesn't say treat it like it's a console game, because it obviously isn't. There is that "like" in there, does not say it "IS".This could mean many things. I think it refers most with the fact Vita can have almost any input the PS3 could have and then some, as well as the graphics are comparable. Meaning the system doesn't have to sacrifice design quality due to silly handheld limitation like lacking a second analog.

You see names like Uncharted and Assassin's Creed and you immediately deem them as wannabe console games, when both are very fair attempts at the portable design philosophy and retaining the originals charm. Mario/Zelda started on console as well, but it doesn't get lambasted every time it moves to handheld.


Yet they are wannabe console games.  In the end they take a design tailord to an amazing HD experience, condense it, shove it into a hand held, add almost no extra features and a few gimmiks and call it a day.  In fact, its the fact that they had lower standards on a ahand held that got Uncharted:Golden Abyss such a high score in the first place.

 

Mario/Zelda started on home consoles, but ANY move to a handheld is tailor done to that system.  Super mario 3D Land made a 3D mario that would never exist on a home console because of its emphasis on smaller levels and using 3D as an important factor.  Zelda, instead of making bigger and bigger more cinematic games, made mostly 2D Zelda games until the DS came out.  When the DS came, it used the tried and tried art style of the Wind Waker along with once again, smaller more easaliy jump in and jump out temples and just a different expereince from Zelda completely.

The ideas stated in the article are messed up.  When you make a new game for a dedicated handheld, and when you take a game port it and have get crippled in the process, most people would prefer the new game.  If you can't port it properly don't call it a PS3 on the go. 

Oh Please do tell how NSMB2 is somehow different then NSMB Wii, or how Super Mario 3D Land is doing things not possible in Mario Galaxy, or how Zelda OoT is not an exact remake of Zelda OoT because I have to see this when the horse shit starts pouring out of your mouth and ears.

The Vita Uncharted,AC, etc are no more downported console wannabes than all of the 3DS games are. Like I stated before, the Vita entries developed them exactly how they should be in a handheld arena. Smaller missions yet still plenty of them for the long haul, utilize handheld exclusive functions, etc. 3DS games are not magically different, other than the fact these were based of HD games and we have yet to see an HD mario.



      

      

      

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forevercloud3000 said:
F0X said:
forevercloud3000 said:

I'm not seeing how that is benefitial to anyone. 3DS is never compared with Wii or god forbid the WiiU. It is compared to DS,PSP, and Vita whom are it's peers. When a reviewer says "This game could have been don on DS", that is a valid point to make if they feel that way. Yet if they were to start saying "This Mario game pales in comparison to Super Mario Galaxy WiiU", that is ridiculous.

Lets be honest here, when it comes to portable gaming, consumers are far more lenient on what is appropriate. Mostly because the games are much cheaper than full console games(or at least should be) and we only need them to amuse for shorter burst of time. So when consumers see these review scores, because we all know most don't even read them, they are guaging them for that basis. When you rate a portable game a 6/10 consumers thoughts go "Oh.......this must be a really bad game......for a handheld". The key part being "for a handheld", they think that score is propriated in relation to what handheld games should be, not console gaming.

The problem here is that games for Vita, in a perfect world, are a 8s and 9s for what they are in the portable arena, yet if you throw them against AAA titans they appear to be 4s and 5s. Not a fair comparison, and its almost being done on purpose in order to drum up hits from all the rage.


Good thing you qualified that statement with "in a perfect world", because I would tear it up more effectively than scissors on paper.

I was making something of a joke earlier, partly in hopes you'll go even further in defending your position so I can better understand it, and therefore better argue against it. It worked.

Anyway, Sony brought this on themselves. They're literally marketing the Vita as a provider of "console gaming on the go", which is pretty much an open invitation to console game comparison. To make matters worse, games like Uncharted or Assassin's Creed don't make full use (or improperly use) Vita's unique features, which in my opinion harms the case for their existence. Why make a Vita game that doesn't play to the platform's strengths? Simply trying to recreate a console experience is not enough. Instead, it would be much better for Sony to focus on exclusive games for Vita and then give them console-quality (or nearly so) presentation, and preferably not use an IP that's better off sticking to consoles. LittleBigPlanet is a great example of an IP that worked perfectly well with Vita's features and portability. It should be a model for all future Vita games to come.

Once Vita stops trying to be a "portable console" and really starts being a "dedicated handheld" like the 3DS, then I can imagine fairer comparisons made. If not, at least Vita will have better games.

Your statements prove you have not played Assassin's Creed III: Liberations, Uncharted:Golden Abyss, or probably any of the recent Vita games.

ACIII:L is built around short burst missions, doesn't do too much dueling with ACIII's story as not to cause continuity issues, uses touch for only the most effecient of things (like swiping the back pad to pickpocket, touch targeting enemies for chain kills, and menu options), Aveline is a well crafted character with a lot of personality, doesn't dwell on a lot of exposition so gameplay isn't impeded. Not to mention adds an entire new layer of mechanics with the Personas. Only downside I can say of ACIII:L is the ridiculous camera use where you have to put it up at a light but no light in my house seems to be bright enough, or small glitches every now and then with enemy/treasure placement.

Uncharted GA is similar and i would put them at the same level. Missions are short burst, concentrates on puzzles and collectables much more than console versions (which I like), etc. Dislikes would be the less than ND level story,same camera/light trick crap, pulling doors open with tough way to often.

Both of these games are assuredly in 8 range for a portable system, especially when taking into consideration that they do almost look like console games visually.

...............

As for it bbeing Sony's fault for the confusion, I call false. Yes, Sony's advertisments claim "Console like quality on the go", but that doesn't say treat it like it's a console game, because it obviously isn't. There is that "like" in there, does not say it "IS".This could mean many things. I think it refers most with the fact Vita can have almost any input the PS3 could have and then some, as well as the graphics are comparable. Meaning the system doesn't have to sacrifice design quality due to silly handheld limitation like lacking a second analog.

You see names like Uncharted and Assassin's Creed and you immediately deem them as wannabe console games, when both are very fair attempts at the portable design philosophy and retaining the originals charm. Mario/Zelda started on console as well, but it doesn't get lambasted every time it moves to handheld.


Oh, I can see that Uncharted is in the 8 range thanks to Metacritic. I guess that review scores were absolutely fair for that one.

As for Liberation, you have proven to me that the game doesn't have much ties to the main series and doesn't maintain the quaility of plot or combat of the console games. I can see why reviewers were disappointed by a console point of view, but from a handheld point of view, I'm sure it's an acceptable, occasionally buggy Assassin's Creed Pocket Edition.

No matter what, my point isn't that the franchises in question haven't made adaptations (or concessions depending on the point of view) to exist on Vita. The point is to say that they are not the best candidates for adaptation, and if they were adapted to meet the potential of Vita, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Mario had difficulties adjusting to handhelds, as well as many other popular franchises at the time. Zelda was released much later in the GameBoy's lifespan, and by that time Nintendo had a good idea of what makes an excellent handheld experience. The result was a game very different in structure and design from its console bretheren, yet retaining hallmarks of its series, genre, and charm. It was also executed near-flawlessly, which is far more than I can say for Liberation, Golden Abyss, or even Resident Evil: Revelations on the 3DS. Adaptation to a portable system isn't easy, nor is it even desireable in some cases (I'm reminded of Grand Theft Auto: Chinatown Wars and all its glowing critical acclaim). So I argue that the best step forward is to be more selective of which IPs get an exclusive Vita game, so that the ones best suited to the platform actually make it on the platform. LittleBigPlanet was a good choice, I say. You know what would trump all of that? New IP, or a franchise reboots that might as well be new IPs. I've heard rumors of a Syphon Filter game exclusive for Vita, which in my honest opinion would be very good at showcasing what can be done on the system that other systems, not even home consoles, can't (or at least probably shouldn't).

There's no "like" in Sony's ads. If Sony is indeed saying that graphics are enough to claim that Vita offers "console quality on the go", then fine. But I'd also wish that they'd be more specific.



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Oh, so all the negative reviews for the game were just consequence of Activision not sending free copies to magazines before release. I get it now: having to pay for the game led every single journalist to take revenge, it's obvious!

Also, reviewers are biased because they don't understand that Sony didn't really mean it when they said "console quality on the go". They need to read between lines!

And, and... It shouldn't matter if a game is much worse than a very similar kind of game on consoles, because is a handheld! The Vita is a handheld, and as such, every single game should receive extra points. But not in the case of the 3DS, the 3DS sucks! Rehashes of Mario games and Angry Birds!!! hahaha LOLOLOL XDXDXD IT SUCKS IT SUCKS!!!



*sigh* Can't believe this guy (Buramu) is 36 years old. Such a fanboy... What is even more unbelievable is that Yoshida thanked him for being an idiot. The last part of his response is shameless: "Good point on how Vita games often compared to console games." Isn't that what you wanted hypocrite-san???



Naninho said:
Oh, so all the negative reviews for the game were just consequence of Activision not sending free copies to magazines before release. I get it now: having to pay for the game led every single journalist to take revenge, it's obvious!

Also, reviewers are biased because they don't understand that Sony didn't really mean it when they said "console quality on the go". They need to read between lines!

And, and... It shouldn't matter if a game is much worse than a very similar kind of game on consoles, because is a handheld! The Vita is a handheld, and as such, every single game should receive extra points. But not in the case of the 3DS, the 3DS sucks! Rehashes of Mario games and Angry Birds!!! hahaha LOLOLOL XDXDXD IT SUCKS IT SUCKS!!!



*sigh* Can't believe this guy (Buramu) is 36 years old. Such a fanboy... What is even more unbelievable is that Yoshida thanked him for being an idiot. The last part of his response is shameless: "Good point on how Vita games often compared to console games." Isn't that what you wanted hypocrite-san???


The Vita should change their slogan to

Console quality on the go.*



RolStoppable said:
forevercloud3000 said:

Soooooooooo what you are saying right now is NSMB2 is higher in quality simply because SS's aesthetic design? The flash look is entirely on purpose and yes that means it was a lot cheaper to make but doesn't mean it is of less quality. If anything it only shows value.....which is right on the money with it's cheaper price.

For example, Angry Birds is of great Quality and does exactly what a game like that should. Its Value on the other hand dictates it should be priced cheap to free, as no one would bat an eyelash at if for $40 but for $2 its a steal.

You forget that NSMB2 is just another sidescroller in the very long line of 2D sidescrollers in the series. By your logic, LBP Vita and almost any other Vita retail title are 12/10s because their budgets are assuredly larger than NSMB2 and most other games on 3DS.

No, I am saying SS is of low quality, because it screams low quality in all of its aspects. This is the kind of game where even free seems expensive, because it would cost you time to play it. This has nothing to do with production costs, it's all about entertainment value (or perceived value). When looking at SS, the first thing that came to my mind is that I could play much better games than that. It's the exact same thing I thought when watching a video of VVVVVV which is available on the 3DS eShop. This is the kind of game that is suited for people who see the word "indie" as a term of approval.

I know there are people who like indie games, but putting these games on the same level as Mario is... well, it's just wrong. Compare them to other downloadable games first before you draw comparisons to the top dog of the entire genre. Shantae: Risky's Revenge has already been mentioned in this thread, that's a DSiWare game that sells for $12. It's leaps and bounds ahead of Sound Shapes (graphics, sound, design, depth).

If you don't like the game, that is your opinion. But back to what we spoke of before, that reviewer stated he DID think SS was a better game than mario........yet rated it lower. Doesn't make sense. Its value has nothing to do with the score because prices change constantly.



      

      

      

Greatness Awaits

PSN:Forevercloud (looking for Soul Sacrifice Partners!!!)

Soooo just like in every other thread, the "Vita is Doomed" brigade comes in just for the shits and giggles and stir up trouble. All you have is your jokes and riducule but no decisive argument that can't be shot down in seconds. Looking @ you JWeinCom and Naninho

Obviously you didn't really even read the article. He does not seriously blame scores on not sending out review copies, rather he was being cheeky about it. Grow up.



      

      

      

Greatness Awaits

PSN:Forevercloud (looking for Soul Sacrifice Partners!!!)